WingedEagle Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 I get what you're saying, I just don't see how you can entirely dismiss the commercial side of the equation. If nothing draws, all opportunities for the purely artistic work will disappear. Not too many are in the music, film or wrestling industries for charity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 I get what you're saying, I just don't see how you can entirely dismiss the commercial side of the equation. If nothing draws, all opportunities for the purely artistic work will disappear. Not too many are in the music, film or wrestling industries for charity. Nobody is saying that you shouldn't put draws in the main event. The only thing people are saying is that to be good at pro-wrestling does not mean you have to be a draw. Did Daniel Bryan become a better pro-wrestler over the last year or two than he was 3-4 years ago? Maybe, but it would have nothing to do with him becoming a draw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingedEagle Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 If his becoming a draw resulted in hotter crowds for the same matches he was wrestling a few years ago, then being a draw may in fact have made his output as a wrestler better. Unless you don't care about the crowd. I just don't see how its a black or white issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Sorrow Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 I really hate Johnny Sorrow's argument that someone is good if they make money. Is One Direction a great band? Is any movie that makes big box office necessarily better than a movie that doesn't? etc... I don't think of movies and music the same . And my general point is, if you can draw money, you're good at being a Pro Wrestler. And there's a lot of factors to drawing money, of course. But if you can get people to pay to watch you then you're a good Professional Wrestler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 I really hate Johnny Sorrow's argument that someone is good if they make money. Is One Direction a great band? Is any movie that makes big box office necessarily better than a movie that doesn't? etc... I don't think of movies and music the same . And my general point is, if you can draw money, you're good at being a Pro Wrestler. And there's a lot of factors to drawing money, of course. But if you can get people to pay to watch you then you're a good Professional Wrestler. However, nobody would ever say that if you can make money in music or movies that you are good musician or actor. The fifth biggest movie last year was Transformers is it a good movie? Is Michael Bay a good director? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoo Enthusiast Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 Did you even read where he said "I don't think of movies and music the same."? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 Did you even read where he said "I don't think of movies and music the same."? But why? Why does wrestling get treated different? That is the part I don't get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Sorrow Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 Did you even read where he said "I don't think of movies and music the same."? But why? Why does wrestling get treated different? That is the part I don't get.Because wrestling is unique and has been, is, and always will be. I'd rather talk this than type it . Book the podcast bro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerva Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 It seems to me there is massive amounts of passive aggressiveness on Dylan's arguments about New Japan especially in the first hour. But always love listening to the post game reaction shows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoe Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 Is the show on the iTunes feed? I've subscribed to both feeds and I don't see it. I'm interested cause I saw the show and liked it but it felt too rushed. As for the attendance figure, this is same thing I've always had a problem with in terms of Dome Show attendances cause they would mostly be the number from New Japan. I wished Zach Arnold was still covering Japan since he was the guy with the most accurate numbers. Issue fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Waco Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 It seems to me there is massive amounts of passive aggressiveness on Dylan's arguments about New Japan especially in the first hour. But always love listening to the post game reaction shows. It's hard for me to be serious because as we all know I hate New Japan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 It seems to me there is massive amounts of passive aggressiveness on Dylan's arguments about New Japan especially in the first hour. But always love listening to the post game reaction shows. It's hard for me to be serious because as we all know I hate New Japan I got accused of hating NJPW as well on twitter, even though I proclaimed Naka-Ibushi MOTY already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jushin muta liger Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 Is the show on the iTunes feed? I've subscribed to both feeds and I don't see it. I'm interested cause I saw the show and liked it but it felt too rushed. As for the attendance figure, this is same thing I've always had a problem with in terms of Dome Show attendances cause they would mostly be the number from New Japan. I wished Zach Arnold was still covering Japan since he was the guy with the most accurate numbers. Issue fixed.Thank you. Downloaded it and I'm ready to listen to it for my way home from work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillThompson Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 It seems to me there is massive amounts of passive aggressiveness on Dylan's arguments about New Japan especially in the first hour. But always love listening to the post game reaction shows. It's hard for me to be serious because as we all know I hate New Japan As I discovered today it's simply not okay to dislike any aspect of NJPW. You do and certain sections of their fanbase jump all over you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superstar Sleeze Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 You should check out Boneheads! It is awesome! Are you going to XWA, on the 17th, brutha? After listening to Dylan's thoughts on Tanahashi and Michaels on different podcasts, I just got to wonder how he felt about early Motley Crue and early Poison? Did the Look At What The Cat Dragged In Album Cover, really confuse you, my man? :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrisZ Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 From Dave Wrestle Kingdom 9 drew 36,000 fans to the Tokyo Dome, which was a paid number. It will most likely be the second biggest crowd for pro wrestling in the world this year. It’s also the biggest for New Japan’s annual 1/4 show in at least 13 years. A Nagata vs. Jun Akiyama interpromotional main event in 2002 drew a sellout. There were two shows since then which had 40,000 or more in the building, but this show had more actual tickets sold as they were no significant papering. To me, it’s still a slight disappointment. Advance sales were far ahead of last year, up 50% as of a few weeks ago. But the final tally was almost identical to last year’s 35,000. In many ways, while the product is hot by modern standards of pro wrestling, it’s feels hotter when you watch the shows than it really is. It’s more that New Japan is a promotion that has its really fervent fans what attend the big shows, but rank and file shows are really not much bigger than a strong U.S. indie group, and it’s not mainstream. They present a great product, from the in-ring to the booking, and business is growing, but the lack of mainstream exposure gives then a certain ceiling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoo Enthusiast Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 It seems to me there is massive amounts of passive aggressiveness on Dylan's arguments about New Japan especially in the first hour. But always love listening to the post game reaction shows. It's hard for me to be serious because as we all know I hate New Japan As I discovered today it's simply not okay to dislike any aspect of NJPW. You do and certain sections of their fanbase jump all over you. I said I didn't like the English commentary on the F4W Board and got called a troll and someone who was just looking for something to bitch about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradhindsight Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 We apologize - the iTunes feed was fixed on Tuesday night then. We've installed some filters with Apple since our feed was so large, they were having some issues with older episodes and how things were coded back in 2011. Thanks for your patience and support for the site and shows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoe Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 It seems to me there is massive amounts of passive aggressiveness on Dylan's arguments about New Japan especially in the first hour. But always love listening to the post game reaction shows. It's hard for me to be serious because as we all know I hate New Japan As I discovered today it's simply not okay to dislike any aspect of NJPW. You do and certain sections of their fanbase jump all over you. I said I didn't like the English commentary on the F4W Board and got called a troll and someone who was just looking for something to bitch about.Some of NJPW fans have a real circle the .wagon when it comes to criticisms of NJPW. I like the product, warts and all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 What is the theory on why, it seems, New Japan fans are so defensive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 Probably best not to generalize on that. I'm glad people have something they can enjoy and identify with, especially after the week WWE and TNA had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 Probably best not to generalize on that. I'm glad people have something they can enjoy and identify with, especially after the week WWE and TNA had. You are right, sorry. It's the vocal minority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillThompson Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 Probably best not to generalize on that. I'm glad people have something they can enjoy and identify with, especially after the week WWE and TNA had. You are right, sorry. It's the vocal minority. It probably is, and that's why I made sure to say certain fans in my initial comment. Those fans are tiring though, and they give the rest of the fanbase a bad name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pol Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 I think there's a subsection of fans that have never really been exposed to views on wrestling outside of the typical workrate smark/Meltzer consensus and it leads to the belief that anyone who doesn't share their aesthetic preferences must be objectively wrong. Combine that with being a fan of a niche product that, unlike WWE, doesn't have the benefit of being a hegemonic force that requires no defending, and you're going to get people who act like that. You see the same thing with TNA and TNA doesn't even have the workrate. Of course it's not even close to all fans, but as Grimmas said, they sure are vocal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shake Them Ropes Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 Enjoyed the show, guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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