WWE TV 07/06 - 07/12 I'm not a citizen. I'm a civil engineer. A graduated one. Better than you.

[MoS]

The only possible redeemable thing that can come out of this eye for eye match is if someone sets that match to this song - 

 

[MoS]

I will see the match later today - it's early morning here and I need to go to bed- but really happy for Keith Lee. They should have put the rocket on his back in December itself, and I am glad they have done so now. He has so much charisma, excellent presence, I hope they book him the way they booked Asuka in NXT. 

[The Thread Killer]

I'm more concerned they're going to book him the way they booked Asuka on the Main Roster.  But I guess not until he gets there, maybe.

[Coffey]

I think Keith Lee will be OK. They should have struck while the iron was hot instead of cooling him back down, but they don't let you go toe-to-toe with both Roman Reigns & Brock Lesnar, while you're still in NXT purgatory, without having faith in your future in WWE.

I would certainly prefer a future of WWE with someone like Keith Lee getting pushed on top than the likes of Adam Cole & Johnny Gargano. 

[MoS]

I have hope that he is left alone to dominate in NXT. What gives me hope is reading @C.S.'s summary of the Mark Henry interview with Austin, where Henry said Lee is excellent but is still a work in progress. Henry is a company man and I doubt he would say something like that unless he knew the higher-ups agreed. 

[KawadaSmile]

Well, Henry also hyped up Bianca and she is nowhere to be seen after losing to Charlotte, so let's be wary.

[KawadaSmile]

Look, not even a minute into Cole/Lee and I can already understand why that match got so criticised. Cole is considerably smaller than even the smallest dudes in the main roster, and there he is controlling Lee with a weak-ass headlock. I hope the rest of the match isn't like that.

[KawadaSmile]

Welp. Happy for Lee but it seems mandatory that the NXT Title follows a specific structure, even if it means going against all rationality. Cole can have a 20 minute match against Lee and have it competitive, for sure. But there's a reason why Bryan lost after a single F-5 against Lesnar. 

A match with such a size disparity has been done much better, and I'm not sure if HHH and HBK can understand what made those matches work.

[MoS]

Yeah, I am really happy for Lee but having watched the show now, I thought the match itself was a bit underwhelming. But I also thought the AEW 8 man was underwhelming, and that's also getting universal praise. 

[NintendoLogic]

56 minutes ago, KawadaSmile said:

Look, not even a minute into Cole/Lee and I can already understand why that match got so criticised. Cole is considerably smaller than even the smallest dudes in the main roster, and there he is controlling Lee with a weak-ass headlock. I hope the rest of the match isn't like that.

I don't know what you're talking about, bubba.

[MoS]

If Cole is 6 feet then I am Big Show

[sek69]

7 hours ago, MoS said:

I have hope that he is left alone to dominate in NXT. What gives me hope is reading @C.S.'s summary of the Mark Henry interview with Austin, where Henry said Lee is excellent but is still a work in progress. Henry is a company man and I doubt he would say something like that unless he knew the higher-ups agreed. 

 

That alarms me. On what planet is Keith F'N Lee still a work in progress unless they mean they haven't completely WWE-ized him yet?  Dude is better than nearly everyone on the main roster and the company thinks he still needs some time in the oven?

[MoS]

Oh I totally agree with that. I just got happy with it because it probably means he will have an extended run in NXT and won't be doing backstage main roster ninja skits anytime soon. Although a Bryan v. Lee match would rule so hard. 

[cm funk]

I would guess Lee has a decent run but I feel he's keeping the belt warm for Kross and getting moved to the main roster.   In the interim there's plenty of challengers and I can see him being a fighting champion who defends on TV every other week.  There's natural matchups to revisit and also a lot of fresh ones.

I do think NXT has always been at it's best with a heel champion

[sek69]

Wrestling in general is better with a heel champ IMO. It may be from me being raised on a steady diet of Harley and Ric coming to town to make the local hero look good, but there's a lot more that can be done booking wise. Babyface runs tend to quickly turn into "challenger of the month and/or PPV cycle". 

 

[Phil Schneider]

I saw Adam Cole work Jimmy Jacobs in EVOLVE and Jacobs worked a David vs Goliath match with him, with Jimmy Jacobs as Goliath

[Kadaveri]

Zack Sabre Jr is billed as 6'0 by New Japan, here he is with Adam Cole.

[sek69]

Not to mention if he was anywhere near his billed weight (210) at his height, he'd look like Taz.

[Ricky Jackson]

14 minutes ago, Kadaveri said:

Zack Sabre Jr is billed as 6'0 by New Japan, here he is with Adam Cole.

Jesus, that's like Andre standing on a crate being interviewed by Vince Jr in the 70s 

[NintendoLogic]

I've never understood the affinity some fans have for long-term heel champions. Wrestling is escapist entertainment. Why would I want to watch something centered around someone the viewers are supposed to consider unlikable and undeserving? If I want to see vice unpunished and virtue unrewarded, I can just turn on the news. The real world is shitty enough. I don't need my entertainment to be shitty.

[MoS]

I think it was @Jimmy Redman who articulated why I feel long face runs being better than long heel runs, everything else (booking, characters etc) being roughly equal: face title reigns are just a nicer experience. It might be predictable, but at lesst it's a happy prediction. 

[sek69]

23 minutes ago, NintendoLogic said:

I've never understood the affinity some fans have for long-term heel champions. Wrestling is escapist entertainment. Why would I want to watch something centered around someone the viewers are supposed to consider unlikable and undeserving? If I want to see vice unpunished and virtue unrewarded, I can just turn on the news. The real world is shitty enough. I don't need my entertainment to be shitty.

 

In my case, before the era where WWE had an antagonistic relationship with fans, the booking was usually done where vice was punished and virtue was rewarded. Even if the hero didn't win the title in the end, he was able to hand some sort of comeuppance to the heel. 

The key was that the heel champ had to be someone capable of elevating others around him. Look at how Jericho's run as first AEW champ was so crucial. He made everyone around him look like a star, and if they were already a star they looked even better.  IHMO, Moxley's run as champ hasn't  been as great since he doesn't seem to have that same ability. 

I totally get someone who grew up through Hun-tor's reign of terror and all the hopelessness of WWE heel champ booking not seeing the appeal of a good heel run, but all I can say is that it wasn't always  that way.

[sek69]

Also, that's not to say a babyface triumphing in the end isn't one of the most emotional moments wrestling can create. However part of what makes that a strong moment is having a strong heel champ to overcome in the first place.

[cm funk]

I thought Sabre was taller than 6 flat.  Maybe it's because he's so skinny and gangly, and he looks tall by NJPW standards, but I really thought he was a few inches taller than that and I don't see any reason for NJPW to underbill him

[C.S.]

On 7/9/2020 at 7:44 AM, MoS said:

I have hope that he is left alone to dominate in NXT. What gives me hope is reading @C.S.'s summary of the Mark Henry interview with Austin, where Henry said Lee is excellent but is still a work in progress. Henry is a company man and I doubt he would say something like that unless he knew the higher-ups agreed. 

On 7/9/2020 at 2:58 PM, sek69 said:

That alarms me. On what planet is Keith F'N Lee still a work in progress unless they mean they haven't completely WWE-ized him yet?  Dude is better than nearly everyone on the main roster and the company thinks he still needs some time in the oven?

Roman Reigns lives on the same planet.