Coffey Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 I remember when a normal, good old fashioned cage match was a big deal. Then we had Hell in a Cell & then Elimination Chamber. Now Hell in a Cell gets its entire own PPV & there's not one but two Hell in a Cell matches on the card & I'm almost completely apathetic for the show. It just doesn't feel like it really matters in the grand scheme of things, ya know? I don't think anyone is picking Kane to win the WWE title. No matter who wins between Roman or Bray, I don't think anything will change. Brock is, in all likelihood, going to topple 'Taker, ending the feud that I didn't even want to see start. There's a tag match where in 2015 the Dudleys could very well be tag champs again. A six-man rematch on the preshow that we got on free TV last night. Ryback/Owens I guess cause Ryback gets his rematch? Nikki/Charlotte because Nikki gets her rematch. I feel like the only intrigue is who is coming out to answer Cena's open challenge as I imagine he's dropping the US title for his time off. I know we're just coasting until Survivor Series (or arguably Royal Rumble) but a Hell in a Cell match should still be a big deal. It doesn't feel like it is anymore. Even with all the Legends last night coming back to try to get it over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffey Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 What are the odds the mystery opponent could be Daniel Bryan? Did anyone ever report what the third doctor opinion was? Has that doctor visit happened yet? That could be a good surprise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slasher Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 About Brock and the streak, I think it is possible to be uneasy about being the guy to end the streak and then later on growing comfortable with that role knowing he was successful in parlaying it into something bigger for his character. The match happened. The streak ended. There's no turning back so I think it is fair to make the best out of a situation he might have initially opposed. I think it is similar to Bret Hart turning heel in the Attitude era. He didn't want to do it but seeing how well he carried the role he got more and more comfortable with it that he was turning in good performances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Funny how one of the big criticisms I'm seeing on other forums is how that Brock/Taker will be lame because you can't promise blood in HIAC anymore. Well considering there's been blood in pretty much every Brock match since he's been back, I don't see how this would be any different. Sure, you can't blade anymore, but Brock is a human version of a giant puppy that doesn't know his own strength and he doesn't seem to mind people getting stiff in return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parties Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Saying “everyone knows its entertainment” is just Brock’s way of differentiating what he’s achieved in MMA/football vs. WWE. It was in response to Austin’s usual question he asks everyone, “Is it wrestling or sports entertainment?” I saw that as Brock towing the company line and in so many words saying, “I don’t take it as seriously as a UFC shoot situation.” To me, that's not the same as “None of it matters, you’re all a bunch of Fandangos now.” Even though even I would argue that bad booking has led to a roster that really is about 80% Fandangos.His “no one else here is credible enough to break the streak” line was dumb and pointless: much more of an indictment of the company’s short-sightedness than it is a positive about him. The point is that doing so would have given someone credibility. I can’t imagine they were thrilled with him saying it. I agree that almost anyone can be booked to become “legit”/a bonafide draw. I do think winning the UFC heavyweight title is a little different than giving Ryback the Goldberg push, but it’s true that guys can be made in ways that WWE fails to execute.Disagree with the idea that he lacked personality. I liked Podcast Brock more than silent Suplex City Brock. He’d lose some of his mystique if he was cutting long promos, but I do think him being so openly arrogant/aggressive/surprisingly cogent makes for a good character if nothing else. I’d probably rather listen to Brock cut his own promos than have Heyman do it. Even Austin said that he found Lesnar to be such a good talker in UFC that it seems a waste for him to say nothing nowadays. Also: a good portion of his ego seems like a work. He starts the podcast by proudly proclaiming that he was a grade school bully. Few people are both that self-aware and sociopathic at the same time. Even if there’s a lot of truth to it, he’s turning the volume up.I agree that the storyline/veil-lifting duality is confusing, but these podcasts have been roped off for a while now as the shooting range. It breaks kayfabe, but in such a way that the McMahons own and sign off on. Very different from Lana and Rusev if the two of them sold pics to TMZ, or posted all that stuff without it being approved in the sort of sycophantic Godfather consultations that Vince/HHH expect. It’s not as much about kayfabe as it is about control.Austin’s awkward discomfort was so apparent early on that I honestly thought, “Holy shit, they’re actually doing an angle.” The conversation seemed so stilted and full of long, terse pauses that I initially assumed it was Austin “acting” to build perceived tension. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmare007 Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 So viewership was slighty up (3.3 million average. Hours of 3.6, 3.3 and 3.1) but a record low rating of 2.21. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.S. Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 Crazy HiaC PPV predictions: - Ambrose answers the Cena challenge and wins the U.S. Title. - THEDEMONKANE becomes the WWE Champion and drops it to Lesnar at Survivor Series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 So Tyler Breeze made his main roster debut on the Smackdown tapings as Summer Rae's new man on a Miz TV segment. So it's entirely possible the "they have something in mind for him" Dave mentioned a couple days ago is just Vince making a "Summer Breeze" joke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 So Tyler Breeze made his main roster debut on the Smackdown tapings as Summer Rae's new man on a Miz TV segment. So it's entirely possible the "they have something in mind for him" Dave mentioned a couple days ago is just Vince making a "Summer Breeze" joke. Unfortunately "Something" is probably about 2 months worth of programs before he ends up as aimless as most of the guys on the roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strummer Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 I like the Summer/Tyler pairing. I'm sure he'll be programmed with Ziggler for the next few months Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmare007 Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 Who is left to face Cena? Big Show? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotJayTabb Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 Being airdropped into the worst storyline in the WWE feels like a cruel way to debut Breeze. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 So it's entirely possible the "they have something in mind for him" Dave mentioned a couple days ago is just Vince making a "Summer Breeze" joke. They need to use the cover by Type O Negative then. Ok, it wouldn't exactly fit the duo, but I would pop for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chief Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 Giving Breeze a valet isn't the worst way to debut him. It makes him stand out from other solo acts they've called up and Summer has been perfectly fine the past year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffey Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 Debuting on Smackdown is a death knell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parties Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 I've been a big Summer Rae advocate since her heartfelt Dusty tribute, and it seemed to remind them that she was a money act with whom who they were doing nothing. She deserves a regular spot on the show, even if the Rusev storyline feels derailed right now. That said, a Breeze-Ziggler feud seems a misguided debut, as they're too similar in look and style. It risks making Breeze look like a pale imitator when he's actually the superior worker and gimmick right now. One note I found interesting coming out of RAW this week is that I believe Cole or JBL said that the Wyatt-Reigns feud has been going on for five months. It's really been closer to four, but it's still surprising that they've dragged it out this long in order to kill time before Reigns' 'flair for the gold' redux. While the booking's been bad, it's produced several good matches, and both Wyatt and Reigns actually seem underrated by the average fan right now. It's typical WWE in 2015, where everything is so repetitive and joylessly executed that you forget you're watching really good workers have a long series of good matches - while the one or two good promos that would actually get fans behind it all seem further and further out of reach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffey Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 It's really been closer to four, but it's still surprising that they've dragged it out this long in order to kill time before Reigns' 'flair for the gold' redux. Do you think the main event of Wrestlemania next year is going to be Roman Reigns Vs. Brock Lesnar again? I was trying to think of what they were planning on doing, since they moved Brock/Taker 3 up to this Sunday. I honestly don't know what their plans are but I imagine they have some by now, since this Wrestlemania is going to be so big & they want to sell it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.S. Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 Do you think the main event of Wrestlemania next year is going to be Roman Reigns Vs. Brock Lesnar again? I was trying to think of what they were planning on doing, since they moved Brock/Taker 3 up to this Sunday. I honestly don't know what their plans are but I imagine they have some by now, since this Wrestlemania is going to be so big & they want to sell it out. The more I think about it, the more convinced I am that this will happen: Crazy HiaC PPV predictions: - THEDEMONKANE becomes the WWE Champion and drops it to Lesnar at Survivor Series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffey Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 It would make more sense for Rollins to retain so Brock can take it from him at Survivor Series, to get his revenge for what happened at last Wrestlemania. Or do you think Lesnar should be the heel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slasher Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 They shouldn't do Lesnar/Reigns again at Wrestlemania. In fact, the very next time they do face each other, it should be with Reigns defending (successfully) against Lesnar. I don't know what they are doing with the Shield thing, but if they aren't reuniting, it really needs to be Rollins that drops the belt to Reigns. Perhap that being at Wrestlemania. Lesnar shouldn't actually be champion anymore unless he decided to be a more featured part of the weekly grind. Let Lesnar be the special attraction that is the last line of defense against heels and the spectre of death against babyfaces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cm funk Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 On Brock, and criticizing him? Seriously? This is a board that hates on WWE consistently, and someone like him who's his own man, bucked the system and is a true wrestling success story in an industry where it's pretty rare.......c'mon And any of "the boys" that are jealous about his "special treatment". They should be. They should be thinking "how can I be more like Brock". He's not the only one who's gotten it, and won't be the last. When you're a special talent and a draw you get special treatment. Brock is pretty much the reason for ESPN covering WWE. Who the fuck else on the roster could have caused that? It's like when all those rumours about guys being unhappy about Rock coming back and "taking their spots". lol. He's The Rock. You're not. As for Tyler Breeze.......not a good way to debut him. On Smackdown which nobody watches or cares about, WWE doesn't even seem to care about that show. RAW is the A show, and what happens on SD is barely even noted or referenced on RAW. And, I'm a big fan of Summer Rae, ever since she debuted with Fandango, I've been on her hype train since day 1.......but having a valet doesn't fit the "Prince Pretty" NXT character. Also, I've been a Ziggler fan (and I know the majority of this board have never been fans).......but 2015 Dolph is pretty not good. He's a guy that I wanted to see leave and go to Japan or the indy scene. He's been around a long time, he's stale, and his work has really dropped off IMO. I always liked him better as a heel too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cm funk Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 That said, I think Breeze and Ziggler could have some really fun matches........and I've become a pretty big fan of Breeze as a performer and I know he's a guy that HHH & Regal really like......so I want to be cautiously optimistic here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 Yeah I hope they do something with him since I really like his work, but as mentioned they dropped him in an angle torpedoed by Vince already in a Miz TV segment on a show being ignored by the company until January. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 On Brock, and criticizing him? Seriously? This is a board that hates on WWE consistently, and someone like him who's his own man, bucked the system and is a true wrestling success story in an industry where it's pretty rare.......c'mon And any of "the boys" that are jealous about his "special treatment". They should be. They should be thinking "how can I be more like Brock". He's not the only one who's gotten it, and won't be the last. When you're a special talent and a draw you get special treatment. Brock is pretty much the reason for ESPN covering WWE. Who the fuck else on the roster could have caused that? It's like when all those rumours about guys being unhappy about Rock coming back and "taking their spots". lol. He's The Rock. You're not. This is not a board that hates on WWE nearly as consistently as you defend WWE. It's great that he's a self-made man. He's not a likable person and his attitude is a turn-off. I could acknowledge that he's special and deserves his spot if I was a wrestler while still resenting the hell out of him for it. Those ideas are not in conflict with each other. I think where we differ is that I truly believe that 90% of what makes a guy a star is not whatever talents or qualities he possesses as much as it is being presented as a winning winner who wins. That's obviously a very surface description of it, and winning at the right times against the right opponents matters too. Just as there are some cases where a loss is good for a guy. Still, the point is, booking matters far, far more than whatever talents or traits a guy has. If other guys were booked like Brock, Austin and Undertaker, wrestling would have a bunch of full-time Brocks, Austins and Undertakers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkdoc Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 i'm not so sure about that, loss. the MMA cred probably counts for more than you think it does, as there is a lot of overlap between people who watch that and wrestling. this actually reminds me of an old scott keith post where he basically said that if you gave chris benoit the undertaker's music & entrance & presentation, he would get just as over as undertaker did. i don't really buy that, just from the lack of height alone. guys come off dorky when they're doing a gimmick that doesn't fit them, and that will always be a factor no matter how much they win. maybe you just mean that guys will get a strong reaction period if they win all the time, in which case i'm with you...but i'm not sure how much that's really worth. IIRC you generally view cena's reactions as a positive, whereas i consider them a reflection of his low ceiling as the company ace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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