Who was involved in the most great angles?

[JerryvonKramer]

Before recording the second part of the GCW show last night, it occurred to me that Ted DiBiase during his career could lay claim to being part of at least SEVEN legit great angles, some of which are in the "all-time" caliber, and all of which would likely make a "Top 50 wrestling angles" list.

 

Remember: an angle is not a storyline or a feud, it's a specific plot point in a storyline or feud.

 

My aim in this thread is not such much to really ascertain "who had the most", but rather listing out the process by which we'll get there. Hopefully, by the end we should have a very full listing of all-time great angles and a good idea of who has been involved in them over the years. Inevitably, I expect there will be some debate as to what "truly counts" as an all-time great angle. The criteria I would say would be:

 

- how much impact did the angle have at the time?

- how memorable it is?

- how much do people who witnessed it talk about it and reference it?

- how large does the angle loom in the history of the given promotion it was worked in?

- did it draw?

- would the angle realistically get into an "objective" top 50 wrestling angles in history that is voted for by a WON HoF ballot holder-type base taking all of the above into account?

 

I'll start with Ted, who like I said, has seven such angles in my view.

 

These are:

 

1. The Freebirds Piledriver incident, when Gordy gives him a piledriver on the concrete and 3 piledrivers in the ring, Gordon Solie acts like he's been legit killed, and he goes to hospital. This is regularly cited as the most memorable angle in GCW history. This angle is given legendary status partly because it was so believable: Ted went to a legit hospital and spent days there despite the fact he wasn't really injured, at the hospital they had to close down the switch board due to the amount of callers, the Freebirds received death threats, and there are many accounts of kids who at seen it on TV crying at home.

 

2. The turn on JYD. DiBiase had been JYD's tag partner and ally through thick and thin, and during the infamous Freebirds blinding angle; he was the best man at his wedding. But then in 1982, during a face vs. face match, he loaded his glove and the Dog lost not only his title but also his best friend. And Mid-South gained their biggest heel.

 

3. The Gorilla angle. As a heel and leader of The Rat Pack, DiBiase feuded with JYD. It came down to a Loser Leaves Town Tag Match (DiBiase and Matt Borne vs. JYD and Mr. Olympia). Before the match all during the show, a guy in a gorilla costume was entertaining the kids at ringside. This gorilla was, of course, secretly Jim Duggan and he interfered at the crucial moment to cost JYD the pinfall. JYD would come back as Stagger Lee in one of the more successful iterations of the Midnight Rider / Charlie Brown from Outta Town angles.

 

4. "The Best Dressed Man in Mid-South Wrestling" in which Dibiase smashes up Duggan's car with a baseball bat. In 1983, the Rat Pack had been dominating Mid-South, but there was a new threat in town Devastation Incorporated led by Skandor Akbar. The ambitious Akbar wanted to join forces with the Rat Pack, but Duggan -- a true patriot -- wanted no part of it. Ted vowed that he wouldn't turn on his friend and stuck by Duggan only, of course, to turn on him as soon as he could during a match with one of Akbar's charges, (the fake) Kendo Nagasakii. This led to a feud between Ted and Duggan which resulted in Duggan beating DiBiase in a loser leaves town match and DiBiase headed back to Georgia. Over a year later, in 1985, Ted came back and proceeded to basically mug Duggan using a blackjack to knock him out. The feud took on a new dimension, however, when Ted started running down Duggan as a guy who lacked class. Watts had named Duggan "Wrester of the Year" for 1984 and wore a tuxedo to accept the award and thank him, next week Ted turned up in a tuxedo and challenged Duggan to a best-dressed man contest, which Ted inevitably loses, twice. Pissed off, smashes in the windows of Duggan's car with a baseball bat. This would culminate in the famous Loser Leaves Town, Tuxedo, No DQ, Glove on a Pole, Cage Match.

 

5. Dick Murdoch brainbusters Ted on the concrete after his big world title match with Ric Flair. This is brought up by some people as the greatest angle of all time. Murdoch had been like a father to DiBiase looking after him as he grew up in the business. Ted had long been touted as being a future world champion and now, in 1985, his big opportunity had arrived. Of course, at the same time, he was the biggest and most hated heel around after years of the aforementioned shenanigans. But before the match, Murdoch is here to piss on DiBiase's parade. He slams Ted into the ring post resulting in one of the bloodiest lacerations you'll ever see in wrestling. "I've never seen that much crimson in my life". He bleeds profusely and medics try to get him bandaged up because he still wants that world title shot. Against the odds, he goes on to have a great bout with Flair, despite being weakened by the injury. But it's too much and after taking a big bump to the outside, he struggles to get back in before the 10 count, but then Murdoch comes back and in one of the more villainous acts of all-time starts hammering on Ted and then delivers a brainbuster on the concrete floor. In terms of execution, crowd control, and basically everything, this is undoubtedly one of the best angles ever. Jim Ross is tremendous on commentary.

 

6. The evil twin refs. In 1988, DiBiase, now the Million Dollar Man in WWF, had tried unsuccessfully to buy Hogan's title. So, of course, he came up with a plan to purchase the services of Andre the Giant who might be able to beat Hogan on his behalf. Cue one of the most memorable angles in WWF history at the Main Event where we discover that long-time official Dave Hebner has an evil clone -- either a twin who DiBiase has paid off, or perhaps just a guy who he has paid to have his face surgically altered to look like Hebner (the exact details of this have never been made clear). So Andre beat Hogan and then sold Ted the title seconds later, much to the chagrin of Jack Tunney. This would lead to the tournament at Wrestlemania IV. Vince and Pat Patterson were really on top of their game during this era. The angle of course changed the course of wrestling history by ending Hogan's historic first WWF title run.

 

7. Virgil finally turns on Ted. Loyal bodyguard Virgil had been at Ted's side since late 1987. But in January 1991, while still feuding with Dusty Rhodes, Ted had started ramping up his general dickery towards his employee, treating him more like a personal gimp than a bodyguard. Most will remember the dark and disturbing skits in which he gets Virgil to clean the fungus from between his toes and to clean shit from off his boots. Arguably this is the start of the general "darkening" of mood during WWF in 1991. At Royal Rumble 91, Ted finally takes it too far after dispatching Dusty Rhodes in their tag match by slapping Virgil in the face for fucking up during the match. He orders Virgil to get the Million Dollar Title and put it around his waist, and unwilling to take further abuse and humiliation, Virgil smacks Ted in the face with the belt to one of the loudest pops you'll ever hear. Definitely up there in terms of most memorable babyface turns in the WWF. The booking was masterful here, they'd slow-burned this turn for years.

----------

So there are Ted's entries. Who else?

[Matt D]

I'd be sort of amazed if the answer isn't Flair or Dusty.

[goc]

Or Lawler.

[JerryvonKramer]

It may well be, but I want to list them all out. It will be educational.

[Matt D]

I started to do so with Flair but I just don't have time right now.

 

Looking at Piper quickly, though.

 

1. The angle where he goaded Chavo Sr. into striking him and losing a pure wrestling trophy because of that sounds pretty cool?

2. Buddy Rose burning the kilt

3. The angle where he turned babyface by saving Gordon Solie from Muraco

4. Coconut + Snuka

5. Attacking Lauper and co.

6. Getting attacked by Adonis

7. His Role in Virgil turning?

8. When he came out by surprise to confront Hogan in WCW

[(BP)]

Flair (Off the top of my head)

Horsemen breaking Dusty's arm.

Getting attacked and injured by Funk.

Real world's champion debut in WWF.

Getting his suit ripped by Magnum.

Rubbing Steamboat's face in the concrete.

Race putting out a bounty on Flair's head.

Retirement angle 2008.

"She was mine before she was yours." Savage feud/Elizabeth pictures.

I'm sure there are loads more...

[Matt D]

I actually think that Dibiase has a few other slightly more minor but still pretty great angles.

 

1. Buying Hercules

2. Jake the Snake stealing the Million Dollar belt and Bossman turning face after getting it back.

3. Hart selling out the Disasters for Money Inc.

[peachchaos]

Steve Austin

[Childs]

Terry Funk comes to mind ...

 

He was involved in Hansen's entry to All-Japan, his own "retirement" match there, the Lawler empty arena match in Memphis, the turn on Flair after the last Steamboat match in '89, the Stud Stable feud with Dustin and I'm sure countless angles in Florida, ECW, Over the Top, etc. that others would be better qualified to list.

[Timbo Slice]

I was just coming in here to type Funk because if you think "great" angles, I'm not sure you have anyone with more high-end angles than him.

 

Randy Savage is a big one thanks to his Memphis stuff, the manager angle that produced Miss Elizabeth, the Steamboat angle, the Mega-Powers stuff, Jake Roberts, the Warrior retirement feud, Flair...just a lot of top notch stuff.

 

The Freebirds come to mind, as well, thanks to them traveling all over, and why they probably don't have anything as memorable as other wrestlers great angles, they sure do have the quantity to be a part of the discussion.

[goc]

Quick bullet points that I will come back to and someone with earlier 80s and some 70s knowledge can add on to my case:

 

-Lawler pretending to be a drunk after losing to Bill Dundee and then the whole Hawaiian Flash mask deal to get his match with Bill Dundee

 

-Tommy Rich hiding under the ring during the big cage match blow off with Austin Idol leading to Lawler having his hair cut

 

-Tupelo Concession brawl was big for business and something everyone points to as the "birthplace" of hardcore wrestling (even if it's not)

 

-Bill Dundee goes nuts in the studio and goes from Lawler's partner at the beginning of the show to his worst enemy and the guy who stole the belt from him by the end of it

 

-Giving Andy Kaufman a piledriver and having him get stretchered out of the arena.

 

-Slapping Kaufman on the Letterman show

 

-Can I count the Empty Arena "match" as an angle?

 

Then there are the ones that I'm not sure I can say really did anything for business but were great angles:

-Austin Idol pretending to be visiting Mexican wrestler to give Jerry Lawler an award only to attack him

-The whole dream match scenario the ended up with Jimmy Hart winning the Southern Title

[DMJ]

I don't think I'm going to hit them all but someone can (and should) fill in the ones I'm missing. Also, I think most people here will agree that many of these are not "great" angles, but they're at least memorable and, subjectively, I think someone - somewhere - thought they had potential to be "great":

 

Hulk Hogan

 

- Andre grabbing the cross from his chest in build-up to WM3

- Twin Ref Angle w/ Andre and DiBiase

- Zeus attacks Hogan on Saturday Night's Main Event

- Hogan carrying Liz to the back during Mega Powers Explode build

- Earthquake breaking Hogan's ribs

- Hogan getting pulled out of the 91' Rumble by Sid (en route to Flair winning the title)

- Undertaker grabbing the cross from his chest in build up to Survivor Series 91'

- WrestleMania 9 Finish (many will say this was an awful angle, but its certainly memorable)

- Heel turn at Bash at the Beach 96'

- Roddy Piper returns at Halloween Havoc (?) to confront Hollywood Hogan

- Ultimate Warrior returns on Nitro to confront Hollywood Hogan

- Fingerpoke of Doom w/ Kevin Nash

- Shawn Michaels turns heel by superkicking Hogan on RAW

- Hulk Hogan returns to WWE as the masked Mr. America

 

Again, not sure how many of these count as even "angles" let alone "great angles," but tried to at least help out. Great thread!

[Eduardo]

Some more for goc to add to.

 

--Lawer-Hart-Doink at SummerSlam 1993.

 

--All of Lawler-Snowman.

 

--The Lawler-Dundee TV episode that was all a build up to the 1983 LLT match.

 

--Lawler invades ECW.

 

--Lawler-Heyman debate.

 

--Some of the USWA-McMahon feud stuff, like McMahon playing a heel in front of a WWF audience, while interviewing Lawler.

[ajtroma]

Lawler was the first name that popped into my mind. Jim Cornette was second.

[goc]

Some more for goc to add to.

 

--Lawer-Hart-Doink at SummerSlam 1993.

 

--All of Lawler-Snowman.

 

--The Lawler-Dundee TV episode that was all a build up to the 1983 LLT match.

 

--Lawler invades ECW.

 

--Lawler-Heyman debate.

 

--Some of the USWA-McMahon feud stuff, like McMahon playing a heel in front of a WWF audience, while interviewing Lawler.

Snowman feud drew money, so did McMahon in the Mid-South Coliseum. Lawler invading ECW was definitely a hot angle, not sure if it mattered to business though.

[Tim Cooke]

MX had:

 

- James Gang dragging Cornette with truck at WWW taping

- Cornette works out, which leads to Baby Doll suplexing him

- Bubba and Dusty chair on WWW

- MX birthday party (Mid South and NWA)

- Fantastics straight jacket in NWA

- Fantastics brawl to set up Clash I

- Cornette throws fire at Ron Garvin

[Fantastic]

Vince McMahon?

[tofu_chipmunk]

I started to do so with Flair but I just don't have time right now.

 

Looking at Piper quickly, though.

 

1. The angle where he goaded Chavo Sr. into striking him and losing a pure wrestling trophy because of that sounds pretty cool?

2. Buddy Rose burning the kilt

3. The angle where he turned babyface by saving Gordon Solie from Muraco

4. Coconut + Snuka

5. Attacking Lauper and co.

6. Getting attacked by Adonis

7. His Role in Virgil turning?

8. When he came out by surprise to confront Hogan in WCW

I would include Greg Valentine destroying Piper's ear in '83.

[tofu_chipmunk]

MX had:

 

- James Gang dragging Cornette with truck at WWW taping

- Cornette works out, which leads to Baby Doll suplexing him

- Bubba and Dusty chair on WWW

- MX birthday party (Mid South and NWA)

- Fantastics straight jacket in NWA

- Fantastics brawl to set up Clash I

- Cornette throws fire at Ron Garvin

I would add getting jumped in the TBS studio by Paul E., Condrey, and Rose.

[Memphis Mark]

Jerry Lawler . Add this to your list . Lawler feud with Bill Dundee picks up steam in either 1977 . Dundee is put his hair on the line to get yet another Southern Heavyweight Title match .. Of course , Dundee loses the match and is shaved bald in the center of the ring.

 

Lawler refuses to wrestle Dundee again . Dundee puts up his wife hair , Bev Dundee , in order to get another title match . Once again Dundee loses and his wife get her head shaved . Great .

 

Then there was the big Southern tag title on Channel 13 , I think the year was 1972 . Jerry jarrett and jackie Fargo were set to defend against Jerry Lawler and Jim White . Lawler no showed the match and Sam Bass was to to tale Jerry's spot . Fans were getting autographs from the faces . Out of nowhere a female fan attacked Jerry Jarrett . If I recall correctly the female fan knocked out Jarrett with a loaded purse . Of course the female fan was Jerry Lawler in drag . The blood feud betwwen the two teams exploed all over the Memphis territory .

 

Jim Cornette did the same angle in Mid - South . Jim's tribute to his and our King.

[goc]

So weird, I just watched that match between RNR Express & MXE from Mid-South today. I had the disc on while I was cleaning up today. Jim Ross loved talking about Jim Cornette finally coming out of the closet in his dress.

[elbrujo138]

I'll take a go at Austin. I came up with these that all could be argued were great.

 

The Gun Angle with Pillman - Raw 1996

Austin spends an evening stalking Pillman leading to him breaking in to Pillmans house. In the midst of the craziness,
Pillman shows of a gun that goes off while the transmission from the house breaks down. Why it's a great angle:
Austin is shown as take no prisoner unstable crazy man willing to settle scores the hard way.
In the ratings it wasn't that special if I remember correctly.

Double-Turn at WrestleMania 13 - 1997

 

This is a hard one because it's a match and I don't know if it counts as an angle.
But the vivid shots of Austin struggling, screaming and eventually passing out in a pile of his own blood is a iconic as it gets
and launches "Stone Cold" as the Next Big Thing (for real).

Brawling with Bret/Ambuluance Highjack - Raw 1997

 

The war with Bret and The Hart Foundation gets more and more bitter as Stone Cold destroys Brets leg and then hijacks the
ambuluance to continue the beat down. Great angle with everyone involved in the angle looking great and Austin looking
like a killer!

Stunning McMahon in the Garden - Raw 1997

 

After Owen nearly crippled Austin at SummerSlam an increasingly frustrated Austin can't get the WWF officals to let him compete
again without a doctors clearance. In the weeks leading up to Raw in Madison Square Garden Austin has been taking out his
frustration on WWF officals before finally hitting the top off the food-chain in owner McMachon. And the Garden goes crazy
when Vince eats his first stunner. Awesome angle and this is the night I think they realised that Austin was a license to
print money.

Pull Apart Brawl with Mike Tyson - Raw 1998

The biggest, and most well put together angle in the WWF since the Megapowers exploded, sees McMahon introducing Mike Tyson as the
baddest man on the planet and the special ringside enforcer for WrestleManin 14...and then the glass breaks and Austin walks out.
He takes objection to Tyson being callded The baddest man on the planet, talks smack to Tyson face, flips him off with the
double bird and the pull apart brawl is on! Extra bonus points for McMachon frantically screaming "You ruined everything" at
Austin.

"I can beat you with one-arm tied behind my back" - Raw 1998

After Austins big win at WrestleMania 14 an increasingly paranoid McMahon wants Austin to conform to being a corporate champion
the easy way or the hard way. Austin picks the hard way, brags about beating McMahon with one arm tied behind his back
and McMahon calls him out on it. Come match time with McMahon Austin gets his arm tied and the new Corporate Dude Love debuts and
attacks one-armed Austin. Great setup, great angle and great ratings as Raw beats Nitro for the first time in 82 weeks. Back then an
angle like this was really fresh. Nowadays it's a writing crutch. I belive the first Austin/Dude Love
(that this match set up) did a really good buy rate, like 0.8 or something.


Austin gets fired and hunts McMahon - Raw 1998

After special ref Austin messed up the Undertaker/Kane match for the vaccant title McMachon (in full on most evil
boss ever mode) finally has the right to fire Austin and he does. The next night on Raw "Stone Cold" shows up in full
hunting gear and stalks McMahon. Finally he corners his prey and pulls the trigger on a gun, out comes a flag that says
"Bang 3:16" as McMahon pisses his pants. Great angle and it can be called a great angle based on the crowd reactions.
So hated was McMahon and so beloved was Austin that the crowd was really hot for Austin pulling the trigger on him.

 

Austin takes out the Alliance - Raw 2001

A conflicted heel Austin and where he stands in the WWF's battle against the Alliance is the back drop to an entire episode of Raw.
It then culminates in one off the loudest crowds you will hear as Austin takes out the Alliance in the end and captains
the WWF's team against the Alliance at Invasion. Invasion does huge WrestleMania like numbers and the WWF off course botches
it with the second unwanted heel turn of Austin that year at the PPV. Stuff like this hurt Austin. But the initial angle was real great
televison.

I'm sure that there is some great angles that I'm missing but I don't know what. I don't remember Austin standing out in any
of the Dangerous Alliance angles. While I liked the Flair/Arn feud with Austin/Pillman and the angles leading up to the match
that stuff did bad ratings and can't really be considered that great. I'm drawing a bit of a blank on Austin in hot angles in
WCW.

[Loss]

Lawler, Flair, Funk, Dusty, DiBiase, the Freebirds, Savage and Cornette are the guys that come to mind to me first and foremost. I'm pretty sure Lawler is truly The King, if only because he was the top star for almost three decades in a territory that was more angle-driven and booked week-to-week than any territory in the country.

 

I think a good sleeper pick is Eddie Gilbert. His run wasn't as long as the other guys I mentioned, but he played a part in quite a few strong angles in a shorter period of time.

[JerryvonKramer]

What about Bobby Heenan for this thread?