Grimmas Posted September 14, 2014 Report Share Posted September 14, 2014 Discuss here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 I am considering him but I don't think he'll make the Top 100. Easily in my Top 200. I gotta look at his NJ matches again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Waco Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Saito is a bubble guy. What helps him to me is that he was very versatile and in some ways was the most Japanese export to the States. What hurts him some to me is that I can't point to any period where I think he was clearly a top five guy in any promotion he was in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrisZ Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 The closest he ever came to being the top guy in a promotion was in Southeastern in 1981 but even then you could argue that Jimmy Golden was the top heel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 19, 2015 Report Share Posted April 19, 2015 Guy needs a closer look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoe Posted April 19, 2015 Report Share Posted April 19, 2015 He's a guy who will fly under a lot of people's radar. I think he could squeeze in, but someone needs to make a passionate csse for him. He wasn't a guy who was the top guy so a match listing would be helpful for the guy. He's a guy if a 3 or 4 disc sampling comp of his work was made, it would go a long way in convincing people of his greatness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 19, 2015 Report Share Posted April 19, 2015 I need to go in and have a close look to see how much of him in there is from the 70s. He worked in a lot of different places. I think he's going to be someone who will require an argument that isn't based on Great Match Theory though. He has been legit great in every single context I've ever seen him in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted April 19, 2015 Report Share Posted April 19, 2015 I love watching him every time I see him pop up somewhere but he's a tough guy to argue for a list like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conker8 Posted April 19, 2015 Report Share Posted April 19, 2015 (edited) On great matchs, there is one with Rick Martel (AWA Set). They have good chemistry. Thinking about other great match, I only find tag matchs - certainly one of the best tag workers in the nominees. Edited April 19, 2015 by conker8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 20, 2015 Report Share Posted April 20, 2015 Yes, I had that Martel match at ****, it's (4/24/85) Then there's the Larry Z match from the Tokyo Dome, 1990. This run of tag matches was all fun stuff I had at ***3/4 in a COOL tag-team with Bock: Nick Bockwinkel, Mr. Saito, and Bobby Heenan vs. Blackjack Lanza and The Fabulous Ones (9/9/84) Nick Bockwinkel and Mr. Saito vs. The Fabulous Ones (9/30/84) Nick Bockwinkel and Mr. Saito vs. Curt and Larry Hennig (11/8/84) From the same set also at ***3/4: Jerry Lawler & Greg Gagne vs. Riki Choshu & Mr. Saito (5/14/88) A lot of people liked the match with Hogan (8/28/83). I watched a clip of him as a youngster vs. Jack Brisco from 2/10/70 in which he looked good (listed as 1969). He had a great little TV match for a $5,000 challenge against Steve Keirn in 1980 in GCW, which we watched on Titans. And one vs. Mr. Wrestling II the following week. He stood out on that footage. I will dig a bit deeper because there is stuff of his from the 70s to see especially in Florida. Looks like high-lights, but you never know what you'll find. He's on the to-do pile. And next week I might actually make some in-roads into said pile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Waco Posted April 20, 2015 Report Share Posted April 20, 2015 Watch the 9/88 NJPW elimination match. Saito is incredible in it as I recall. He was also great in the 87 match with Kimura and the Riki Choshu & Masa Saito vs. George Takano & Super Strong Machine tag from March of 89. I also loved that Martel match. I think it was in my top 20 for the AWA. Do you have that Keirn match Parv? I've looked for it since you guys reviewed it to no avail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 20, 2015 Report Share Posted April 20, 2015 Let me have a look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 20, 2015 Report Share Posted April 20, 2015 Dylan, turns out I'd already upped this, I'm bad at sharing my links: This is the footage I put together for those Titans shows. Saito matches are 53 mins in. Although I'd encourage everyone to watch the awesomeness of that Assassin vs. Wrestling II angle shortly before it. The Assassin is my hero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Waco Posted April 21, 2015 Report Share Posted April 21, 2015 Thanks for the link Jerry. I enjoyed both matches and they provide us with a good glimpse of what Saito could do in a studio setting. I have to say I found the Keirn match extremely frustrating as it felt like a squash with Keirn on top, which probably makes sense from a storyline perspective, but runs counter to how I view Saito as a mat worker. In any event the bouts are well worth watching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smack2k Posted April 21, 2015 Report Share Posted April 21, 2015 Great link Parv, thanks a ton.... Saito / Bockwinkel were a underrated team that just didnt last that long, but man I loved them together... Parv nailed all the good stuff in his post above... Saito's AWA title win vs. Larry Z is a match I enjoy as well and that is in 1990, so Saito had staying power as well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB8 Posted May 3, 2021 Report Share Posted May 3, 2021 I had Saito at 87 in 2016. Looking back on my ballot from then there are some names that feel like "in the moment" picks, where they were probably fresh in the memory after watching some of their stuff in close proximity to the 2016 deadline. I think Saito was one of those guys, so there's a chance he falls into that 100-150 range next time, but that shouldn't be read as a knock on him at all because Masa Saito was the fucking bomb. His AWA run is badass and it felt like he got to be more or less the same Masa Saito he was in Japan. There was less "dastardly individual from the orient" nonsense with Saito than other Japanese wrestlers coming into territories during the 80s. He cheated and took shortcuts because he was a heel, not because he was from Japan and needed the same weapons as every other wrestler from Japan (the spike, the powder in the eyes...though he probably did that as well, tbf), so he could believably swing other wrestlers around the place on the regular. The tag team with Bockwinkel was a blast and I'll always favour wrestlers who have strong tag runs. Saito was also an awesome bumper who had real snap to otherwise simple bumps (armdrags, hip tosses, etc.), which was super impressive considering he looked a bag of cement with a bowling ball for a neck. He was also a straight up shit-kicker of the highest order in Japan, who could bleed like a maniac when required, so his versatility was pretty strong. He might not make it onto my 2026 list, but he remains a favourite and maybe I'll change my mind if I rewatch some of that New Japan run. MASA SAITO YOU SHOULD WATCH: v Curt Hennig (AWA, 3/28/85) v Antonio Inoki (New Japan, 4/22/87) w/Antonio Inoki, Dick Murdoch, Yoshiaki Fujiwara & Seiji Sakaguchi v Tatsumi Fujinami, Nobuhiko Takada, Riki Choshu, Akira Maeda & Super Strong Machine (New Japan, 9/17/87) w/Riki Choshu, Hiro Saito, Kuniaki Kobayashi & Super Strong Machine v Tatsumi Fujinami, Keiichi Yamada, Shiro Koshinaka, Yoshiaki Fujiwara & Kengo Kimura (New Japan, 9/12/88) w/Riki Choshu v George Takano & Super Strong Machine (New Japan, 3/16/89) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shrike02 Posted May 3, 2021 Report Share Posted May 3, 2021 As mentioned above there's a really good AWA match vs. Martel which is well worth checking out. Saito had a really long career and I think his talent merits a place in the top 100 but lack of footage may be an issue, as well as his lack of big runs as a main event worker. He's always consistently good in the ring, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elliott Posted May 3, 2021 Report Share Posted May 3, 2021 That Inoki match recommended above where they take the ropes down and handcuff themselves together so they can look each other in the eye while they attempt to murder each other is one of the most incredible spectacles ever. I fucking love Masa Saito. An all around talent who could trade holds but could also brawl and bleed with the best of them. Probably finds a way on my list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB8 Posted May 3, 2021 Report Share Posted May 3, 2021 On 5/3/2021 at 6:37 PM, elliott said: That Inoki match recommended above where they take the ropes down and handcuff themselves together so they can look each other in the eye while they attempt to murder each other is one of the most incredible spectacles ever. Expand I had it stupid high on my New Japan 80s ballot, IIRC. I never mentioned this in my last post, but basically those sort of wild spectacles are something I put a ton of stock into and Saito gets a shit load of points for that one (Inoki is pretty much a master of them, coincidentally). On 5/3/2021 at 6:28 PM, Shrike02 said: As mentioned above there's a really good AWA match vs. Martel which is well worth checking out. Saito had a really long career and I think his talent merits a place in the top 100 but lack of footage may be an issue, as well as his lack of big runs as a main event worker. He's always consistently good in the ring, though. Expand The Martel match is pretty great, yeah. I don't remember where I ranked it on my AWA 80s ballot but I'm sure it did well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makai Club #1 Posted May 3, 2021 Report Share Posted May 3, 2021 On 5/3/2021 at 6:37 PM, elliott said: That Inoki match recommended above where they take the ropes down and handcuff themselves together so they can look each other in the eye while they attempt to murder each other is one of the most incredible spectacles ever. I fucking love Masa Saito. An all around talent who could trade holds but could also brawl and bleed with the best of them. Probably finds a way on my list. Expand Love this match! Inoki punched a bloody Saito into oblivion while Riki Choshu could only watch on while his mentor is dying. Amazing theatre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted May 3, 2021 Report Share Posted May 3, 2021 Don't sleep on his match with Zbyszko from the 2/10/90 interpromotional show. I would also strongly recommend watching some younger Saito from the late '70s. He was an incredible athlete, high on the list of wrestlers who could snap you in half without taking a hard breath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB8 Posted May 3, 2021 Report Share Posted May 3, 2021 On 5/3/2021 at 8:06 PM, Childs said: Don't sleep on his match with Zbyszko from the 2/10/90 interpromotional show. I would also strongly recommend watching some younger Saito from the late '70s. He was an incredible athlete, high on the list of wrestlers who could snap you in half without taking a hard breath. Expand What are the 70s recs, if you have any? I don't think I've seen any of that stuff and now I'm in the mood to watch some Saito again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted May 3, 2021 Report Share Posted May 3, 2021 On 5/3/2021 at 8:20 PM, KB8 said: What are the 70s recs, if you have any? I don't think I've seen any of that stuff and now I'm in the mood to watch some Saito again. Expand 5/25/79 vs. Fujinami 6/15/79 Choshu & Seiji Sakaguchi vs. Hiro Matsuda & Masa Saito Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB8 Posted May 3, 2021 Report Share Posted May 3, 2021 Shit, I didn't even know the Fujinami match was a thing! I also subscribed to NJPW World for a month and the tag is on there as well, so that's cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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