WWE Hall of Fame 2017

[Strummer]

Lemmy, you say?

 

 

[El-P]

 

That's one of the big mainstream newspaper in France.

 

Seriously people. Fucking Lemmy.

[stro]

 

 

 

I kind of hope Punk never comes back or gets inducted into the HOF, although I can't picture anyone after like 2005 getting in anyway. I don't think time will look back fondly on Punk, both as a personality outside of the ring and as a talent inside of it.

 

He's John the Baptist, Daniel Bryan is Jesus, and they have a lot of disciples.

 

I think his run, when put in perspective, will look very impressive. He basically fought the system and paved the way for a lot of the current big stars to get their shot. That will gain in traction as those guys become TOP GUYS and discuss their influences.

 

The idea that Punk paved the way for people has always been weird to me. Randy Savage was under 6 feet and got a year long reign in an era where the average guy was 6'4, 300 pounds. The 90s were built around "average" sized (comparatively, obviously) like Austin, Bret, and HBK being the top guys. The 2000s had guys like Angle, Benoit, and Eddie. He didn't do anything to fight the system. He complained about not being given the top guy stuff, then complained when he got the top guy stuff, then left, then complained some more. He didn't change the system. Bryan was going to get his title at some point even if it wasn't going to be at WM 30. There were already tons of indie guys hired and on TV that had nothing to do with Punk. WWE was hiring indie guys in the 90s, too.

 

WWE really had no choice but to turn more to the indies for talent, because people that would have gone into wrestling a decade before were going into MMA or other sports. That wave of indie guys was coming regardless of if Punk had ever even been hired.

 

Was it, because at the time the WWF hated indie guys and thought they worked wrong or could never make it. Punk and Bryan with all their talents were thought of as nobodies who couldn't work by the WWE and only got pushed because Punk got so over and Heyman was in his corner.

 

The WWF was hiring athletes and training them, not turning to indies. They hired Punk but wanted to put him in the Spirit Squad and treat him like the joke they thought he was. Even when he got over they fought in for a long time.

 

Punk paved the way.

 

They let Punk keep his name, heavily hyped his debut, made him the face of the 3rd brand, then gave him two MITB and titles in 2 years. To act like WWE had no plans for him or thought he was a joke is asinine. Around the time Punk got his push, the actual athletes coming to WWE to get trained was drying up, because going into wrestling was not enticing for athletes who could go into MMA or football. WWE had to turn to the indies. That was coming with or without Punk. If anything, Bryan's success being such a small guy and being more over than Punk ever was really paved the way for the NXT hirings/pushes and current things like 205 Live and the upcoming UK show.

 

Punk's legacy is making indie dudes think "pipe bombs" were great and edgy, and being a guy who got everything a wrestler could ever want handed to him and ruining it because he was a miserable asshole.

 

 

 

That's one of the big mainstream newspaper in France.

 

Seriously people. Fucking Lemmy.

 

Never heard of him

[AirJordanFan93]

I'm genuinely surprised Snoop wasn't inducted yet. I thought that happened last year when he accompanied Sasha to the ring.

But it did happen last year.

[Cap]

I think Punk pretty clearly - at LEAST - cleared a path for a lot of the "indy guys" that came later. It was't his size or stature. It was the way he came up, the kind of wrestler he tried to be. WWE tried too early to basically put a factory system together and Punk - intentionally or not - demonstrated very clearly that they were missing something with that model, something that gave the program edge and made money at the same time. Punk slid in and wedged the door open for guys after him to get the benefit of the doubt a little more.

 

I'll agree Bryan put the punctuation on the whole thing and without him being honestly more talented than Punk, the whole thing might have fizzled out. Bryan deserves more credit for taking everything to a level that (at least for that short mania run) I am not sure ANYONE has ever been and fully establishing that rout (more attention was paid to Bryan's indy time - I think). I just don't see Bryan getting so many chances if Punk weren't finding success. If NOTHING else, they probably wanted an indy hero to draw that fan populations should they lose Punk, since they likely didn't really trust Punk all that much and Bryan was pretty clearly their best bet.

 

I think Punk's legacy in the ring will fade a little, but he will remembered as a guy who got more out of skill set than most in the modern era. Out of the ring, who knows about how his personality holds up. I don't know him so I don't care. His influence will hold up - I think. The WWE could continue to ignore him and it will likely be effective. But he has crossover potential. I can't imagine him not finding some common ground down the road and them articulating the narrative such that he matters again.

 

In all, I will be SHOCKED if Punk doesn't come back for one more match and likely get a HOF nod eventually. This is a never say never industry, and it is definitely a never say never WWE. It is money and power first, control of the dominant narrative of wrestling is vital. Who knows when they may need a bump down the road and they are willing to throw something nuts at punk. Who knows where Punk's head will be in 5, 8, 10 years.

[victory]

Radiohead being compared to Motörhead? Lol. I've heard of them, but I wouldn't even know a Radiohead song if I heard it. I could name tons of Motörhead tunes though.

 

I do understand what you are saying. Motörhead isn't what I would call mainstream.

[Matt D]

Radiohead has 2x the google hits. Argument solved. Let's move on.

[sek69]

Yeah in a world where Bruno and Warrior mended fences to the point of a HOF induction, it seems silly to suggest Punk will never ever be back.

 

 

However it does need pointed out that the first two were Hunter smoothing things out with guys who had issues with Vince, and in Punk's case Hunter seems to be the guy he hates.

[fakeplastictrees]

Radiohead being compared to Motörhead? Lol. I've heard of them, but I wouldn't even know a Radiohead song if I heard it. I could name tons of Motörhead tunes though.

 

I do understand what you are saying. Motörhead isn't what I would call mainstream.

 

Wouldn't know a Radiohead song eh?

 

Re: Punk

 

I think Punk was a good con man and people act up the gimmick 100% and were/are unable to separate the marketing of the man from the reality of the man. Some people try to make Punk out like he is the wrestling Che Guevara, but he is more like wrestling's version of Amrit Desai. He was a great worker in that sense and with wrestling fans legit wanting a revolution in WWE and a meaningful shakeup, turned to Punk as the 'leader' of this movement despite the fact that it was all manufactured. Punk's attitude will not come off great or revolutionary or any of that non-sense. People already see right through it and as time goes on-- a man who received his own bus, his personally requested theme song, millions of dollars, millions of dollars, promotion of inside jokes/jabs (ice cream bars), etc. will not be given any hearts or tears because he didn't get to main event WM.

[stro]

I would say West World did more for Radiohead's popularity in the past ten years than anything Radiohead has done themselves.

[Cap]

Yeah in a world where Bruno and Warrior mended fences to the point of a HOF induction, it seems silly to suggest Punk will never ever be back.

 

 

However it does need pointed out that the first two were Hunter smoothing things out with guys who had issues with Vince, and in Punk's case Hunter seems to be the guy he hates.

That is true. Again, who knows what happens down the road. Maybe Shane mends that fence? Maybe Heyman gets more influence and helps mend it? There is just too much money, too much potential in one more main event for Punk for it to not be on the table.

 

I am legit surprised that more people don't know Motorhead outside the WWE context. I guess i never assumed they were "household" but I just assumed most people knew them. I still imagine they have enough of a presence in popular culture to induct if the WWE wants. Just playing some of those recognizable riffs and putting together a few video packages about their influence in the music industry and people will buy in.

[flyonthewall2983]

Radiohead has 2x the google hits. Argument solved. Let's move on.

 

They don't have any umlauts in their name, which could make a straight comparison a little murkier.

[JRH]

Not to beat a dead horse, but Motorhead, though possibly a known name, never really crossed over into the mainstream (at least in the US). Outside of satellite/Internet radio and specialty metal shows on radio stations, they never got radio airplay, and even back in the 80s, werent being played on MTV outside of Headbanger's Ball. Plus, lets be honest, while HHH could talk about what Motorhead meant to him, the band members who show up to a HOF may not know enough about wrestling to tell stories about that (they probably saw it as just another gig).

[JRH]

Also, if they had to, I could see them pulling off DDP as a headliner. He has lots of goodwill among wrestling fans for how he helped Hall and Jake, and he's even pretty mainstream (DDP Yoga was mentioned in non-wrestling magazines, and I mean as a legit fitness program, not just some novelty story about an ex-wrestler having his own Yoga program).

[shakla]

Not to beat a dead horse, but Motorhead, though possibly a known name, never really crossed over into the mainstream (at least in the US). Outside of satellite/Internet radio and specialty metal shows on radio stations, they never got radio airplay, and even back in the 80s, werent being played on MTV outside of Headbanger's Ball. Plus, lets be honest, while HHH could talk about what Motorhead meant to him, the band members who show up to a HOF may not know enough about wrestling to tell stories about that (they probably saw it as just another gig).

 

For sure, that's another thing, for most of the celeb candidates, we must keep in mind that their involvement in WWE is a small part of their lives/careers. Might have just been a fun payday for some.

 

Maybe Motorhead is a bit more mainstream in UK, maybe more of Europe, compared to the US. And despite the "hot UK crowds", most of WWE's business still comes from the States.

 

WWE should probably demphasize the "headliner" part of the HoF ceremony. It's bad enough it always feels booked like a wrestling card rather than the results of a legit election like most real sports HoFs. They made a big mistake throwing Foley in there during the Bruno year, that's an easy headliner they used up. There was the year DiBiase "headlined" it, think a result of Warrior turning them down. Work more names like that to "close out" if you have to.

 

(Edit: I have Celebrity Name Game on in the background, which is like Pyramid, and in the bonus round, Motorhead came up, and a middle aged woman immediately passed on it before giving clues to the celeb partners. Kinda works both ways, notable to be a answer on an American game show, but easily passed by the civilian contestant)

[AirJordanFan93]

 

Not to beat a dead horse, but Motorhead, though possibly a known name, never really crossed over into the mainstream (at least in the US). Outside of satellite/Internet radio and specialty metal shows on radio stations, they never got radio airplay, and even back in the 80s, werent being played on MTV outside of Headbanger's Ball. Plus, lets be honest, while HHH could talk about what Motorhead meant to him, the band members who show up to a HOF may not know enough about wrestling to tell stories about that (they probably saw it as just another gig).

 

For sure, that's another thing, for most of the celeb candidates, we must keep in mind that their involvement in WWE is a small part of their lives/careers. Might have just been a fun payday for some.

 

Maybe Motorhead is a bit more mainstream in UK, maybe more of Europe, compared to the US. And despite the "hot UK crowds", most of WWE's business still comes from the States.

 

WWE should probably demphasize the "headliner" part of the HoF ceremony. It's bad enough it always feels booked like a wrestling card rather than the results of a legit election like most real sports HoFs. They made a big mistake throwing Foley in there during the Bruno year, that's an easy headliner they used up. There was the year DiBiase "headlined" it, think a result of Warrior turning them down. Work more names like that to "close out" if you have to.

 

(Edit: I have Celebrity Name Game on in the background, which is like Pyramid, and in the bonus round, Motorhead came up, and a middle aged woman immediately passed on it before giving clues to the celeb partners. Kinda works both ways, notable to be a answer on an American game show, but easily passed by the civilian contestant)

 

Yeah they used DiBiase in 2010 when they were in Phoenix after Warrior turned them down. DiBiase is proably a big enough name to headline a WWE HOF to be honest.

 

I agree about Foley. I can see why they inducted him the year they did because it was in the Garden and all but they had 3 headline guys that year with Bruno,Backlund and Foley so you cost yourselves 2 potential headliners in Backlund and Foley so they can go in at the Garden.

[shakla]

On merit, Backund certainly could headline a HoF, but I think he's too out there to have given a speech to close out the show. The way he's been portrayed in WWE history more as "Bowtie Bob" didn't help either.

[C.S.]

If Undertaker, Rock, or Goldberg aren't going in this year, I would not be at all surprised to see Christian as the headliner. In WWE's world/Vince's mind, he's a far bigger star than DDP from "that other rasslin' company." Plus, Christian actually holds a win over DDP at WrestleMania. But I'm guessing Goldberg is going in this year.

 

As for Lemmy/Motorhead, even if their only accomplishment was being friends with Triple H, that would be more than enough for this Hall. As it stands, they actually had a pretty long and successful music career.

[The Chief]

I would love to see Regis go in. How's his health these days? I'm sure his speach would be tremendous.

 

For sheer what the fuck factor I wanna see Phil Collins inducted.

[JRH]

If it means we can get "Take Me Home" for SNME again then I'd be all for Phil (You'd have to go through Philip Bailey for Easy Lover and WM1 though). Wonder who owns the rights to that music video he did with Warrior. But seriously (no pun intended), I think this is the year they finally get Cyndi Lauper.

[stro]

If Undertaker, Rock, or Goldberg aren't going in this year, I would not be at all surprised to see Christian as the headliner. In WWE's world/Vince's mind, he's a far bigger star than DDP from "that other rasslin' company." Plus, Christian actually holds a win over DDP at WrestleMania. But I'm guessing Goldberg is going in this year.

 

As for Lemmy/Motorhead, even if their only accomplishment was being friends with Triple H, that would be more than enough for this Hall. As it stands, they actually had a pretty long and successful music career.

 

DDP won that match

[Brandon-E]

 

If Undertaker, Rock, or Goldberg aren't going in this year, I would not be at all surprised to see Christian as the headliner. In WWE's world/Vince's mind, he's a far bigger star than DDP from "that other rasslin' company." Plus, Christian actually holds a win over DDP at WrestleMania. But I'm guessing Goldberg is going in this year.

 

As for Lemmy/Motorhead, even if their only accomplishment was being friends with Triple H, that would be more than enough for this Hall. As it stands, they actually had a pretty long and successful music career.

 

DDP won that match

 

The only match at Wrestlemania 18 where a WCW guy beat a WWF guy. I think Booker T during his WWE run was treated better than Christian.

[C.S.]

You're right. I'm actually spooked by this. For years, I thought Christian won. Am I thinking of another match or different DDP result?

[Brandon-E]

You're right. I'm actually spooked by this. For years, I thought Christian won. Am I thinking of another match or different DDP result?

Christian's only televised win over DDP happened on the 4/4/02 episode of Smackdown.

[Hawkeye12]

I think that was when Christian got announced from Florida since they were in Toronto. Then he threw a temper tantrum when he didn't get the pin and ate a Diamond Cutter for the win. That match and the ECW Originals win at WM23 are a couple of my feel good moments at Wrestlemania that weren't major matches, but fun to mark out for nonetheless as a "thank you" win for what they'd done in their careers. Randy Savage over Crush was another like that, although Savage had a lot of career left it turned out.