Ridiculous quotes from WO.com columnists

[Bix]

John Laurinaitis has wrestled as the lowest level babyface in WCW and got a top spot in All Japan by having sex with Motoko Baba before jumping to WCW as an agent so he could be around when the WWF bought the company, as well as advancing up WWE's corporate ladder by charming Stephanie McMahon. When the rest of you do that, then perhaps you can be WWE head of talent relations.

 

Also, it's pretty hilarious to see Bryan acting like writing for the WO/F4W site is prestigious when the "columns" (Dave's weird blind spot) are stuff he never reads and wouldn't post with full control of the site.

[Beast]

Not defending Todd, but why the hell do any of you continue to read his reviews if you have so much disdain for him. I don't read them or listen to his appearances on Bryan's show because I know it'll be a waste of my time. Are you all such masochists that you need to click on his weekly rantings?

 

And in all seriousness, write a recap yourself and send it in to WO/F4W and prove you can do it better. No excuses like "I don't care to" "Bryan won't post it" "Who gives a fuck about being on that site", if you are all such better, funnier, smarter writers than Martin than your work should be so outstanding that Dave or Bryan will have no choice but to post it. You've made a huge topic about how shitty the writers are, prove you can make it on there as well.

[S.L.L.]

Not defending Todd, but why the hell do any of you continue to read his reviews if you have so much disdain for him. I don't read them or listen to his appearances on Bryan's show because I know it'll be a waste of my time. Are you all such masochists that you need to click on his weekly rantings?

Do it for me, TV Tropes!

 

Bile Fascination

 

There's Hype Aversion, when numerous people's rabid touting of the latest masterpiece deter you from rushing out and buying it. And then there's the reverse phenomenon, when numerous people's rabid panning of the latest uber-stinker, complete with detailed lists on why you should never, ever, ever buy this piece of dung actually fill you with the masochistic urge to rush out and buy it just to see if it's that bad.

 

It's like hearing about the train wreck of the century: Your better sensibilities are repulsed at the thought of it, and yet part of you wants to see that wreck in all its magnificent destruction. You want to see just how gloriously terrible it must be for all the high-profile people to be expressing their horror over it.

 

Don't feel ashamed about it; it's the natural foil to our obsession with the best of the best. Just as we want to know how high in brilliance art can rise, we also want to know how low it can sink in sheer awfulness. Plus the fact that reviews spewing bile over the many ways something stinks tend to be far more entertaining to read than reviews extolling the virtues of the latest Oscar Bait.

Personally, most of the Todd Martin stuff I read is actually just people C&Ping his choicest material to boards like this, but the bottom line is that there are lot of people out there with lame opinions on wrestling that are kinda commonplace and bland. I don't care about those. But someone as stupid as Martin makes you stand up and pay attention.

 

And in all seriousness, write a recap yourself and send it in to WO/F4W and prove you can do it better. No excuses like "I don't care to" "Bryan won't post it" "Who gives a fuck about being on that site", if you are all such better, funnier, smarter writers than Martin than your work should be so outstanding that Dave or Bryan will have no choice but to post it. You've made a huge topic about how shitty the writers are, prove you can make it on there as well.

Why? I've got nothing to prove. Not to brag, but the list of stuff I've written online that's not better than the best article Martin has ever written is very short, and it's not like I haven't written a fair amount of dreck when I wasn't writing the Wrestling Death Apologist BINGO Card, my analysis of Wade Keller's new concept for TNA, and the KENTA/Nakajima "reality vs. realism" argument. Granted none of those things got published on WO.com/F4Wonline, but this isn't really about "proving we can make it on there as well". If I sent in a piece to the site, whether it got published or not, Todd Martin would still be a hack. Point of the thread is that the guys writing for the site are, by and large, hacks. Our ability or lack thereof to join their ranks changes nothing.

[Phil Schneider]

SLL has written for Segunda Caida. Telling him he needs to publish on the WON page is like telling someone who wrote for the New Yorker to go write for US Weekly

[Childs]

SLL has written for Segunda Caida. Telling him he needs to publish on the WON page is like telling someone who wrote for the New Yorker to go write for US Weekly

I knew that if I followed the interwebs for long enough, I'd see Segunda Caida compared to the New Yorker.

[Beast]

SLL has written for Segunda Caida. Telling him he needs to publish on the WON page is like telling someone who wrote for the New Yorker to go write for US Weekly

If Todd Martin wrote for any other site, I'm sure there wouldn't be a weekly discussion of his column here. No one holds his column up as a high standard of wrestling reporting, but it's not really that bad either. It's mediocre and not important. Since it's on the Observer site, you all mock it. Raw is not very good, compared to what it has been and could be, so he doesn't like Raw, sometimes for stupid reasons, but getting on him for not digging commercial parodies is a reach.

 

I'm saying there's no one stopping you all from submitting work to that site. This topic is about shitty columnists who get their work posted on that site because no one else is trying to. You're kicking guys who are already down. No one reads the site for them. You're all just coming off as the guys watching the neighborhood baseball game who are ragging on all the players while sitting on the sidelines. I don't care if you write for other sites, if you're going to spend so much time ragging on one particular site (and if this one site is of so much importance to you) just put your money where your mouth is and write something up and submit it. Otherwise, stop commenting about the shitty content that like I said, no one reads the site for.

[Bix]

I get paid to write about wrestling now. The F4W site isn't worth my time. Also, have had stuff posted there, including a really transparent parody that I once sent to all the news sites under a pseudonym, but doesn't appear to be up on the F4W or Torch sites anymore and survives where someone quoted it in a forum post.

 

Most of the time, I don't seek out Martin's recaps. If I suspect he'll write something really stupid, I will. Otherwise, I'll wait for kjh or Cox or whoever to post something here. So yeah, the whole "bile fascination" thing. Plus, as TomK has so eloquently put it in the past, Dave's a guy who openly makes fun of Scott Keith (which is something that he generally doesn't do to writers other than the misplaced Josh Gross criticism and the infamous "Wade Keller and I do completely different jobs" stuff) and has filled his site with an army of Scott Keiths.

 

I don't wanna speak for everyone, but as someone who regularly talks to the people who post the most stuff in these threads, we hate that Dave devalues his brand so much by putting this stuff up on his site and posts anything sent to him that's more than a certain length as a "column." People have talked about sending Dave long-ish emails that Dave posted as "columns" instead of mailbag entries. Hell, in the post-RF bust fallout, Dave accidentally outed an indy promoter once by posting a private email where he talked about how his family didn't know he was gay and went on tangents about how he generally pushed the twink types that he's attracted to. He pulled it several hours later, but this is the level of obliviousness we're dealing with. Dave is a nice guy, but he could have severely fucked up this promoter's family life by making such a stupid error. He did the same thing recently with that Lance Storm email about Ken Anderson, but at least it didn't have the implications of the previous incident.

 

Also, a lot of us generally get annoyed by Dave handing out HOF ballots based on this crap when we can all name more qualified posters on this forum and others. I feel like I have to reiterate this with Martin: He's an HOF voter who, until recently, had no idea what The A-Team was, even though it was largely responsible for the success of the WWF in the '80s.

 

Oh, and don't make me write about Joe Babinsack again.

[Beast]

Ok, well said. I can get on board with pretty much everything you wrote.

[Boondocks Kernoodle]

For what it's worth, Dave didn't bash Keith based on the opinionz4u aspect of his writing, but rather all of the erroneous facts he gets e-mails about stating "Well Scott Keith said..."

[Bob Morris]

The larger point that needs to be made is that part of discussing any subject means you are going to be critical or make fun of stuff that is bad as much as you praise the stuff that is good. And even if I don't go out of the way to read everything Todd Martin says, when certain posters post the silly things Martin says, I most certainly roll my eyes at it.

 

The facts are clear that TV commercials are ripe for parody and are parodied frequently. One can argue whether the parody is done well, but to just brush off all and any such parodies as "low brow entertainment" is just dumb, especially since not only has SNL had some great commercial parodies, but Johnny Carson did plenty of them as well when he hosted The Tonight Show, plus I'm sure Bob Hope did plenty of them on his NBC specials.

 

And while I don't watch that much TV, I know darn well what the current Mastercard promotion is (and having watched plenty of NFL, I particularly love the one with Peyton Manning), so yes, it's ripe for parody because it's so widely known. Obscure or failed campaigns, on the other hand, are a different story (think Herb appearing at Wrestlemania).

[jdw]

I'm saying there's no one stopping you all from submitting work to that site. This topic is about shitty columnists who get their work posted on that site because no one else is trying to. You're kicking guys who are already down. No one reads the site for them. You're all just coming off as the guys watching the neighborhood baseball game who are ragging on all the players while sitting on the sidelines. I don't care if you write for other sites, if you're going to spend so much time ragging on one particular site (and if this one site is of so much importance to you) just put your money where your mouth is and write something up and submit it. Otherwise, stop commenting about the shitty content that like I said, no one reads the site for.

I expect to see something like that from a writer of a newspaper or someone on the tube railing against criticism on the internet.

 

I don't expect to see it from someone who is on the internet.

 

The net simply gives of the ability to share our throughts with a wide public just like we did in the past within our tight circle of friend.

 

Don't like whats happening with the Yankees? Yankees Fans use to complain about it to their friends, co-workers or call in talk radio. Now they can just post it on a board. Are the Steinbrenners stupid enough to say, "If you don't like how we run our team, do root for the Red Sox"? I mean... for fuck's sake, only idiots would through that out. Same if a Yankees Mark told a Bitter Mean Spirited Yankees Fan that if he was that unhappy, he should go root for the Deil Rays. The fuck?!?!

 

Life is full of criticism. We are _all_ critical of things, even stuff that we like or we keep doing it. I'm a fucking broken record on this, but I also keep running into people pretending that they aren't the same as us "critical obsessive bastards". Jesus christ... go into the other forum and read the recaps of Dave ripping the WWF in the 80s. Was it in any way valid for a reader of his to write in and say, "If you don't like the WWF stop watching it, Dave"? Just mindfuckingly dumb.

 

We're freaking wrestling fans. We watch wrestling. We read about it. We talk about it. We write about it. We praise what we like. We rip what we think is crap.

 

Baseball fans do the same shit. Go onto a baseball boards and you'll find far stronger things that what we write.

 

Wrestling *writers* do the same thing. How many years has Dave been sticking a hot poker up the ass of Michael Cole for various failings that Dave sees in him? A decade now?

 

Todd has spent close to a decade ripping the shit out of the failings he sees in the WWE. If he can do that, he needs to get big enough balls to accept that people will be critical of him as well.

 

As should his readers.

 

Especially since we're all on the net and we know that it's there for us to toss out what we think.

 

John

[Boondocks Kernoodle]

SLL has written for Segunda Caida. Telling him he needs to publish on the WON page is like telling someone who wrote for the New Yorker to go write for US Weekly

This might be a little self-serving.

[Log]

the KENTA/Nakajima "reality vs. realism" argument

Where can I find this?

[Bix]

the KENTA/Nakajima "reality vs. realism" argument

Where can I find this?

 

http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?show...p;#entry5438353

[S.L.L.]

One can argue whether the parody is done well, but to just brush off all and any such parodies as "low brow entertainment" is just dumb, especially since not only has SNL had some great commercial parodies, but Johnny Carson did plenty of them as well when he hosted The Tonight Show, plus I'm sure Bob Hope did plenty of them on his NBC specials.

Not to mention that he's complaining about the presence of lowbrow entertainment on a wrestling show. Does he realize the implication there? Does he actually believe wrestling is highbrow? Higher than commercials, even?

[Log]

the KENTA/Nakajima "reality vs. realism" argument

Where can I find this?

 

http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?show...p;#entry5438353

 

Oh, yeah. I read that. Good stuff.

 

Funny that I just watched Koshinaka/Yamada from the NJ 80's set. Basically a shorter version of the Kenta/Nakajima thing. Yamada goes to town on Kosh's leg, even taking off his boot for added damage. A few minutes later, Koshinaka's up and doing jumping tombstones, etc.

[sek69]

More Todd Martin related hilarity:

 

Hart Dynasty beat William Regal and Vladimir Kozlov. The heels very briefly worked on Tyson Kidd. Kidd got the tag to David Hart Smith and they hit the Hart attack on Regal shortly thereafter for the pin. After the match the Usos and Sarona Snuka (unidentified by the announcers) attacked the Hart Dynasty and Natalya. All three hit simultaneous top rope splashes. I hope they can talk or work because they don’t have a major league look at all.

I know he takes pride in not knowing about anything that took place in the 80s, but has he never seen a Samoan in the WWF/E before? Hell, did he forget about Umaga already? The Usos are pretty similar looks-wise to their uncle's gimmick.

[Wahoos Leg]

I just did a brief search of the F4W board and all I could find in defense of Todd by Bryan was:

 

Todd Martin has written for CBS Sportsline, Sports Illustrated, this website, and appears regularly on The Fight Show and Mauro Ranallo's radio show. When the rest of you do that then perhaps you will also get weekly shows.

 

Those media outlets accept articles written in crayon? Who knew?

[Slasher]

More Todd Martin related hilarity:

 

Hart Dynasty beat William Regal and Vladimir Kozlov. The heels very briefly worked on Tyson Kidd. Kidd got the tag to David Hart Smith and they hit the Hart attack on Regal shortly thereafter for the pin. After the match the Usos and Sarona Snuka (unidentified by the announcers) attacked the Hart Dynasty and Natalya. All three hit simultaneous top rope splashes. I hope they can talk or work because they don’t have a major league look at all.

I know he takes pride in not knowing about anything that took place in the 80s, but has he never seen a Samoan in the WWF/E before? Hell, did he forget about Umaga already? The Usos are pretty similar looks-wise to their uncle's gimmick.

 

I assume because they didn't really look like the prototypical Samoans. They were sort of skinny and one of them nearly crotched himself trying to climb the ropes. I don't have high hopes for these guys.

[rovert]

I assume because they didn't really look like the prototypical Samoans. They were sort of skinny and one of them nearly crotched himself trying to climb the ropes. I don't have high hopes for these guys.

But Manu (remember him) was so successful.

[EricR]

I thought Manu looked really good in the...3, maybe 4 televised matches he got. Real shame that he had a pissy little attitude and got canned so quick. Any idea what he's been up to post WWE?

[Dan]

Semi-serious curiosity: Did Todd review the 4-21-08 Raw - the one where McCain, Hilary and Obama appeared? I'd be funny if he feigned ignorance on that one. "Does WWE actually expect me to care about these people? Not everyone has a political science degree"

[Marty]

Semi-serious curiosity: Did Todd review the 4-21-08 Raw - the one where McCain, Hilary and Obama appeared? I'd be funny if he feigned ignorance on that one. "Does WWE actually expect me to care about these people? Not everyone has a political science degree"

http://toddwmartin.blogspot.com/2008/04/raw-report_21.html

 

The Big News: WWE actually convinced the presidential candidates to cut pro wrestling style promos for Raw. And then proceeded to make fun of them.

They aired short comments from each of the presidential candidates, who incorporated WWE talking points into their speeches. You can read the text of Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama’s remarks at CNN’s political ticker. As for John McCain, he managed to get in Rock, Ric Flair, Hulk Hogan, HHH, Undertaker and Steve Austin references. I can’t believe they got the presidential candidates to do this.

Even after the presidential candidates endorsed WWE programming, WWE still couldn’t resist making fun of them. They had a faux match with Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama. The Hillary impersonator came out with Bill to Hogan’s music. Bill kept posing in front of Hillary while she tried to speak.

 

Obama then came out to Rock’s music with big fake ears. Hillary gave Obama the leg drop, but Obama kicked out. Obama hit the rock bottom and went for the people’s elbow, but Bill tripped him. He added, “I didn’t have illegal contact with that candidate. Umaga then came out and gave both the Samoan spike. This was dumb and unfunny, but it wasn’t offensive or unwatchable either.

For this, his comments weren't terrible or anything.

[kjh]

Todd Martin's blog archive is your friend! :-)

 

They aired short comments from each of the presidential candidates, who incorporated WWE talking points into their speeches. You can read the text of Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama’s remarks at CNN’s political ticker. As for John McCain, he managed to get in Rock, Ric Flair, Hulk Hogan, HHH, Undertaker and Steve Austin references. I can’t believe they got the presidential candidates to do this.

Even after the presidential candidates endorsed WWE programming, WWE still couldn’t resist making fun of them. They had a faux match with Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama. The Hillary impersonator came out with Bill to Hogan’s music. Bill kept posing in front of Hillary while she tried to speak.

 

Obama then came out to Rock’s music with big fake ears. Hillary gave Obama the leg drop, but Obama kicked out. Obama hit the rock bottom and went for the people’s elbow, but Bill tripped him. He added, “I didn’t have illegal contact with that candidate. Umaga then came out and gave both the Samoan spike. This was dumb and unfunny, but it wasn’t offensive or unwatchable either.

Un-Freaking-Believable

 

On WWE.com, they've got Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama and John McCain cutting wrestling promos on each other.

 

I don't even know what to say. I cannot believe they got them to do this.

 

The actual comments:

 

“Hi. I’m Hillary Clinton but tonight in honor of the WWE you can call me Hill Rod. This election is starting to feel a lot like King of the Ring. The only difference: the last man standing may just be a woman.”

 

“To the special interests who’ve been setting the agenda for too long and for all the forces of division and distraction that have stopped us from making progress, for the American people, I’ve got one question. Do you smell what Barack is cooking?”

 

“Looks like Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama want to settle their differences in the ring. Well, that’s fine with me. But let me tell you, if you want to be the man you have to beat the man. Come November, it’ll be game over. And watcha gonna do when John McCain and all his McCainiacs run wild on you?”

Speaking of politics, I was amused by his rant of Matt Taibbi of the Rolling Stone that I happened to stumble on:

 

I was reading the new Rolling Stone today, and I think my dislike for this guy reached new heights.

 

For those who don't know, Taibbi is a political writer for Rolling Stone. His columns are distinctive in just how mean-spirited and nasty they are. He tears apart everyone and everything, with his barbs seemingly being 1/4 critique and 3/4 simple ad hominem making fun. But what makes the pieces at least borderline tolerable is he usually targets people in the public eye that deserve the criticism if not the invective.

 

Well the piece I read today wasn't about those sorts of people. It was apparently an excerpt from a book he has written, and the excerpt talked about him joining a megachurch so he could report on what went on there. But he clearly didn't enter to observe; he came in to ridicule and little else. The article has him making fun of the people in the megachurch for dressing badly, for losing their hair, for being lonely, for being inarticulate, for being overweight. If he recognized these people were having trouble and were looking for something, one would think he would be sympathetic. But instead he heaped on the insults with the same smug arrogance that he heaps on the insults towards Hillary Clinton, John McCain, Rudy Giuliani, Barack Obama and just about every politician on Earth.

 

I think it's really a sad commentary that he has become successful pandering to the worst in human beings, but it seems to me a growing trend in a digital age where you can say anything over the internet about anyone with no consequence or accountability. But while I understand the cathartic power people get out of being nasty in a one-way forum, I don't understand why people enjoy reading those sorts of rantings. And both groups are pretty sad in my book.

 

Here's to Taibbi one day getting the comeuppance for his nastiness.

[anarchistxx]

Not watched Raw for years; were these people impersonating the politicians, or were the USA presidential candidates actually live on Raw making references to wrestlers? Pretty astonishing if it's the latter, especially for a company with the drug and death and health problems that WWE faced in those years.