Owen Hart

[Grimmas]

Discuss here.

[BillThompson]

He, along with Matt Hardy who I'll be nominating at some point, are possibly the two guys on my list who I can see most others going, "Uh, no" over. In the case of Owen it's really his late career stuff that allows him to make my top 100. Watching him get interesting matches out of the very green Edge or the very pedestrian Shamrock were the final notch on the belt of him being a very diverse worker who could do comedy, serious, shoot, high flying, technical, etc. and do it with anyone while making his opponent look like a million bucks as well.

[Loss]

I think Owen has as good of a chance of being in my bottom 50 as anyone else. He was quite possibly the best guy in the WWF at constructing TV matches in the mid-90s. It was either him or 1-2-3 Kid. He also has the Bret match at Wrestlemania X to his credit, which is as good as almost any match to happen stateside in the 1990s. There's also the 10-man tag at Canadian Stampede where he played a huge role. The Vader match at One Night Only. The Michaels match at the February 1996 In Your House. The Shamrock matches at Fully Loaded and Summerslam 1998. The Austin match at Summerslam 1997, which was pretty great before Austin was hurt.

 

His chemistry with Shawn Michaels shouldn't be overlooked either. All stuff worth checking out.

 

Owen Hart vs Shawn Michaels (08/08/93, All American)

Owen Hart vs Shawn Michaels (08/12/96, RAW)

Owen Hart vs Shawn Michaels (12/29/97, RAW)

 

He also had a few strong one-off matches against guys like 1-2-3 Kid and Bam Bam Bigelow sprinkled through that time period.

 

If he has a weakness, I think it's that early in his career, his stuff didn't always look "hurty" enough. He was graceful but didn't really pack much impact. You see the Shamrock match at Fully Loaded and realize he totally has that in him though.

[Lee Casebolt]

I've dropped the "what if" card for Dustin and Lex, but now that I think about it, Owen is a better candidate. He doesn't fall doing a stupid stunt, and we get to see him in a regular program with Benoit or Eddie or Rey? Shit, he'd only be 49 today. Another decade, at least, of work, mostly with superior talent?

[BigBadMick]

I've watched loads of 1996-97 WWF lately and Owen has skyrocketed in my opinion. Forgot how good he was, and how crucial he was to keeping match quality decent.

[flyonthewall2983]

I've dropped the "what if" card for Dustin and Lex, but now that I think about it, Owen is a better candidate. He doesn't fall doing a stupid stunt, and we get to see him in a regular program with Benoit or Eddie or Rey? Shit, he'd only be 49 today. Another decade, at least, of work, mostly with superior talent?

 

An Owen Hart-Eddie Guerrero program in that era of WWE would have been equally entertaining outside the ring as it was in.

 

Don't forget Kurt Angle, who I think was in one of Owen's last matches.

[peachchaos]

I have no idea where to place Owen at this point. He is easily one of my favorite guys to watch, but his resume seems very thin.

He won't make the list based on the Great Match Theory. Does he make it based on consistency? I've put together a playlist of stuff outside of his King of Hearts run:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLOB9m8GniF3vqy9Q0d4mmrUDJH9hI-mkS

[Parties]

He doesn't make it for me at all, and I think the tragic circumstances and the nostalgia that many fans our age have for mid-90s WWF have overstated his legend a bit, but the "What If?" of him working in WWF with Benoit, Regal, Finlay, Jamie Noble, Eddy, Brock, and Cena is really interesting. Feels like the Rock would have loved him too. I doubt he'd have been given many opportunities (save Smackdown/Velocity type stuff), but it would help his case for sure. There's nothing he does that I don't prefer from Bret, but when motivated he was a very entertaining and affable guy to watch.

[Dylan Waco]

I will say this for Owen - I would rather watch Blue Blazer matches v. Red Rooster, Barry Horowitz, Tim Horner, or even Greg Valentine, than just about any Hart Foundation tag. In fact I'd rather watch the LA match against Barry and the Greg match from 89 above EVERY Hart Foundation tag.

 

I'm not sure I can really argue that Owen should be above Bret, but I find something charming about Owen's performances that I don't always feel for Bret. I would't call Bret a BAD role player, but I think Owen was uniquely tooled to be really good as a utility guy who could play various roles well and deliver in the ring more often than not.

[Johnny Sorrow]

I think Owen was a far better performer than Bret. Owen could play roles and had personality. He was by far the better actor .

[JerryvonKramer]

Does anyone remember "nugget"?

[Loss]

I don't know -- it almost feels like the Wrestlemania X match is great enough and tells us everything we need to know about Owen, with anything else just being gravy. I've always felt that way for some reason, even though I'm not sure I could hang anyone else's rep entirely on one match like that.

[Slasher]

I've dropped the "what if" card for Dustin and Lex, but now that I think about it, Owen is a better candidate. He doesn't fall doing a stupid stunt, and we get to see him in a regular program with Benoit or Eddie or Rey? Shit, he'd only be 49 today. Another decade, at least, of work, mostly with superior talent?

Doubt it. Even though Owen was relatively young at the time of his death, he was definitely winding down in his career. It has been said a few times he was ready to look at a life post-wrestling and maybe becoming a firefighter instead. He was miserable to be away from his family and he seems to be the most normal Hart of the whole bunch so I can believe him stepping away to do the family man thing. The latest I'd see him still wrestling would be 2001.

[Gregor]

Owen seemed to connect with WWF fans even through 1998, when a whole new group of people were watching and he was doing stuff like feuding with Steve Blackman. They got on his case way more than they did with guys like Big Bossman or Ken Shamrock. I don't know if he was just that good as a character or if they sort of viewed him as their own, with him being one of the only New Generation guys still around. When I last went back and watched stuff from that time, he was still fun, even if it didn't feel like he was putting his heart into it anymore.

[Slasher]

I am not saying he wasn't getting over or wasn't connecting. I am saying he would have walked away with no regrets free and clear to be a family man. You don't have to wait until the fans tire of you to retire. Look at CM Punk. He was still over and was still one of the more popular wrestlers on the roster...and he walked away. In fact, Owen was at odds with the creative team in his last year or so. They resorted to fucking with him by trying to book romantic angles involving him and him refusing or resisting their ideas. This is why the Blue Blazer stuff happened. They wanted to dump on him with that gimmick, but being the pro he was and being so talented, he got it over enough they decided to give him a sincere push with it. I have no doubt that the very first opportunity he would have had after that, he would walk. But alas...we know what happened. He just wasn't happy with being in wrestling anymore. But again, he was such a good pro he didn't let that bleed over into his work. That is why I doubt that he would be a 49 year old recent retiree. If anything the best I would have expected is a bit more physically active version of Bret's role. He might have reappeared again in like 2008 after 6 or 8 years away, to do a short term angle here and there, for nostalgia's sake, for fun, and nothing more. We weren't going to talk about the cool Owen/Eddy series from 2005 because he would have already been long gone by then IMO.

[Gregor]

Sorry about that, I didn't mean to sound like I was disagreeing with you. That was just an observation I had about late-career Owen Hart that I was randomly throwing out.

[Jimmy Redman]

Owen is a weird one for me. He's another guy that I want to like more than I actually do. The idea of him - a smaller, more high flying Hart who can actually act, emote and entertain - I am all for that shit, but when I watch him I don't end up liking him as much as I should. Am I watching the right stuff? What is the essential Owen stuff?

 

I love the Bret matches. I really love the 1-2-3 Kid sprint at KOTR. I honestly can't remember anything else of his that has stuck with me.

[JerryvonKramer]

Steiners match from 94?

Liger in 91?

Benoit match when he's Pegasus Kid?

 

Is this the most late 90s IWC post I've ever made? Ha ha.

[ohtani's jacket]

I hear ya, Jimmy. I was the biggest Owen mark ever growing up, and I still love his heel turn as well as his return after Montreal, but pre-Rocket pimped Owen? Forget about it.

[Yo-Yo's Roomie]

People like his stuff with Shamrock, the Euro title final against Bulldog and a couple of tags with Davey (vs Furnas/LaFon, vs Shawn and Austin). The match with Shawn on the ppv before Mania 12 is well thought of. I don't think he's a guy with a lot of great matches, but he usually does lots of cool things in his matches to make him stand out. Good character work.

[KB8]

I started watching a bunch of 1994 WWF a few years ago and Owen really stood out as one of the best guys in the company, which I guess isn't a super high bar, but still. He was consistently good. I'd agree that he doesn't necessarily have a litany of outstanding matches, but I usually always find him to be individually fun. I'm not sure it's enough to get him on my ballot (honestly, it's probably not), but he'll act like a total shithead and wheel kick someone's teeth out on the regular so he wins points for that.

[Yo-Yo's Roomie]

Owen may be the ultimate 'fun' wrestler, thinking about it.

[Dylan Waco]

I still love that match v. Barry Horowitz from LA I think. I also still really like the match with Terry Taylor which I think were from MSG. Those were as the Blue Blazer. He had a match with Greg Valentine that I absolutely loved. I remember a good One Man Gang match too. I watched one of the Liger matches last night and was entertained by it, though it was more a really fun good match than a great one. I really loved the team with Yoko at the time, and remember thinking they were very underrated when I went back and watched tons of random WWF for the SC WWF matches poll. I haven't thought a lot about Owen one way or the other to be honest, but I'd like to rate him.

[Jimmy Redman]

So, this is me eating my hat. Tastes...like fabric.

 

After posting the other day I watched the Shamrock matches and they were fucking revelatory like you wouldn't believe. So I've been gorging on some Owen ever since, and it seems that finally I'm watching the right stuff. Or more likely, I'm watching enough of it at once to get a better picture of what I'm looking at. He's a guy that I look at on spec and think "flashy small babyface worker" and never really got it and that always threw me, until I took a good, hard look at him and started to see what he's really about.

 

So now Owen is shooting up in my estimation. More than anything I love his commitment to being a heel. One of my favourite little things he does is how often he gets a 2-count and jumps up with his hands in the air like he's won. Just a little thing that makes you think "You didn't even get close dude, sit down and shut up!"

 

Another thing about being a heel is the moves he chooses to use in a match. Or more accurately, the moves he chooses NOT to use. Like I said I was always thrown by Owen because I know he has all of these flashy moves and offense and never seems to really use it, but I see now that it's a deliberate decision to work to the role he's playing. He might start off with that kip up arm wringer counter thing, but as they get into the match he doesn't really show off. He punches and stomps, he cheats and rakes eyes, he's an asshole. He uses the enziguri as a death blow, not as a high spot. Whatever he does is in service to the match, to his character and to the babyface. I appreciate that, especially when you think about things like Rollins working as a flat-out babyface vs Cena at Summerslam. (Although to be fair it is a different time, and Owen is exactly the kind of working heel who would get cheered incessantly today because he's so good.)

 

He's endlessly useful because he can adapt to any kind of situation they throw him in. He feuds with Bret and they mirror each other and work the way they were trained. He feuds with Shamrock and turns up his legit grappling ability and toughness. He works with Davey Boy and turns up the European moves and hold trading. He works with Austin and he's throwing punches and hitting piledrivers. He works with Shawn and turns up the vaguely lucha-inspired 'run the ropes, flip off the top' kind of stuff that he does. He works with Mankind and turns up the brawling and starts biting fingers and throwing chairs and stuff. He works with Kid and he can finally be the bigger guy and dominate someone, as well as show off his flying. He's so well rounded, and so intelligent when it comes to what to do and when, that they can put him with anyone or in any position and he'll know what to do to make it work best. And that's just in WWF as a heel, he can also work tags, work face, work in Japan, UK, Europe, Calgary.

 

I'm not even done, I still want to watch more and more of him. Can't believe I've turned around so much. I never thought someone that I wasn't even considering as late as last week would be going as high up on my ballot as he will be. I may even have him above Bret.

[Timbo Slice]

He'll be on the cutline with me, because I think a lot of people gloss over the post-Bret stuff, but he was still doing good work, even dragging Jarrett around to that entertaining tag run.

 

He'll always be one of my personal favorites, but objectively, I don't know if he has enough to outshine other guys who are right there on the edge of the list for me.