KawadaSmile Posted October 10, 2022 Report Share Posted October 10, 2022 21 minutes ago, El-P said: Saw Bray Wyatt's return. Man, that shit was soooo fucking cursed. Good luck people. He's over in the same way Fight Club is over with fucking clueless dudebros. 11 hours ago, strobogo said: Everything Bray Wyatt related and adjacent has been some of the worst shit of all time since around the end of 2014. Only two people managed to avoid that STENCH on them: Roman Reigns and Bryan Danielson. Not coincidentally, they were responsible for giving Bray his best matches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NintendoLogic Posted October 10, 2022 Report Share Posted October 10, 2022 Bray Wyatt has always sucked, but I think the degree to which he hurts the people he feuds with is a bit overstated. The only ones who were damaged to the point where they had to turn were Seth Rollins and Miz, who are garbage babyfaces to begin with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted October 10, 2022 Report Share Posted October 10, 2022 2 hours ago, KawadaSmile said: fucking clueless dudebros. Isn't that Matt Riddle's audience ? Everything about Riddle triggers me, even before the rape accusations. I know he's a great worker, but damn, he's basically a synthesis of everything I loathe. The good thing about Wyatt's comeback is that at least people around here will finally leave Kross alone for a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMJ Posted October 10, 2022 Report Share Posted October 10, 2022 - Just finished the show. Thought most of it was in the fine-to-good range. - The opener was the best match on the show and it really wasn't all that close. - I'd be curious to know who the agent/producer was for the Rousey/Morgan match. We knew this wasn't going to be a MOTY candidate, but there were some very bad choices made on the agent/producer end that didn't help. First, you have a simple story to tell, so tell that story (and just try to do it well). Yes, Morgan has somehow snuck away with two wins over Rousey, but this is still David vs. Goliath and Morgan, to gain control, needed to have some sort of lucky weapons shot early to re-establish why Rousey can't just destroy her. I know Rousey's aura is not what it once was, but Liv Morgan is still not at the level to be booked like her equal. But even that wasn't as offensive as the actual ending, which saw Morgan inexplicably smile as Rousey forced her to submit/pass out. So now Morgan is, like, into pain? Like a creepy masochist gimmick? Its not a remotely original idea anyway and it made Rousey's win feel lesser and was distracting and just plain dumb. - I expected a bit more creativity in the Bayley/Bianca match. The best spot was Bayley's running elbow drop onto the ladder when it was set up between the barricade the steps. It looked great and felt like something we haven't seen before. Second best was probably the KOD with the ladder. To me, this match needed a touch more of that and less of the same ol' spots we get in every ladder match. I also think they suffered just a touch from an audience that is now really, really expecting Sasha and Naomi to show up at any time. (The same thing happened in the main event as it felt like a segment of the audience was more focused on Bray's predicted return and not Rollins/Riddle.) - We can all hate on Wyatt all we want, but let's not deny how over he can be at times. This past Saturday was one of those times and I expect he'll continue to get huge reactions and sell a ton of merch for weeks to come. The Undertaker sucked for longer than he was good. Kane sucked forever. But these characters undeniably made the company money. I'm okay with Wyatt getting his 15 minutes of screen time every week. But, like Taker in the 90s, they need to really cater his feuds and storylines and, for the most part, keep him separate from championships and "serious" wrestlers. Like, literally do what they did with Taker and bring in oddities and monsters for him to feud with. I'm not sure who the Kamala-of-2022 is on the indie scene, but bring in whoever that is. Bring back The Boogeyman. Don't treat Wyatt like a regular performer and instead treat him like a TV character designed to sell tee-shirts to the people who actually like the gimmick. These people are not interested in workrate or technical ability or traditional wrestling. They want the spectacle. They want the entrance. Give them that without sacrificing the credibility of other valuable wrestlers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Embrodak Posted October 10, 2022 Report Share Posted October 10, 2022 6 hours ago, strobogo said: Agreed. But by the end of 2014 and feud with Dean Ambrose, shit was dire and only got worse from there. I guess the cage match with Cena is probably a sign of how bad things were going to go for that character. His debut match on the main roster was an inferno match with Kane, dude had bad augurs all over the place. If not for the Shield/Wyatt family matches, and interacting with Danielson when he was a goddamn nuclear reactor, I don't think people would have any positive memories of Wyatt whatsoever. I'll cop to having been taken in by some of the early promos, but how the hell are people excited by someone whose gimmick is "spooky and crazy, but also able to coordinate the activities of a solid dozen production professionals and get it approved by the office". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KawadaSmile Posted October 10, 2022 Report Share Posted October 10, 2022 3 hours ago, El-P said: Isn't that Matt Riddle's audience ? Everything about Riddle triggers me, even before the rape accusations. I know he's a great worker, but damn, he's basically a synthesis of everything I loathe. The good thing about Wyatt's comeback is that at least people around here will finally leave Kross alone for a while. Hey, dudebros watch Fight Club and think "this is what men should aspire to be like bro Brad Pitt is such a fucking badass bro" and more often than not there is this overlap with the pothead MMA douchebag demo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Migs Posted October 11, 2022 Report Share Posted October 11, 2022 21 hours ago, DMJ said: I'm not sure who the Kamala-of-2022 is on the indie scene, but bring in whoever that is. Beastman, from Deepest Darkest West Virginia. (This is real and he's actually pretty fun. Yes, I'm serious. Okay, mostly serious.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMJ Posted October 11, 2022 Report Share Posted October 11, 2022 Just google'd him. Yeah, he looks fine. Sign him. A friend also mentioned Karrion Kross as a great first guy to squash. That's the best idea I've heard. Kross is going nowhere unless he can discover a personality. I just don't see him connecting with the audience in any sort of way, especially on a roster that is already crowded with solid heels, including people I don't even think are all that great like Baron Corbin. Kross would benefit from a foil that can inject some life into his act and maybe even force him to discover whatever's "missing." I know Gunther was a can't miss prospect, but damn if this rivalry with Sheamus hasn't clearly pushed him to that next level. Kross is like 3-4 levels below that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyin' Brian Posted October 11, 2022 Report Share Posted October 11, 2022 3 hours ago, Migs said: Beastman, from Deepest Darkest West Virginia. (This is real and he's actually pretty fun. Yes, I'm serious. Okay, mostly serious.) Deepest darkest West Virginia is pretty damn scary. Lol I’ll have to check that out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blehschmidt Posted October 11, 2022 Report Share Posted October 11, 2022 9 hours ago, Migs said: Beastman, from Deepest Darkest West Virginia. (This is real and he's actually pretty fun. Yes, I'm serious. Okay, mostly serious.) When I was ring announcing I worked a ton of shows with Beastman, and he has evolved into a very fun worker. He does a nice mix of Kamala style antics, Brody style brawling, and modern big man indy spots. Even Cornette enjoyed his gimmick at a show they were both on which was very surprising. If nothing else, it certainly beats his old Bulldozer gimmick.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffey Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 10 hours ago, DMJ said: Kross is going nowhere unless he can discover a personality. Karrion Kross, much like Luke Gallows, is a guy where everyone always talks about how much charisma & personality he has... but it never shows on TV. Like his Jesse Ventura impression in the weight room is literally better than anything he's ever done on TV in any company. Even Scarlett doesn't make him interesting. I don't think his hair being back hinders him any - although I do think Scarlett brought more to the table as a redhead than just another blonde. I just don't know what Kross is missing. You can't take him seriously. It's too over-the-top, gimmicky & cartoony. I don't think him being a dark arts gimmick works. He's very miscast, like when Christopher Daniels was trying to be "The Fallen Angel" in Ring of Honor. Shit is just cringe. I think he's fine, work wise. I think he's fine, look wise. I think the leather jacket even fits him well. I have no issue with his pairing with Scarlett. But the entrance & shit, it doesn't work. He'd be better off trying to be The Berserker instead of The Undertaker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.S. Posted October 12, 2022 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 On 10/10/2022 at 9:48 AM, KawadaSmile said: He's over in the same way Fight Club is over with fucking clueless dudebros. What's wrong with Fight Club? I saw the movie years after the fact, so the ending had long been spoiled for me. (I only watched it to help a niece with a school paper.) I enjoyed it anyway because it was neat to see all the breadcrumbs they threw along the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 The movie itself is fine, it just got adopted by incels and dudebros as some kind of mission statement in life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 7 hours ago, Coffey said: Karrion Kross, much like Luke Gallows, is a guy where everyone always talks about how much charisma & personality he has... but it never shows on TV. Gallows displays shitloads of personality on TV (well, in IMPACT he did at least). Kross, not so much. 7 hours ago, Coffey said: although I do think Scarlett brought more to the table as a redhead than just another blonde. I don't know what her hair color has to do with it really, to me the issue is that Scarlett on her own is a fun character/worker, and she's being kinda wasted in this role. She's good at it, but she could be more on her own. Kross is a bizarre case of WWE seeing big things in him when IMPACT did not even bother to make him a main event player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 2 hours ago, sek69 said: The movie itself is fine, it just got adopted by incels and dudebros as some kind of mission statement in life. They probably don't get what the movie is about either. Like gangsta rappers apparently not having watched the entirety of Scarface and stopped midway through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NintendoLogic Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 Or all the people who read Watchmen and saw Rorschach as the hero, which is the opposite of what Alan Moore intended. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strobogo Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 LG shows personality all the time, but his personality fucking sucks as much as his ring work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Migs Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 15 hours ago, Blehschmidt said: When I was ring announcing I worked a ton of shows with Beastman, and he has evolved into a very fun worker. He does a nice mix of Kamala style antics, Brody style brawling, and modern big man indy spots. Even Cornette enjoyed his gimmick at a show they were both on which was very surprising. If nothing else, it certainly beats his old Bulldozer gimmick.... That's great. Saw him at Warrior Wrestling this summer and my friends and I were instantly taken. He had a really fun match with Janela in JCW where he used all those pieces that you discussed (the caveman antics, the brawling, some high spots). Weirdly, doing a YouTube deep dive on him has me watching way more West Virginia indies than I ever have before, to the point I kinda want to go see an Applachian Championship Wrestling show in a barn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timbo Slice Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 5 hours ago, NintendoLogic said: Or all the people who read Watchmen and saw Rorschach as the hero, which is the opposite of what Alan Moore intended. Moore literally made Watchmen as a call to how much depending on heroism leads to fascism. Yet isolated comic book fans saw Rorschach as their avatar for being an outcast. Irony thicker than the Ultimate Director’s Cut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 Do some people in the US still think "Born in the USA" is a patriotic song ? People only listened to the chorus I guess... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NintendoLogic Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 28 minutes ago, El-P said: Do some people in the US still think "Born in the USA" is a patriotic song ? People only listened to the chorus I guess... You mean the famous song about how great it is to be born in the USA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 1 minute ago, NintendoLogic said: You mean the famous song about how great it is to be born in the USA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blehschmidt Posted October 13, 2022 Report Share Posted October 13, 2022 7 hours ago, El-P said: Do some people in the US still think "Born in the USA" is a patriotic song ? People only listened to the chorus I guess... There is a cult that follows a certain ex-president like he's a god that uses that song, CCR's "Fortunate Son", and Rage Against the Machine's "Killing in the Name" without a hint of irony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted October 17, 2022 Report Share Posted October 17, 2022 On 10/13/2022 at 2:07 AM, Blehschmidt said: There is a cult that follows a certain ex-president like he's a god that uses that song, CCR's "Fortunate Son", and Rage Against the Machine's "Killing in the Name" without a hint of irony. Well, these people are dumb as fuck, therefore... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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