WON HOF 2018

[Tim Cooke]

How does Fredo not have a ballot?  I could name ten people who have no qualifications to get a vote but for whatever reason have a ballot.  Really hurts Mexico.

[El Boricua]

4 hours ago, Tim Cooke said:

How does Fredo not have a ballot?  I could name ten people who have no qualifications to get a vote but for whatever reason have a ballot.  Really hurts Mexico.

It's absurd that he does not have a ballot. It's basically an indictment of what the process has become when you're a voter because of who you know rather than what you know. Add that there is no check as to where some of the voters decide to vote region wise and express their 'knowledge' then it results in the travesty that is the current panorama of the Mexico region. 

We can do better. 

[NintendoLogic]

I would propose requiring voters to pick one region of primary expertise and only allow them to vote in other regions if they've been certified as knowledgeable by an unquestioned expert. That would eliminate the problem of US/Japan voters deciding to round out their ballot with a random luchador and driving down everyone's percentages.

[Tabe]

On 9/24/2018 at 5:56 PM, elliott said:

I've put together Gordy Lists for Yoshiaki Fujiwara and Volk Han. Enjoy:

 

Volk Han Gordy List:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

1. Was he ever regarded as the best draw in the world? Was he ever regarded as the best draw in his country or his promotion?

Volk Han was never the best draw in the world, his country or his promotion.

2. Was he an international draw, national draw and/or regional draw?

He was not an international draw, national draw or regional draw.

3. How many years did he have as a top draw?

No years as a top draw.

4. Was he ever regarded as the best worker in the world? Was he ever regarded as the best worker in his country or in his promotion?

He was never regarded as the best worker in the world or his country on a consensus level. He was considered the best worker in the RINGS promotion from his first match in December 1991 until at least 1996 when Kiyoshi Tamura joined the promotion. 1997 is often considered an either/or situation in regards to Volk Han or Kiyoshi Tamura being better. By 1998 most would say that Tamura had officially surpassed Han as the best worker in RINGS.

The biggest fans of shoot style would likely point to Volk Han as the best worker in the world and his country over the bulk of is career. For the Pro Wrestling Only Greatest Wrestler Ever Poll, Han received 2 first place votes, a #3 vote and one additional top 10 vote with an average vote of 44.6. While this certainly doesn’t represent any sort of consensus, this does suggest that Han is very highly regarded in certain circles.

 

5. Was he ever the best worker in his class (sex or weight)? Was he ever one of the top workers in his class?

When it comes to shoot style wrestlers, I tend to think of “shoot style” as their “class.” He was thought of as one of the top workers in his class since his debut match until the day he retired. His only real competition in the early 90s in terms of reputation was Nobuhiko Takada. In the late 90s his only real competition was Kiyoshi Tamura. For the bulk of his pro wrestling career (12/91-99), Volk Han was considered either the best or second best wrestler of his style.

6. How many years did he have as a top worker?

Volk was considered a top worker in his style from his debut match in December 1991 until RINGS became a completely shoot style promotion towards the end of 1999 and early 2000. He is someone would could be accurately described as a great wrestler from his very first match to his very last match.

7. Was he a good worker before his prime? Was he a good worker after his prime?

The narrative surrounding Volk Han has always been that he debuted in his prime. His first match was in the main event against Akira Maeda at age 30 and his performance was excellent. He was in or around main events for the rest of his career and a Top Worker the entire time. If you wanted to nit pick, you could probably say his prime “ended” in late 95 or 96, but he remained an excellent worker and top star in the promotion.

I think most fans of shoot style would probably argue Volk Han didn’t really have a pre or post prime in the way we normally might think of it due to the nature of his career.

8. Did he have a large body of excellent matches? Did he have a excellent matches against a variety of opponents?

This is the cool thing about Volk Han. Not only does he have a large body of excellent matches, he did it against a large variety of opponents with less than 100 matches to his name. During the PWO Greatest Wrestler Ever Project, you’d see a lot of talk about consistency and sometimes “batting averages.” Volk probably has the highest batting average in wrestling history. He has had excellent matches against great wrestlers, good wrestlers, average wrestlers and bad wrestlers. He’s had great matches against vets and youngsters. Strikers and grapplers. And he did it over an 8 year period. His matches against Kiyoshi Tamura are considered some of the best matches not just in shoot style, but they are legendary matches in wrestling history. He also had great matches against Akira Maeda, Tsuyoshi Kohsaka, Yoshihisa Yamamoto, Andrei Kopilov, Dick Leon-Vrij, Mitsuya Nagai, Masayuki Naruse, Hiromitsu Kanehara, etc.

9. Did he ever anchor his promotion(s)?

Actually, yes he kinda did. Akira Maeda was hurt for most of 1993 missing action from February till October. Han headlined the 5 major shows in that time period in Yokohama (twice), Tokyo, Osaka, and Amagasaki which averaged 7242 in attendance with elevated ticket prices compared to the average wrestling show. Of course this isn’t a long run and is only 5 shows. But RINGS was able to continue to run profitable shows with top star Akira Maeda on the shelf and Volk Han in the main position. This indicates he was a fine number two option in a mid-level promotion. Which doesn’t sound impressive, but what other gaijin at that point could step into the top native star’s shoes and have the promotion continue to do good business? Maybe only Han and Hansen.

10. Was he effective when pushed at the top of cards?

Yes. His first match was in the main event of a RINGS show losing to Akira Maeda at Ariake Coliseum in December 1991 drawing 10,250 in a 12,000 seat capacity arena (with “very few freebies” according to Meltzer in the WON at the time). His 3rd match he beat Akira Maeda in Hiroshima in the main event of a sell out crowd of 5480 people. He anchored the promotion for the bulk of 1993 when Maeda was out with an injury. He was positioned very strongly for the majority of his career often in the semi-main event or in the main event if he was wrestling Maeda.

11. Was he valuable to his promotion before his prime? Was he still valuable to his promotion after his prime?

If you consider his post-prime to be 96-99, then yes. He was valuable as a big name gaijin and a great worker capable of having the best matches on the card. If you’re someone who thinks he didn’t really have a post prime and his entire career was “prime” stuff, then you can’t really answer yes to this. I don’t think he really had a “pre-prime” because he was great from day 1.

12. Did he have an impact on a number of strong promotional runs?

Yes, he was the best working and most popular Gaijin wrestler throughout the course of RINGS’ history. He was a main event star and the best or at worst among the best workers in his promotion for the majority of the time his promotion, which ran and sold out big buildings, existed. If RINGS had a strong promotional run, Volk Han was playing a role. 

13. Was he involved in a number of memorable rivalries, feuds or storylines?

Due to the nature of shoot style, not many if we’re being honest. However, Volk Han vs Akira Maeda is probably the top main event rivalry in the history of RINGS and Volk Han vs Kiyoshi Tamura is widely considered the best rivalry in the history of shoot style. His rivalries with Andrei Kopilov and Yoshihisa Yamamoto are probably his next best and they produced excellent matches that were always strongly positioned on cards.

14. Was he effective working on the mic, working storylines or working angles?

This doesn’t apply to Volk Han.

15. Did he play his role(s) effectively during his career?

His role was the Top Foreign Star in RINGS and he definitely played that role effectively. He was a great worker instantly with the credibility to face the top Star in his first match and actually beat him in his 3rd match ever. He remained in this role as top foreign mat wizard for the rest of his career and remained over and credible with the fans the entire time.
 

16. What titles and tournaments did he win? What was the importance of the reigns?

He won the 1994 and 1996 RINGS Mega Battle Tournament beating Akira Maeda and Kiyoshi Tamura in the finals respectively. He lost in the semi-finals of the tournament in 1995 to eventual winner Akira Maeda and in 1997 to runner-up Mikhail Ilioukhine.

This is RINGS major annual tournament. Because they didn’t have titles or run angles, this was their big tournament of the year with the final being run as the main event of their annual Budokan Hall show in January. So this is the most important tournament in the promotion. Han and Maeda are the only two time winners of the tournament.

17. Did he win many honors and awards?
 

WON Awards

1992 – 4th Place “Rookie of the Year”

1996 – Honorable Mention “Best Technical Wrestler”

1997 – 6th Place “Best Technical Wrestler”

1997 – Honorable Mention “Readers Personal Favorite Wretler”

1998 – Honorable Mention “Best Technical Wrestler”

1999 – Tied 8th Place “Best Technical Wrestler”

 

PWI Awards:

1997 - #44 PWI Top 500

2003 - #129 PWI Top 500 Singles Wrestlers of the PWI Years

PWO’s Greatest Wrestler Ever

Voted 60th overall with an average placement of 44th and two #1 votes.

It looks like he never won a Tokyo Sports Award from what I can tell. I’m not sure about any other awards. I can’t find Weekly Pro stuff online.

18. Did he get mainstream exposure due to his wrestling fame? Did he get a heavily featured by the wrestling media?

I can’t say for sure one way or the other on this. I think he likely got decent coverage from the wrestling media but probably didn’t achieve much mainstream fame.

19. Was he a top tag team wrestler?

His promotion never ran a tag team match.

20. Was he innovative?

Absolutely. There was no one in wrestling history like Volk Han. Shoot style was really stripped down and minimalistic pro wrestling and RINGS was the most stripped down. Yet Volk Han stood out on the global scene as a unique and colorful character. In that sense he was a great ambassador for shoot style amongst the North American hardcore wrestling fan. Lots of people don’t get shoot style, but they tend to “get” Volk Han. He was different, but his mastery of his completely different technique was what made him stand out.

21. Was he influential?

Not really. He’s yet another cog in the machine that took a section of Japanese Pro Wrestling to Shoot Style to Shoots. I’m not sure he’s one of the 20 most important people in that transformation. I feel like it’d be reaching to call him influential but I’d love to see an argument.

22. Did he make the people and workers around him better?

Oh absolutely. From day one. He was able to have great matches with anyone of any skill or experience level. He was great because everyone could see he had incredible technique and that kept him credible so guys could beat him and get a rub. The promotion didn’t have to invest in keeping him credible, it was built in. Young guys could look good just by competing with him. He was a true gatekeeper sort of guy for RINGS.

23. Did he do what was best for the promotion? Did he show a commitment to wrestling?

I’m really not familiar with the backstage inner workings of RINGS, so I don’t know if he ever refused to job for anyone or showed up to work stoned. I do know whenever he worked he was usually having an awesome match from the day his career started until it ended. He competed in major international Sambo tournaments before his career started, but once he started wrestling he kept wrestling. So I think it is fair to say he did what was best for the promotion. 

24. Is there any reason to believe that he was better or worse than he appeared?

He worked less than 70 matches in his career.

Shoot style has always been a niche within a niche style. While it was well covered by the WON, shoot style was never as widely watched by US fans as All Japan, New Japan and at times All Japan Women and FMW. This is reflected in the WON Awards voting.

He never truly competed for the best Technical Wrestler award. He consistently finished behind Dean Malenko and noted technical wrestler Manami Toyota and that’s when he even made the top 10 or Honorable mention. Many shoot style fans have made the argument that Volk Han is the greatest mat worker of all time and would have been deserving of best technical wrestler in any year from 1992-1999.

The reason he never did has nothing to do with Volk Han. He receives near unanimous praise. In the PWO GWE Project several people watched him or shoot style for the first time and had things like the following to say:

“Interesting.......just watched my first Volk match. He is, as has been said, the best shoot style wrestler I've watched. Problem with that is, however......I don't like shoot style very much.”

“It's a testament to Han that he's someone I got into almost immediately even though I have basically no time for shoot style. He opened the door for me to enjoy a style that I previously couldn't even sit through, and he gets a hell of a lot of credit for that from me.”

“Han strikes me as shoot-style's answer to a Mysterio or Misawa, in that regardless of one's style preference, it is very difficult not to be impressed by his body of work and elite level performance.”

If shoot style was more widely watched, Han would almost certainly have placed strongly in the “best technical” awards.

The Most Outstanding Awards really reflect where shoot style stood. Nobuhiko Takada was considered the best of the shoot style wrestlers in the late 80s and early 90s. He finished 4th & 3rd in the Most Outstanding Wrestlers results in 1986 and 1987 respectively, when he was working in New Japan in a non-shoot style company. Part of the reason Takada was considered the best of the shoot style guys at the time was his ability to stray farthest from traditional shoot style and work the most Traditional Japanese Pro Wrestling style of the shoot style guys.  When UWF 2.0 opened and Takada was back in a traditional shoot style promotion, in 1988 & 89 he dropped to 10th & 7th before falling out of the top 10 forever. 1998 was the only other year where a shoot-style wrestler placed in the top 10 for the most outstanding Awards when Kiyoshi Tamura finished 6th overall.

Shoot style has just never placed well in these awards because there weren’t enough people watching it. But to those who watched the style, Volk Han was one of the best in the business and clearly one of the best of all time. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Very well done.  As a huge fan of Han, I completely agree with everything you wrote.  

[sek69]

On 9/26/2018 at 8:34 AM, Tim Cooke said:

How does Fredo not have a ballot?  I could name ten people who have no qualifications to get a vote but for whatever reason have a ballot.  Really hurts Mexico.

 

I wonder how many people who would be considered knowledgeable about lucha have a vote. I would imagine Steve Sims has a vote, and cubsfan stated he would give his to Fredo in a heartbeat. 

[elliott]

3 hours ago, Tabe said:

Very well done.  As a huge fan of Han, I completely agree with everything you wrote.  

 

Thanks so much Tabe. I appreciate it!

[Sean Liska]

How do you defend Jerry Jarrett not being in with the money and TV ratings he drew as a booker in a smaller market from 67-87, and the Atlanta run, and as a bonus developing Dundee as a booker to pop Watts's business and Dutch with Puerto Rico. Seems egregious. I know my bias but it has lead to me being more educated on the subject and feeling more passionate about it.

[elliott]

About Jerry Jarrett, Its always been said that his contemporaries don't support him because he was a cheap payoff.

Someone please teach me about Rueben Jaurez, Ricki Starr, Johnny Barend, and Von Brauners & Saul Weingeroff.

Is Universo 2000 a better candidate than Mascara Ano 2000? If Cien ever falls off, I bet Dave just adds Los Hermanos Dinamita.

Is Rayo Jr someone who should be looked at eventually?

Did Sangre Chicana fall off the ballot last year or did Dave forget to include him?

 

[DeanColes1987]

Has Dave ever explained his reasoning behind putting Arn/Tully/Dillon on as a trio or clarified what years you should be taking into account?

Because I see them and if I was a voter I would only look at the period when Arn and Tully were actually a full time team (Aug 87 - Sept. 88) whereas others would probably go from the start of the Horsemen till they left (Jan 86 - Sept. 88) and you know there are voters who most likely just looked at their whole careers.

 

[joeg]

On 9/25/2018 at 11:31 PM, Benbeeach said:

No panther or Akiyama and they can just throw this whole thing in the trash

Yep. 

Akiyama has been a top 10 worker every year for the past 25 years. He sold out the Tokyo Dome three times in three years despite being the worst booked/ worst promoted champion ever in his home promotion.  

[shakla]

On 9/25/2018 at 9:25 PM, NintendoLogic said:

My understanding is that a voter has to nominate someone for them to be on the ballot. Dave can't just place them there of his own volition.

I'm pretty sure you see cases of both when new candidates appear.   Some due to voter demand, others due to Dave giving it more thought.  Don't think there is an official nomination process. The ones who turn 35 automatically go on if they are notable enough to Dave.

[ohtani's jacket]

Sometimes folks lobby Dave to put a name on the ballot. At other times Dave does it on a whim. I'm 99% sure that Fujiwara is on the ballot simply because Dave wanted to confirm his own inkling that Japanese-based voters wouldn't vote for him. 

[Tim Cooke]

On 9/28/2018 at 8:30 AM, Sean Liska said:

How do you defend Jerry Jarrett not being in with the money and TV ratings he drew as a booker in a smaller market from 67-87, and the Atlanta run, and as a bonus developing Dundee as a booker to pop Watts's business and Dutch with Puerto Rico. Seems egregious. I know my bias but it has lead to me being more educated on the subject and feeling more passionate about it.

Memphis TV ratings are tremendously impressive but it's not a top 20 market in the US.  Jarrett made a ton of money but was also known for not paying out a lot.  He'd probably be in already on my ballot but Meltzer has never loved the Memphis style and thus hasn't given the push that someone who is not in the 50% range to get over that final hump.

[Ricky Jackson]

I thought Meltzer was a big Memphis fan back in the day, no? 

[NintendoLogic]

In the early days of the newsletter, he compared Memphis wrestling to indoor soccer. It wasn't really soccer, but he liked it more than actual soccer.

[InYourCase]

I'm not sure what it's going to take to get people to vote CIMA in, but there's no one on the ballot more deserving than CIMA. Just a brief overview: 

-Worked on top of the #2 promotion in Japan for 15 years. When he split in May, attendance dipped rapidly. 

-Since leaving, he's worked in Wrestle-1 and DDT and has spiked interest. Is easily the best draw W-1 has ever had. He's semi-main eventing DDT's biggest show of the year in a few weeks. 

-I had him in my 30's for GWE. He's a generational talent who doesn't have bad matches with anyone. Can do lucha grappling, can fly, can work the contemporary super puro style. He's proven he can do it all. 

-Jack Evans, Matt Sydal, PAC, Ricochet, Rich Swann, and Apollo Crews would not have been signed without CIMA. There is a clear "before CIMA' and "after CIMA" difference with these wrestlers. 

I can always go more in-depth if anyone has interest or wants to discuss it, but I fully understand that PWO is more concerned about lucha guys getting in (and I don't think that's wrong of them) 

[NintendoLogic]

I agree that CIMA is probably a stronger HOF candidate than is given credit for around these parts. The Dragon Gate style has proven to be highly influential, and the decline in DG's business since he went to China shows that he is an appreciable draw. I wouldn't go to bat for him, but I wouldn't necessarily argue against him either.

[jushin muta liger]

On 9/30/2018 at 5:53 AM, ohtani's jacket said:

Sometimes folks lobby Dave to put a name on the ballot. At other times Dave does it on a whim. I'm 99% sure that Fujiwara is on the ballot simply because Dave wanted to confirm his own inkling that Japanese-based voters wouldn't vote for him. 

I'm curious who makes up the pool of Japanese based voters (even the Mexican based voters as well) if Fredo doesn't have a vote. I'm stating the obvious that the Observer HOF is flawed but there's more problems to it than ever before. 

[elliott]

Quote

I'm not sure what it's going to take to get people to vote CIMA in, but there's no one on the ballot more deserving than CIMA. Just a brief overview: 

 

Oh cool. I've always thought of CIMA as an interesting candidate just as an outsider. I haven't followed his promotion since the very early 2000s and have only seen a few matches here and there past that. He stands out in my memories of someone who was really great when I watched it, but greater interest in other styles drew me away from him and the promotions he worked in. The few things I've read about him do intrigue me and I'd love to see a detailed case.

 

Quote

-Worked on top of the #2 promotion in Japan for 15 years. When he split in May, attendance dipped rapidly. 

Was Dragon Gate the #2 promotion in Japan for the entire 15 years? If not, how long was it the #2 promotion? What did they draw on average? What were some of their biggest shows? What are some of the company's biggest/most memorable matches? Was CIMA in all/most/some of them? Was he the undisputed top draw of the company or more of a package with other guys? My impression was always that Dragon Gate was a stable based company with numerous folks cycled in and out of the main events. Was CIMA the fixture?

 

Quote

Since leaving, he's worked in Wrestle-1 and DDT and has spiked interest. Is easily the best draw W-1 has ever had. He's semi-main eventing DDT's biggest show of the year in a few weeks. 

 

How big are these shows?

Quote

-I had him in my 30's for GWE. He's a generational talent who doesn't have bad matches with anyone. Can do lucha grappling, can fly, can work the contemporary super puro style. He's proven he can do it all. 

Recommend me some matches. One of my big disappointments from the Greatest Matches Project is we don't have anyone pimping Dragon Gate stuff. CIMA always stood out in the late 90s and early 00s as one of the most interesting and best of the new wave of juniors. I'd love to see his biggest and best matches.

 

Quote

-Jack Evans, Matt Sydal, PAC, Ricochet, Rich Swann, and Apollo Crews would not have been signed without CIMA. There is a clear "before CIMA' and "after CIMA" difference with these wrestlers. 

Can you speak more to the importance of this?

Quote

 I can always go more in-depth if anyone has interest or wants to discuss it, but I fully understand that PWO is more concerned about lucha guys getting in (and I don't think that's wrong of them) 

Please do and thank you!

 

[joeg]

To me the argument for CIMA getting in is similar to the argument for Ibushi and Hayabusa. Smaller guys who did good business anchoring  smaller promotions and the promotions suffered Attendance wise when they left. I don’t think that means they should get in before Akiyama or Taue. Guys who main evented in promotions with network TV and that drew 10s of thousands of fans for big shows. Not to mention all of the big name luchadors, Goldberg who should get in on selling out the Georgia Dome alone, Jarrett, etc.

[WrestlingPower]

CIMA really should get in on work alone.  And even though supposedly someone can get in on work alone, that doesn't seem to be the case in practice.  It seems there's an unstated criteria that your great work had to be done in meaningful, top level promotions.  This is getting a bit into the "historiography" as mentioned.  It seems like CIMA, Chris Hero, Chris Daniels, great workers who have had long careers are penalized for not making it in the big leagues.  It seems like Dragon Gate has always been kind of snubbed by more "mainstream" Observer reader types as something that's mainly spot monkeys doing spot matches.  It's weird though that whenever Dave has covered Dragon Gate and its excursions to the US lots of stars were thrown around but the promotion itself never was seen as important enough in the grand scheme of the landscape for Dave to cover it regularly.  If Dave had been doing monthly reviews of the TV in the Observer, no doubt CIMA would have gone in right away.

 

I'd be curious to read some more stats & analysis behind the claim that DG has been Japan's #2 promotion for that length of time.  Seems like in Observer world, regardless of who is #2, it's largely been irrelevant since Japanese coverage has been NJ and not much else for years now.

[InYourCase]

On 10/4/2018 at 7:33 PM, elliott said:

 

Oh cool. I've always thought of CIMA as an interesting candidate just as an outsider. I haven't followed his promotion since the very early 2000s and have only seen a few matches here and there past that. He stands out in my memories of someone who was really great when I watched it, but greater interest in other styles drew me away from him and the promotions he worked in. The few things I've read about him do intrigue me and I'd love to see a detailed case.

 

Was Dragon Gate the #2 promotion in Japan for the entire 15 years? If not, how long was it the #2 promotion? What did they draw on average? What were some of their biggest shows? What are some of the company's biggest/most memorable matches? Was CIMA in all/most/some of them? Was he the undisputed top draw of the company or more of a package with other guys? My impression was always that Dragon Gate was a stable based company with numerous folks cycled in and out of the main events. Was CIMA the fixture?

 

 

How big are these shows?

Recommend me some matches. One of my big disappointments from the Greatest Matches Project is we don't have anyone pimping Dragon Gate stuff. CIMA always stood out in the late 90s and early 00s as one of the most interesting and best of the new wave of juniors. I'd love to see his biggest and best matches.

 

Can you speak more to the importance of this?

Please do and thank you!

 

Sorry it's taken me so long to get back to you. 

I think it is a safe bet to say that Dragon Gate was the #2 promotion from 2009-onwards, maybe even a little sooner because New Japan was in such rough shape at the tail end of the 2000's. By 2011 they are a definitive #2 behind New Japan and have remained that way ever since. There are some that will argue that DDT is as big, if not bigger than Dragon Gate, but DDT continues to be unable to draw outside of Tokyo. They had some ridiculous Korakuen sellout streak (1,850 a month) that was ended when CIMA left the company. I want to say the streak went for over 2 years, but I am not 100% positive when it started. All I know is that I started following Dragon Gate religiously in 2013 and since then, it has been a very rare occurrence that DG has not sold out Korakuen, and again, the sellout streak officially ended after CIMA left the company. 

Outside of the monthly Korakuens which are a big part of their business, they run 5 big PPV-like shows a year, with the biggest being their Kobe World show in July. Prior to this summer, numbers have always been inflated for these shows so it is impossible to say for sure what numbers they were doing, but I've never heard any rumors about shows flopping at the gate before CIMA left. I firmly believe that they were drawing 6-8K at Kobe World Hall every July for an extended period of time, even if they were saying 8-10K. 

Dragon Gate is based around units, but the leaders of those units are always the true draws. CIMA has always been the figurehead of the company. There have been numerous times where myself or other Western fans have criticized CIMA for putting himself over, but the fact is he has always drawn. That is backed up by the fact that his appearances in DDT and W-1 have immediately become the most popular videos on their YouTube pages ever, and in W-1, droves of people are leaving their shows after his matches. People are paying specifically to see CIMA and his new Strong Hearts unit. 

W-1 has never drawn and now their big shows with CIMA are seeing a spike in attendance. He's the semi-main at the DDT Sumo Hall show this week, and that show is probably the biggest annual non-NJPW show in Japan every year at this point. The fact that he came right into the company and was announced for a semi-main match against Konosuke Takeshita (DDT's golden boy) is a huge deal. I believe I was told that there was a spike in ticket sales after CIMA was announced, but I'd have to double check with someone that follows DDT closer. 

In terms of his influence, I listed guys that have had successful careers in large part due to CIMA. The career of Jack Evans alone does not make CIMA a HOFer, but with guys like him, PAC, and Ricochet, they would have NEVER reached the heights they would have without CIMA. The gaijins that last in Dragon Gate have all eventually elevated their careers in a big way. He also gets credit for training Shingo Takagi, who I had in my Top 15 for GWE. Takagi was the first graduate of the Dragon Gate Dojo and for a very long time was the #2 in the promotion behind CIMA. It's funny now, as the two have real life heat and it is mostly due to the way Takagi wrestles. CIMA hates his style and said that if Takagi's style ever became the house style, the promotion would soon fold. That's just a small anecdote. 

Amazingly, I think CIMA's weakest category is his in-ring. There is a great debate in the DG community over what CIMA's greatest singles match is, because no one seems to have a truly good answer. We just discovered that CIMA has a shockingly low amount of singles matches in Korakuen Hall, which is shocking considering that he's wrestled there on a monthly basis for 20 years now. The stock answer on CIMA's best singles match is his 2015 bout with the aforementioned Takagi. Takagi was on a run as champion where he was taking down Dragon Gate's first generation of stars (CIMA, Don Fujii, Masaaki Mochizuki) and it concluded with this match against CIMA where towards the end, CIMA starts to do his buddies signature moves to try to overcome Takagi. It's a beautiful match. 

I'm always amazed that the PWO-type crowd isn't more into CIMA because he wrestles in such a different way than most contemporary puro stars. He works a lot of "TV style matches" and eventually builds to these epics with crazy callbacks, including his work in tags and trios. I'll try to dig up some DG gems to post here, but this match from July was brilliantly laid out. Having watched hundreds and hundreds of CIMA matches over the years, this match felt like he was calling all of the shots. This match basically felt like his vision of pro wrestling. One of my favorite matches of the year. 

And finally, I think reducing him the level of Hayabusa is completely unfair. Every aspect of his case is stronger. Ibushi I can't speak on because there's so much more to unfold there, but if CIMA retired tomorrow, the puro industry would suffer as a result. He is a legend. If he was in a company that was respected by the Japanese press or was covered consistently by Dave, he would have gone in two years ago. I want to make it clear that if I could vote, I'd be voting for Akiyama (and probably Taue) but even if CIMA wasn't selling out Budokan Hall monthly, he's never been on top of a sinking promotion like Akiyama. Taue was never the main draw in All Japan. Akiyama doesn't have the influence CIMA has because to my knowledge he isn't a renounced trainer and for God knows what reason, he's never caught on with Western fans the way that Kobashi, Misawa, and Kawada have. He smokes Taue in influence. Forget it. I think CIMA is overall a better worker than Taue, and not far off from being a better worker than Akiyama. 

The last thing I'll say is that Joe Gagne brought up a good point when he mentioned that he won't be voting for CIMA this year because he wants to see how the Strong Hearts invasions play out. That is entirely fair,  and to me it's the only logical reason not to vote for CIMA, because he's arguably having his best business year ever this year. Still, I think he's already done more than enough to warrant getting in. 

Sorry this was so long. 

 

[W2BTD]

From what I understand, the DDT Sumo Hall show is very likely going to sell out, which is huge for DDT, and the real drawing match on that show is CIMA vs Takeshita (the company ace) even if it's officially slotted as the semi. Tickets sales spiked when the match was announced, and it's considered a dream match of sorts.

DDT posts their weekly TV show on YoutTube, and the two episodes featuring CIMA's invasion angle & match are by far the most viewed eps by a mile. 40-50k views for what typically averages about 1,000 or so. 

Same for the Wrestle-1 invasion (CIMA is working invasion angles in both places). It's spiking their YT, and as InYourCase mentioned, CIMA is popping a dying promotions houses to the point that fans are leaving in droves after his matches end. 

Combined with the DG Korakuen streak ending (it was way longer than two years) and overall attendance plummeting since he left, the old narrative of DG drawing as a collective has sort of been destroyed. It's pretty clear CIMA was pulling the cart to a significant degree. A HOF degree? That's for voters to decide, but we have ample evidence this year that CIMA wasnt simply a cog in the DG wheel.

[elliott]

18 hours ago, InYourCase said:

 

Sorry this was so long. 

 

 

No no! This is awesome and exactly what I was hoping for! Thank you so much. I'm still at work so I'll read through this thoroughly in a few hours and I'm sure I'll come back with more questions. Thank you again for taking the time to do a write up! 

[cheapshot]

My ballot:

I FOLLOWED THE HISTORICAL PERFORMERS ERA CANDIDATES X

Sputnik Monroe
Enrique Torres
Von Brauners & Saul Weingeroff
Johnny "Wrestling II" Walker
Bearcat Wright
Wild Bull Curry  
 
I FOLLOWED THE MODERN PERFORMERS IN U.S/CANADA CANDIDATES X

Junkyard Dog

I FOLLOWED WRESTLING IN EUROPE/AUSTRALIA/NEW ZEALAND/PACIFIC ISLANDS/AFRICA X

Big Daddy
Jackie Pallo
Mario Milano  

NON-WRESTLERS 

Stanley Weston  
Jim Crockett Jr.
Howard Finkel
Jimmy Hart
Jerry Jarrett