Stuff no one does anymore?

[Eduardo]

If I am remembering correctly, I think it was around 1995 or 1996, one of the WCW commentators mentioned it on WCW television that they were abandoning that rule.

[Loss]

WCW abandoned it at the end of 1997. The WWF never had the rule.

[Strummer]

I'm pretty sure WCW dropped that rule because the WWF kept making fun of them for it during the MNW period.

[med2089]

I can't say I can remember the last time I saw the atomic/Manhattan drop combination, complete with the wacky selling. That always got over huge.

[JerryvonKramer]

Why was the atomic drop always such a babyface move?

 

These were babyface moves:

 

Atomic drop

Gorilla press

Normal bodyslam

 

Especially in WWF.

[med2089]

I feel like the atomic drop was a babyface move because it meant that the heels were getting their comeuppance after a bunch of cheating during the heat segment (as IIRC, such things would generally happen during the face on fire segment). It gave the crowd the chance to get some laughs at the heel's expense.

 

The gorilla press was just meant to be such an amazing feat of strength that the crowd had no choice but to pop for it. I don't seem to remember a lot of heels doing it, though I'm sure I'll be quickly corrected on that.

 

The normal bodyslam baffles me, though. I'm not sure why that would be such a babyface move.

[JerryvonKramer]

I've got a feeling a really mundane reason for the bodyslam is that in those days the heels ALWAYS led the matches and so your skilled wrestlers would be heels. Ergo, babyfaces were likely to have more basic offense as they were generally lesser wrestlers.

 

I think people like The Barbarian did bodyslams whether as face or as heel.

[MJH]

The gorilla press was just meant to be such an amazing feat of strength that the crowd had no choice but to pop for it. I don't seem to remember a lot of heels doing it, though I'm sure I'll be quickly corrected on that.

I watched the first Raw from 1998 (1/5) last night, and Faarooq picked Shamrock up for a press, didn't extend his arms, but rather dropped down to his knees with his head in Shamrock's mid-section as a rib-crusher-sort-of-thing. I've never seen or heard of that being done by anyone else and whilst it's not related to the time you're thinking of, just thought I'd pass it on as it fits the thread in a way.

 

Babyface Shawn did like to bump the press-slam, often taking it to the floor as a cut-off even on spot shows if I remember correctly from Jerad/JHM's great handheld write-up a few years back.

[jdw]

Heels did do the Atomic Drop. Harley used it from time to time, but Harley used everything. Ivan Koloff used it. I suspect a few more.

 

They typically used the Reverse Atomic Drop as the more Heel move, while the Atomic Drop was the more Face move due to one being for Cheating and the other for Stooging.

 

John

[Matt D]

Heels did Gorilla Press in Mid South, both Volkoff into the ribbreaker and Butch Reed

[JerryvonKramer]

When was the last time someone used the full nelson as a finisher? When was the last time someone did a full nelson at all? Or the bearhug?

 

For some reason, I imagine Ivan Koloff did both those moves as finishers at one point or another.

[Gregor]

When was the last time someone used the full nelson as a finisher? When was the last time someone did a full nelson at all? Or the bearhug?

 

For some reason, I imagine Ivan Koloff did both those moves as finishers at one point or another.

Chris Masters used the full nelson as his finisher. It was pushed pretty heavily; once a week he'd offer someone the chance to try to break it.

[NintendoLogic]

When was the last time someone used the full nelson as a finisher?

Chris Masters.

 

EDIT: Crap, beaten to it.

 

So when was the last time you saw a babyface (male) manager?

[Ricky Jackson]

Jose Lothario? Probably someone else I'm forgetting.

[Tim Evans]

Sinister Minister in ECW?

 

And Mason Ryan also uses the Full Nelson

[Loss]

What happened to Umaga's handler guy?

[Tim Evans]

He split up with Umaga after he was getting more over than Umaga. Then became the GM for ECW and was fired. Came back for 1 superstars show last year to manage Tyson Kidd.

[Mad Dog]

Armando Estrada.

 

He did Colt Cabana's podcast in the early days. He was running a restaurant but it closed due to the economy.

 

I think they got pissed off at him for getting too much of a face reaction.

[FLIK]

He split up with Umaga after he was getting more over than Umaga. Then became the GM for ECW and was fired. Came back for 1 superstars show last year to manage Tyson Kidd.

You're forgetting his really shitty run as an actual wrestler, one of the last things he did in the company was feuding with Colin Delaney during the briefe period he was around.

 

I think they got pissed off at him for getting too much of a face reaction.

Yeah, always thought that was one of the stupidest things ever. Guy could have been mega over for years as a non wrestler had they not fucked w the character and just let him go. Guy screwed himself in the end tho by getting in such great shape that there was no way they weren't gonna force him into the ring.

[cm funk]

So when was the last time you saw a babyface (male) manager?

In the WWE Ranjin Singh managing The Great Khali. Last one I remember before that was Paul Bearer's short stint with Undertaker in 04. Before that you'd probably have to go back to Paul Ellering or Michael Hayes managing the Hardyz during the attitude era.

 

The deal with Estrada was they moved him out of the picture during the McMahon v. Trump buildup (had Lashley destroy him), and then after that they just had Umaga as Vince and Shane's muscle for a few months (this was the crazy period where bald Vince won the ECW title). Estrada was off TV for months until he was brought back as the ECW GM.

[Jingus]

nobody does the "Japanese arm drag" anymore

It still happens on the indies, and it can be a surprisingly dangerous move sometimes. I knew a guy who took a double Japanese armdrag, landed on his head, got partial paralysis and took like two years to recover fully. Another time, two friends of mine had a miscommunication; one guy thought they were doing a Japanese armdrag, the other guy thought they were doing a standard one, and BOOM, armdrag driver. Fortunately nobody got hurt that time, it actually looked pretty cool.

 

Not neccisarly a move but when did wrestling stop having "over the top rope a automatic DQ"? I seem to remember WCW did it into the mid 90s.

Did WCW do it consistently until the NWO era, or was there a period in the early 90s when they stopped? I seem to remember that Bill Watts brought that rule back out of retirement when he took over, but I'm not sure.

 

I can't say I can remember the last time I saw the atomic/Manhattan drop combination, complete with the wacky selling. That always got over huge.

Shawn Michaels did that one a lot. It never quite looked right because HBK could no longer bend his knees enough to kneel properly, but he did it.

 

The normal bodyslam baffles me, though. I'm not sure why that would be such a babyface move.

The standard bodyslam is often kind of a humdrum-looking move. Not much motion, not much impact. Unless you're doing it on a guy bigger than you or unless the guy taking the move can really sell his ass off, it comes off as boring sometimes. Heels historically often tended to be big monsters or annoying little assholes who specialized in pinball bumping and theatrical overselling, so they tend to make the move look more impressive when they take it. But nowadays it's seen as such an obsolete piece of old-school offense that some audiences will shit on the scoopslam. I still remember a Mike Knox vs Little Guido match, where Mike did five bodyslams in a row and you could hear the crowd becoming audibly less and less impressed with Knox each time he repeated the same basic move.

 

You're forgetting his really shitty run as an actual wrestler, one of the last things he did in the company was feuding with Colin Delaney during the briefe period he was around.

Don't forget that Estrada was one of two unfortunate souls to wrestle BRADEN "KNOCK-KNOCK" WALKER as well.

 

Last one I remember before that was Paul Bearer's short stint with Undertaker in 04.

Bearer also managed Taker again back in 2010 briefly before turning on him again, but that was so short that it probably doesn't count. It's kinda difficult to keep a babyface manager over, especially if he doesn't have a heel manager on the other side of the ring to play off of. Cornette talked about how dull that role could be sometimes, because there's just not much to do. Having done it myself, he's right; aside from cheerleading your wrestlers and taking the occasional sympathy beatdown, there isn't a whole lot you can try at ringside with being a face manager.

[Mad Dog]

NWA Hollywood currently does the over the top rope DQ rule. That's the only promotion I know of that currently does it.

[El-P]

Not neccisarly a move but when did wrestling stop having "over the top rope a automatic DQ"? I seem to remember WCW did it into the mid 90s.

Did WCW do it consistently until the NWO era, or was there a period in the early 90s when they stopped? I seem to remember that Bill Watts brought that rule back out of retirement when he took over, but I'm not sure.

 

They mentionned getting rid of the rule sometime in 1998. I don't think it was officialy done before.

[JerryvonKramer]

Speaking of DQs, I've got a small question:

 

What is the rule on guys using foreign objects OUTSIDE the ring in a normal match?

 

I've seen lots of matches where they'll do a chair shot right in front of the ref and he lets it go.

[Mad Dog]

I think outside the ring is at the discretion of the referee.