Current New Japan

[gordi]

Not a match that's going to change anyone's minds...

 

Funny that you chose to phrase it that way, since it quite literally did change my mind.

[Fando]

 

Not a match that's going to change anyone's minds...

 

Funny that you chose to phrase it that way, since it quite literally did change my mind.

 

That's cool! What was the main difference about it compared to WK to you, since that's kind of the foundation for this match. Like you mentioned how they built on knowing each other so well here. I thought the first match was more exciting for what they did as it was happening and feeling so fresh, while this one felt totally familiar which didn't make it as exciting as the previous few, built to a perfect ending.

[gordi]

The first one felt a little too much like "my turn/your turn" and "look at all the cool moves we can do!" to me.

 

Also: I did not like that huge spots like the Avalanche Dragon Suplex were kind of blown off and a fancy Short Arm Clothesline meant Death. I am still not a huge fan of the current trope of "everybody has one finisher, and a big match can't end any other way" but it bugs me less now than it did then.

 

Perhaps most importantly: I watched the first one after the fact, aware of Meltzer's "extra star" rating and went in thinking, "So, you think this is better than 6/9/95, do you?" so I was predisposed to find fault with it.

 

With this one, I really liked how they told that story of "two guys who know each other's every move, and have figured out how to counter/reverse their opponent's offense." I felt they did a superb job of that, as in: I don't think anyone has ever done more with that idea in a wrestling match. I really really liked how they seemed more into making each other look good rather than just showing off all their cool offense. I loved how they sold pain and exhaustion in the third fall, rather than playing the role of indestructible supermen with limitless cardio.

 

Also: Quite possibly my mind was just more open to enjoying this one.

 

Truly, though, I was drawn right into it and the match kept its hold on me for the entire duration. I did not think, going in, that there was any chance of that happening.

[Jmare007]

I'm kinda shocked gordi liked it so much after not doing feeling the WK encounter.

 

I thought this match was perfect for people that loved their previous matches but didn't do much for me - enjoyed them but never was close to buying the "best ever" talk -, though I did think it got better as it went along. The last fall was by far the best one, and even though they stretched it too damn much for my liking, I thought it was dope how the crowd became more and more desperate with Kenny's exhaustion, as they started to feel he might not pull this off. Also liked how they didn't fill it with a bunch of nearfalls (they over used those for the first two falls) and just let the fact that they were too tired to land shit properly build the drama.

 

The match really felt like an anime fight, Kenny "losing consciousness" (or whatever you wanna call it) with his eyes going white after a Rainmaker included. I kinda felt most of the last fall was the "they are moving just by instinct" classic troupe you see in big epic anime fights.

 

The G-1 match is still the best they've done, easily imo, but I can see this Dominion one getting as much praise, if not more, than their previous matches. It's just not meant for a fan like me to enjoy it as much, and that's fine. And the right guy won too.

[SmartMark15]

Well, I'm one to swallow my pride when a match takes me along for a ride and that main event certainly did. I was one of many, many people on this forum absolutely dreading the No Time Limit stipulation given the horrific slog that was their Dominion match last year. It seemed to open too many avenues for them to pull more of their overly ambitious "must get all the stars" ideas in from the 1/4 match.

 

But this felt different. I was entirely drawn in. The second fall was great and the final fall was an entirely unique experience. I don't know how I'll rate this but I can definitely say that it was one of the best matches I've seen all year and I was among many incredibly ready to hate this match. I'm sure I'll find a lot to pick apart and deconstruct but just as a raw experience going in, I ended up loving it.

[Migs]

The main event was thrilling. I had woken up at 3am to watch the show, it's now close to 10am and I am still flying on adrenaline because of that match. And really the whole show worked - from the tag title match, that was as fun a three+ hours of wrestling as I can remember.

 

A real masterpiece performance from Jericho too. He's fully becoming the slimy rock stars he idolized. Just wonderfully gross.

[sek69]

I thought the show was fantastic, I loved the Young Bucks coming out looking like kids who knew they messed up but wanted to apologize to dad, and then Kota joining the group hug like the kids finally accepted their new stepdad.

[superkix]

I still think their G1 match from last year was the best match of the series. Way less fluff, more compact and smartly worked. I don't need the unnecessary theatrics.

[Zoo Enthusiast]

Thought this was the best Omega/Okada match. I wouldn’t put it above the big Gargano performances of the year but I thought it was really good. Show as a whole was good. Not blowaway for me and I wasn’t very into Jericho/Naito (and I was one of the people here who said the Omega match was the best of Jericho’s career). Ospreay/Hiromu was predictably very good. Tag title match was pretty good, too.

 

I fell asleep during the Elgin match, so he was on his game.

[WingedEagle]

I'd really like to say a lot about the main event and hope to do so in the next couple days, but a few quick takes:

 

- There was almost nothing bad other than the finish to the opener, which seemed to serve no purpose beyond crapping on a couple of rising young stars.

 

- Literally, nothing bad. I expected Goto/Elgin/Taichi to come up short both because it was a triangle match in New Japan and because of Taichi (miracles only happen once and he had his against Naito earlier this year), but they pulled it off and it was a lot of fun.

 

- I'm admittedly a New Japan diehard but often find their undercards run too long. That was not the case here as nothing overstayed its welcome and the entire show moved very quickly.

 

- The legends 6-man tag was a lot of fun. Its mind boggling seeing Hiroshi Tanahashi in a relatively meaningless role on a big show, but I have no doubt he'll deliver in and be a big part of the G1. He will be a big part of the G1, right? Right? Rey looked great here, to no surprise. Hopefully he has a fun spot on the Cow Palace show.

 

- Ospreay/Hiromu was good and probably the 3rd best match on the show, but Hiromo/Ishimori blew it away and a few other BOSJ outings were on par with this. Perhaps I need to check it out again as a lot of folks seemed to rate it much higher, but this was basically a very good ***3/4 match in my book.

 

- I liked Omega/Jericho at the Dome but thought it went way too long and didn't see any of the MOTYC talk it received in some circles. Naito/Jericho blew it away from the start, with much better and more vicious brawling and a tighter match. Call me crazy, but Jericho's gut and general appearance here added a lot to his character and vibe. It felt much grittier and more violent. I'm all for potbellied Jericho coming for a younger generation. This dramatically exceeded expectations.

 

- Okada/Omega IV was an easy 5 stars and 1 of my 2 favorite matches this year, along with Gargano/Almas. No idea how to rank it against their outings from last year or historically, but it was incredible and didn't feel anything like 65-70 minutes. The finishes to each fall were terrific. That third fall in particular was out of this world with a pair of the best selling and expressive performances I've ever seen. I was popping up off the couch for near falls and screaming for the finish. Bravo.

[Viking Hall]

Just finished this, show didn't blow me away if I'm honest but it was solid throughout and without a bad match but didn't draw me in as much as previous NJPW shows I've seen. Having said that, it'll still be a show of the year contender but was just missing that certain something for me. Of the two main events I was looking forward to Jericho vs Naito the most but I think I'd over-hyped it in my head too much because it didn't even begin to get close to Jericho vs Omega match for me. It had all the components, brutality, heavy hitting and solid work from both sides but they just didn't click as well as Jericho and Omega did in my book. Jericho is still my favourite character in wrestling right now and maybe the only person out there that I'm not sure where the line is blurred between reality and showmanship, he's just off the chain right now and if this turns out to be his final run, he's certainly going out with a bang. Ending caught me completely off guard too.

Wasn't sure how I felt about Omega vs Okada, I think knowing it was going for an hour + took me out of the first half of the match and I found myself getting distracted a little (literally found myself Googling 'Conan' Chris Walker at one point for the obvious look similarities) but when it kicked into gear it really went for it. Great selling on both sides and some of the best 'exhausted' wrestling I think I've ever seen. Still think they could have taken anything up to twenty minutes out of it to sharpen it up but there's no doubting that when the dust settles it'll go down as an all time great match. Certainly interested to see where both sides go from here, should lead to some interesting match ups and stories going forward.

[Wahoos Leg]

I thought the tag title match was fantastic and deserves more love than it's getting. Second-best of the card.

[SmartMark15]

Kenny vs. Cody confirmed for the Cow Palace.

[gordi]

Kenny vs. Cody confirmed for the Cow Palace.

That feels a little bit like "put the strap on Jinder before we go to India"-type thinking. Like they are worried that American NJPW fans might not care about a Main Event with a Japanese guy in it...

[Karl]

Enjoyed the show a great deal. Thought the main event was very very good, it had me gripped the entire time.

[Migs]

 

Kenny vs. Cody confirmed for the Cow Palace.

That feels a little bit like "put the strap on Jinder before we go to India"-type thinking. Like they are worried that American NJPW fans might not care about a Main Event with a Japanese guy in it...

 

 

To be fair, this is probably the hottest match they have on the table (assuming they don't want to do Omega-Naito this quickly). It did pretty incredible business for ROH.

[Gutenberger]

I thought the tag title match was fantastic and deserves more love than it's getting. Second-best of the card.

Agreed. This was my first NJPW show in a couple of years and was supposed to help me steer away from the habit that is WWE and to greener pastures, so I went in with little to no knowledge.

 

The Bucks blew me away with the story they told, both with a different dysfunctional body part, Evil & Sanada have INSTANTLY won me over as a fan of them. This was a fantastic match.

[Wahoos Leg]

 

 

Kenny vs. Cody confirmed for the Cow Palace.

That feels a little bit like "put the strap on Jinder before we go to India"-type thinking. Like they are worried that American NJPW fans might not care about a Main Event with a Japanese guy in it...

 

 

To be fair, this is probably the hottest match they have on the table (assuming they don't want to do Omega-Naito this quickly). It did pretty incredible business for ROH.

 

 

They needed a match like that especially since tickets for this show haven't been moving nearly as well as they did for Long Beach

[Jmare007]

 

Kenny vs. Cody confirmed for the Cow Palace.

That feels a little bit like "put the strap on Jinder before we go to India"-type thinking. Like they are worried that American NJPW fans might not care about a Main Event with a Japanese guy in it...

 

 

Maybe, but then again, it's the biggest match they could book for a US audience without the need to use a title defense with a bigger name that would mean more to the japanese audience anyway. Tickets were moving slowly, and my guess is that they'll see a big spike after that main event being announced.

[Cap]

Must admit, I cherry picked the show.

 

I really enjoyed Takahashi vs Ospreay a lot. I used to say I wasn't a fan of Ospreay, but at this point in 2018 I am a fan. He has put on a lot of really good to great matches recently. This started like a house of fire and it did taper off just a bit, but still wound up being a really solid match that provided a strong story and solid finish. ****

 

Jericho vs Naito exceeded my expectations by quite a bit. Jericho looked like he has been watching Park matches and Clockwork Orange. Psycho clown Jericho was a ton of fun here. Naito getting him back when he finally got the advantage was solid, simple story telling. Jericho gets how to make whatever he is doing stand out in he NJPW landscape and i think he and the company are both benefiting from the relationship.

 

Okada vs Omega... Man... What a match. I get that it isn't everyone's cup of tea, but to me this was easily the best of their series. I really liked WK and the G1 matches, but WK lost me in places near the end (on its way to classic and then dips a bit in my investment) and the G1 match is great but just never hit the classic level. I didn't care nearly as much for the hour long draw. That match felt much more redundant to me on the whole. This on the other hand accomplished what none of the others did; it kept me engaged from start to finish. The beginning didn't drag like some title matches. The story arches made sense. The first fall feeling like a title match in itself only to see Omega take an L on a reversal was awesome. Okada's swagger in the second and the slow tide turn carried this and built a great foundation for their desperation bomb throwing in the final fall. I have it just under Almas/Gargano for the year, but it is still going to land at either 4.75 or 5 stars. Some of Omega's offense, even well after the hour mark was just incredible. Like I said, I get why some people might not like this, but I thought this was a phenomenal bit of business.

[Zoo Enthusiast]

 

 

 

Kenny vs. Cody confirmed for the Cow Palace.

 

That feels a little bit like "put the strap on Jinder before we go to India"-type thinking. Like they are worried that American NJPW fans might not care about a Main Event with a Japanese guy in it...

To be fair, this is probably the hottest match they have on the table (assuming they don't want to do Omega-Naito this quickly). It did pretty incredible business for ROH.

They needed a match like that especially since tickets for this show haven't been moving nearly as well as they did for Long Beach

Yeah, All In hurt the sales a ton. There just aren’t enough NJPW fans in the states. Obviously, Mania played a huge part in ROH’s business with that match, as well. We bought our tix before any matches were announced.

[Wahoos Leg]

 

 

 

 

Kenny vs. Cody confirmed for the Cow Palace.

That feels a little bit like "put the strap on Jinder before we go to India"-type thinking. Like they are worried that American NJPW fans might not care about a Main Event with a Japanese guy in it...

To be fair, this is probably the hottest match they have on the table (assuming they don't want to do Omega-Naito this quickly). It did pretty incredible business for ROH.

They needed a match like that especially since tickets for this show haven't been moving nearly as well as they did for Long Beach

Yeah, All In hurt the sales a ton. There just aren’t enough NJPW fans in the states. Obviously, Mania played a huge part in ROH’s business with that match, as well. We bought our tix before any matches were announced.

 

 

Doing the Liger vs Rey match they originally planned for Long Beach seems like a no brainer.

 

I'm curious if they will announce anything for Daytona before it happens, mostly because we already have tickets.

[Zoo Enthusiast]

Yeah, I hope that match happens somewhere.

[Childs]

Thought Dominion was well-paced and nicely varied.

 

I've been more skeptical than not of Okada and Omega, but they pulled off a hell of a match -- this generation's version of Misawa-Kobashi. You could argue it's counterproductive in the long-term for them to work such demanding matches, but few others would or could achieve such a spectacle.

 

The idea of a 70-minute match horrifies me on paper. But in practice, they kept me (and more importantly, the crowd) completely invested, and I started watching the match after midnight. They touched on all the key spots from their rivalry. They created the sense that any mistake or moment of cockiness would be punished. They doled out the big moves in a way that built suspense. They created an exciting duel within the duel between Omega's knees and Okada's dropkicks. They sold the toll of the match.

 

I know it's easy to bag on Meltz for saying they broke the scale. But it makes complete sense for him to feel that was the greatest match he's ever seen. He's a fan of maximalist wrestling,and that was maximalist wrestling done exceptionally well.

[NintendoLogic]

I thought Omega/Okada was clearly the best of their matches. I think Okada's match with Tanahashi at Dontaku was better, but they hit all the marks they set out to hit while keeping me mostly engaged for over an hour, so kudos to them. I can't imagine someone finding serious fault with it unless they're implacably averse to New Japan main events or long matches in general.

 

Is anybody else really excited by the prospect of Chris Jericho having a match with Minoru Suzuki? Jericho reinventing himself as middle-aged and crazy Terry Funk has worked far better than I ever imagined it would, and even if you don't think as I do that Suzuki is the best brawler in the world right now, he's the one guy on the roster who can give as good as he gets.