Current WWE

[Steenalized]

 

AAA sure seems to be under the impression that ADR doesn't have a non-compete, which even if he doesn't WWE still owns the name.

 

What if he doesn't have a non-compete though, or what if it doesn't apply outside the U.S.? These tweets are from an AAA announcer. Why would AAA's (I assume) equivalent of Jim Ross post blatantly false information?

 

I'm almost certain WWE owns the name though. Personally, I'd rename him Alberto Don Caras (assuming they can get away with even that).

 

I don't know Mexican court's take on injunctions and non-competes, but there's a good chance it wouldn't apply outside the US, at least effectively.

[Strummer]

anyone else mark out hearing Orndorff's old theme? And what the hell was he saying to Heyman?

[sek69]

WWE tried to enforce non competes internationally until Brock defeated them in court when he went to New Japan and they tried to stop him.

[Steenalized]

WWE tried to enforce non competes internationally until Brock defeated them in court when he went to New Japan and they tried to stop him.

Dollars to donuts they can't do anything about him working in Mexico. But if ADR wants to work in America, it's a bigger issue. Same with Brock or anyone else who tries to forego the non-compete.

[Jmare007]

 

Well after that Cena promo I know Will, Charles and Dylan are gonna be waiting for a big surprise at Summerslam.

 

Anything less would be a huge letdown.

 

 

Expecting fantasy booking ideas to come to fruition is never fun though. You might end up not liking a great match just because it didn't end like you'd fantasy booked it.

[artDDP]

Are these the times you have Bix?

 

Bell to bell times for SummerSlam as of right now: Cena vs. Lesnar = 25 minutes;

 

Brie vs. Stephanie = 15 minutes (both have been training hard with the goal of having a good match); Reigns vs. Orton = 20 minutes (what the hell?!?!); Ambrose vs. Rollins = 15 minutes; A.J. vs. Paige = 12 minutes; Rusev vs. Swagger = 12 minutes; Jericho vs. Wyatt = 15 minutes; and Ziggler vs. Miz = 10 minutes. That's how the show is laid out, too, albeit in reverse order, obviously.

 

That's 124 minutes on a 3 hour show. Sounds highly unlikely to me unless Ziggler/Miz or AJ/Paige gets bumped to pre-show. And even then it's a lot more than what they usually do on PPVs.

Well, they could if they cut out all the backstage crap and stupid vignettes they've no doubt got planned with whatever celebrities happened to want to bring their kids backstage.

 

Maybe it's just me but this angle didn't need this. Pretty obvious they are taking petty shots at Bryan here

I kinda got that impression with the comment about how "puny" Bryan was. Similar to Triple H calling Chris Jericho "that sawed-off midget" and Chris Masters "The Incredible Shrinking Man."

[Coffey]

I would have the Roman Reigns Vs. Randy Orton match start with a Superman Punch, that drapes Orton over the bottom rope for the running dropkick. Then he staggers to his feet & eats a Spear for a clean pin in the middle in about 2-minutes.

 

If they try to do a fucking 20 minute match with Randy Orton doing headlocks, Reigns is dead. DEAD. He'll be just another guy, like Sheamus was tonight. Nothing special, just another guy crammed into vanilla, forgettable matches that are a dime-a-dozen every week. He needs to be different & stand out.

[goodhelmet]

 

 

Well after that Cena promo I know Will, Charles and Dylan are gonna be waiting for a big surprise at Summerslam.

 

Anything less would be a huge letdown.

 

 

Expecting fantasy booking ideas to come to fruition is never fun though. You might end up not liking a great match just because it didn't end like you'd fantasy booked it.

 

 

I know. Still... they like to do big angles at Summerslam. None would be bigger.

[sek69]

I know they've done the "Cena overcomes the monster" deal a million times, but I don't recall him so explicitly stating he's going to use heel tactics to win before. I did like how they covered Cena winning before by stating Brock wasn't 100% and it took everything Cena had to win, so with Brock healthy Cena is facing certain doom.

[Ricky Jackson]

Cena being part of the birthday segment, where Hogan revisited his NWO turn, could be a great bit of foreshadowing. Probably not though

[Matt D]

Orndorff is wonderfully delusional about his role in the history of the business.

[rovert]

One of my happiest days as a Wrestling fan here

SignedSteenSigned

[Marty]

Well you would think Brie has to be going over now.

 

They are kind over complicating this feud. It was going just fine

 

I somewhat disagree. HHH and Steph have done as good as possible, but Brie (heck, both Bellas) bring about no sympathy here. They're trying to go the "Brie is a woman scorned, you gotta feel for her" route. And, admittedly, Brie's big takedown got a big pop. I still don't know how things will turn out Sunday as far as reaction goes (LA crowds are unpredictable), but as WrestleCrap-ish as the angle may be, I can sorta see why they went with it.

[WingedEagle]

I loved Raw last night. Which means I loved everything relating to Lesnar/Cena that it more than made up for the weak filler throughout the rest of the show. Heyman was out of this world again, Cena took a crowd that 2 hours into the show barely cared enough to boo him and mad himself a babyface again while breaking out of his standard promo, and the closing segment was completely predictable. Which was a damn good thing. This is the hottest anything's felt since Bryan's peak heading into Mania, and in a totally different way.

 

On the other hand, every week it feels more and more like Reigns will need to be incredibly protected. Its probably too late to Goldberg him, but short matches and no speaking other than screaming before the superman punch feel like the way to go. At this stage he feels awkward and exposed when carrying things for too long. I think Loss mentioned it a while back, but unless they want to risk repeating the run to Mania this year, they may have to hold off Bryan's return until after that point, because Reigns isn't showing much that makes me think he can keep a crowd behind him at that level. If they're committed to him long term they need to see it through and try to make it work, but pushing him on this accelerated timeline is going to come with some bumps in the road.

[FedEx227]

I've read a lot of people saying the ending was super predictable, which, why has that become a bad thing? That ending is 100% exactly how you should build up the event. I didn't even need Brock F5ing one of the legends, it didn't matter because he made them all shit their pants. Cena came out to stop him and Lesnar just walked away, we'll do it on Sunday, I don't need to touch you now.

 

I thought it was fucking perfect.

[Coffey]

I've read a lot of people saying the ending was super predictable, which, why has that become a bad thing?

 

The reason is because some fans are never happy, no matter what. Fans are fickle. The same people saying that it was too predictable are the same ones saying that Brock beating The Undertaker at Wrestlemania was stupid, even though no one thought he had a prayer.

 

I see people turning on Brock already on other forums. I don't know if it's because he's part-time, because he ended the streak or what but it's really funny to me. The guy that I think is the most entertaining on the show, that is a great wrestler & has a genuine aura about him, something that no one else on the show has, and they're trying to find reasons to hate him instead of just enjoying the ride.

[Robert S]

WWE tried to enforce non competes internationally until Brock defeated them in court when he went to New Japan and they tried to stop him.

Didn't Brock's lawsuit cover the USA as well? I think the idea was that the court considered a seven (?) year non-compete clause ridiculous. I think that allowed him to compete in MMA (which was included in the non-compete) in the States as well.

[Sidebottom]

Predictable doesn't mean a poor outcome, it's all in the execution. Most classic films have predictable (or logical, if you will) conclusions. Same goes for wrestling, some of the greatest angles of all time have been telegraphed quite clearly.

[cm funk]

 

 

 

 

I'd say it was mainly due to them wanting him to be the next Hispanic superstar, then booking him the exact opposite way a Hispanic star should be.

 

How should a Hispanic star be booked? Serious question because we discussed this very topic on a soon to be released podcast of Booking the WWE.

 

 

I still want you to answer this question.

 

 

Honestly I always think how Loss once talked about how refreshing it would be if a wrestler could be gay without it being part of his gimmick, and think that could apply to Black/Hispanic wrestlers. Why couldn't Alberto be pushed like any strong heel, just one who happened to be Mexican? No Speedy Gonzales style exaggerated accents, no one beating it down your throats that he's MEXICO'S GREATEST EXPORT, MAGGLE! It also doesn't help the writers seem to have no idea how to write for a Hispanic character despite them insisting that's the core of his gimmick.

 

 

I don't see the point in having a wrestler who just happens to be gay without it being part of his gimmick, as if it's not part of his gimmick it serves no use.

 

"While I'm a wrestling bus driver, I'm also gay, but that's not relevant. So ignore it, but don't."

"What are you telling me for?"

 

A wrestler who just happens to be gay without it being part of his gimmick would just be a normal bloke wouldn't it? And that'd be dull. There's enough dull blokes in wrestling. If anything mentioning someone's gay makes an issue that doesn't need to be made. Sexuality doesn't make someone anything, it's just a thing. Like a chicken wing.

 

I mean, why would we know he's gay? Why would he tell us? Much like why would someone tell anyone they're straight? I mean, sexual orientation isn't an event or interesting. It's just a thing, like having blonde hair or blue eyes. Then after telling us it's part of his gimmick. If it's not part of anything, why even reveal it? He'd just be a normal bloke, like any number of normal blokes who aren't made more or less interesting by their sexual orientation. And normal in wrestling is boring.

 

 

Because if done well it would be a great character and completely different from anything done in wrestling before? It's realistic and relatable to people who live in the real world, where there are gay and lesbian people who are *shock* normal people who don't bash you over the head with their sexuality and aren't over the top gay steroptypes. I thought that they were going in that direction with Darren Young but they never went anywhere with it.

 

Expecting some sophisticated writing on a touchy subject is way too much to expect from the WWE though. It would be cool to see, but I have no great expectations from the creative end of their company, and when we do get some subtle and nuanced writing I'm pleasantly surprised

[Coffey]

Yeah, this is the same company that recently (as in not aeons ago), dropped literal shit on AJ Lee & had Stephanie McMahon projectile vomit on Vickie Guerrero. So expecting something to be done in a sophisticated way is pretty much a pipe dream at this point.

[cm funk]

Heel or face, ADR's gimmick was uninspired.

 

JBL updated the Million Dollar Man gimmick by bringing in the over-the-top entrance and giving it a "Southern Business Man" twist that brought the "Cocky Rich Guy" gimmick a flavor that had not yet been done before. It was an obvious callback to a classic heel, but there was enough freshness to it that it got over.

 

What did Creative or Del Rio bring to the gimmick that JBL or DiBiase didn't? A different car? An announcer (doing the same schtick that Armando Estrada did better for Umaga or Sharmell did for King Booker) instead of a Virgil? A scarf instead of a cowboy hat or Million Dollar Belt? DiBiase's greed inspired many of his feuds and storylines (buying the title instead of winning it fairly, treating Virgil like shit, trying to come between Dusty and Dustin, etc.). JBL's wealth and borderline racist taunts against Eddie Guerrero and later Rey Mysterio made things personal in his feuds. But how did Del Rio's gimmick or even the idea of his "Destiny" play into his feuds with Edge? With Christian? With Cena? With Punk? With Big Show?

 

Heel or face, unrealistic portrayal of Latinos or not, Del Rio's character lacked any teeth, whitebread masquerading as pumpernickel, completely devoid of any meaningful trajectory. Del Rio was failed by the writing team just as much as his "inability to connect with the audience." Someone wrote they believed Del RIo was "just an entrance" - unfortunately, when that entrance had been done to death already, he wasn't even that.

 

I thought Del Rio's character and presentation was great until they went over the top with the "this is my destiny" shit and it was clear that they were never going to book him in alignment with that. You can't write/book a character like that and have him come up short when it comes to being THE guy. He would beat practically everybody, clean most of the time, by submission, and if not clean he would do it in a crafty heel way.....but they never went all the way with him, and that really hurt him. The first time he actually won the title it was for 3 weeks or something, interrupted Punk's run, and was only done because they had a Mexico tour coming up and wanted the strap on their only Mexican guy. They went from having this great character who debuted breaking Rey Mysterio's arm and was over right out of the gate....and slowly pissed it down the drain. By the time he won the Rumble (by eliminating Santino last? really?) and curtain jerked WM and LOST he was fucked and had been pretty directionless ever since. His face turn might have actually worked if it wasn't so horribly done, and when they aborted that and did that double turn with him and Ziggler I thought "ok, they're getting back on track" and then they botched that too

 

I'm reminded of a recent Jim Ross podcast I listened to where he broke out that old "wins and losses don't matter" talking point, which is f'n retarded, especially in the context of what he was talking about. "folks, this is good ol' JR, telling you wins and losses don't matter" when talking about Jericho beating Wyatt in their first match, and how "there's gonna be a payoff of Wyatt beating Jericho. Is it predictable? yes. But Jericho is putting him over"........like, has JR gone legit mental? The Wyatt character was killed by losing to Cena at WM. He's salvagable, but that really hurt him and killed the gimmick. That whole feud did. He should not have lost to anybody, not this early into his run. The Destroyer and Eater of Worlds eats a clean loss at his first WM? Now he's not special, he's just another guy. Wins and losses DO matter, despite how WWE likes to book shit, and it's laughable how JR will still white knight for their booking and talk down to fans like we're idiots and "trust us, we know what's good for ya" with his mentality. Wins and losses, done WELL, work. Seemingly two of JR's favorite wrestlers are Undertaker and Mankind. Why did Undertaker get as over as he did? because HE NEVER LOST. And when Mankind beat him on a few PPVs in their feud it was a BIG DEAL because NOBODY EVER BEAT UNDERTAKER. Why did Cactus Jack/Mankind get so over despite almost never winning any of his big matches? Because he had violent wars and at the end if he got pinned you didn't think "he's a loser" you thought "holy shit that is one tough SOB". All of his most famous and memorable matches, did he actually win any of them? So yeah, wins and losses absolutely matter, but done well and with some thought put into it.

 

I don't watch a lot of modern NJPW, but I watch some and I follow the product. I like how they book when it comes to wins and losses. Top guys lose clean sometimes, and when they do it matters. They don't just trade wins and losses and act like shit doesn't matter. There is some unpredictability to it which makes it exciting and interesting. Tanahashi and Okada don't always win. Nakamura doesn't always win. AJ Styles, the champion, did well in G1 but didn't get to the finals. I like that. That's something I've always liked about the puro mentality of booking, which is a style of booking that WWE has never seemed to grasp

[shakla]

I'm tired of these distraction finishes where they play the "distractor's" theme, Titantron and lighting while the match is in progress. Thinking in a kayfabe logic, it's just unprofessional to play themes with action in the ring, unless, maybe, it's an authority figure. Case in point, Paige distracting AJ in the Eva Marie match on Raw. It would have worked fine if Paige came out sans her entrance. Although I can sorta understand playing the theme to have a distraction, but needing to keep Paige on the ramp to do the poem, still a stretch, that's more production thinking than kayfabe.

[cm funk]

 

WWE tried to enforce non competes internationally until Brock defeated them in court when he went to New Japan and they tried to stop him.

Didn't Brock's lawsuit cover the USA as well? I think the idea was that the court considered a seven (?) year non-compete clause ridiculous. I think that allowed him to compete in MMA (which was included in the non-compete) in the States as well.

 

 

This, and also that WWE was trying to claim that the NFL and NJPW were "direct competition" which was ridiculous

 

WWE non-compete clauses are pretty much unenforceable. I'm fairly certain Del Rio can go work in AAA and there will be no consequences other than maybe wasting money on lawyers and a frivolous lawsuit. They already have a potential headache with Mysterio right now as well as all the other issues the company has at the moment. There seems to be a lot of bad blood between Del Rio and WWE right now, so they might be super petty about it and go to war with him and AAA (and the El Rey network show gives them something to work with on the competition claim), but they also have to worry about Del Rio possibly counter-suing them with racism charges which is the last thing they want

[cm funk]

I'm tired of these distraction finishes where they play the "distractor's" theme, Titantron and lighting while the match is in progress. Thinking in a kayfabe logic, it's just unprofessional to play themes with action in the ring, unless, maybe, it's an authority figure. Case in point, Paige distracting AJ in the Eva Marie match on Raw. It would have worked fine if Paige came out sans her entrance. Although I can sorta understand playing the theme to have a distraction, but needing to keep Paige on the ramp to do the poem, still a stretch, that's more production thinking than kayfabe.

 

Similar to this.....why did they play Brock's theme at the end of the show?

[shakla]

 

I'm tired of these distraction finishes where they play the "distractor's" theme, Titantron and lighting while the match is in progress. Thinking in a kayfabe logic, it's just unprofessional to play themes with action in the ring, unless, maybe, it's an authority figure. Case in point, Paige distracting AJ in the Eva Marie match on Raw. It would have worked fine if Paige came out sans her entrance. Although I can sorta understand playing the theme to have a distraction, but needing to keep Paige on the ramp to do the poem, still a stretch, that's more production thinking than kayfabe.

 

Similar to this.....why did they play Brock's theme at the end of the show?

 

That's a good question. Kinda in line with how they increasingly play the "loser's" theme after a post-match attack. Winner's theme plays, loser attacks/music stops, loser/attacker's theme plays.