Summerslam 2014

[Dylan Waco]

Cena shouldn't even be on Raw

[bradhindsight]

And with five weeks until NOC, there isn't any reason for him to be. Agreed

[jushin muta liger]

I only got to see the half of the show until I got home cause I was somewhere without wifi.

 

Nonetheless, I enjoyed it and Brock's squash of Cena reminded of Vader when he was in UWFi. I was thinking a killer way of booking Brock is that his matches are always under UWFi or "hybrid rules" with the finish being a KO or a submission. Heyman can say that since he's the champ, he dictates the rules and make a deal with the Authority. Watching the match last night, ref stoppage would've got Brock the belt and give Cena a reason to challenge for NOC.

 

EDITED: for grammar reasons

[Cross Face Chicken Wing]

I kind of liked watching Lesnar just beat the shit out of someone for 15 minutes. Maybe they should keep doing that until Bryan returns and tries to slay the giant.

 

Hell, bring in the Mulkey's for a PPV main event and hype it as "Can the Mulkey's survive 10 minutes in the ring with Lesnar before dying or suffering permanent dismemberment?"

 

I'd pay $9.99 to watch that.

[Russellmania]

the best thing they could do tonight is have no Cena on RAW and have Lesnar come out and squash random fools throughout the night like back when he first debuted just to put over the fact that there is NO ONE who can stop him.

[anarchistxx]

Think people are being a bit harsh on Orton here. It is a fifteen minute PPV match, of course he is going to get his spots in, especially wrestling Roman reigns who has very few spots of his own as of yet to ramp up the excitement. He jobbed completely clean, don't see what the problem is. Less than a year ago Orton was beating Cena clean as a whistle, he isn't some no mark midcarder who stole the spotlight from the upcoming star - from a storyline perspective and in the 'WWE Universe' (urgh) he is a big deal, even if most smart fans consider him to be a bit stale and dull.

 

The only alternative was to run pretty much a squash, and with them doing that in the main event it was prettu unfeasible.

 

Skipped through most of the show myself as have no interest in the likes of Bray Wyatt, Miz etc. The two divas matches were both pretty cool, especially Steph/Brie, they got me with the twist but I wasn't paying too much attention and have seen very little of the product recently. The main event was alright, wasn't as shocked with how it went as some people on here. It was pretty similar in concept to their first match, which saw Lesnar decimating Cena and was a lot more shocking and impactful, although that was ruined by having Cena beat him out of the blue. This had the correct ending but as a match was a lot worse, even if Brock and Heyman absolutely ruled in it.

[DMJ]

So many thoughts, but I'll ask this one...

 

Was that the best lumberjack match ever? I understand the argument that it didn't "honor the stip," but when honoring the stip usually means we get the same lumberjack match every time, I'd much rather get what we saw last night. It started out traditionally, with the heel getting tossed back in a couple of times, then Ambrose getting tossed back in, and then, just chaos and Ambrose taking people out left and right. When Rollins was headed to the back, everyone I was watching with (myself included) were shouting about how "it can't end this way," so upset, and when the Usos & company dragged him back, we were cheering. The match turned a room of 30 year olds (mostly non-fans who just showed up to drink beers) into little kids.

 

My knowledge of wrestling history is admittedly limited to mostly WWF post-90' and some WCW and I know lumberjack matches are a pretty old thing - but was that the best lumberjack match ever? If not ever, is it the best the WWE has produced?

[Russellmania]

that was the best Lumberjack match I've ever seen for sure. And I don't buy the "it didn't honor the stip" argument at all. In the long run the stip was integral to the match, because as you said, they did stop Rollins from running. That sequence with the dirty deeds counter, lariat, and curb stomp was unreal.

[Loss]

I think in their own way, they did honor the stip. The lumberjack match is now a match that will involve lots of crazy brawling with everyone around the ring more than it is a way to keep the wrestlers confined. Plus, since the lumberjack match failed to keep them in the ring, I suspect the next step (or at least the eventual step) will be to put them in a cage.

[cowboy hats]

Was (pleasantly) shocked the match ended with a pinfall. At several times I thought the ref would call it all off cuz chaos. Kane involvement knocks this down a bit, though (despite Goldust getting in his way). Is there another good lumberjack match that doesn't involve Kane? That might be worth a look.

[shoe]

I think in their own way, they did honor the stip. The lumberjack match is now a match that will involve lots of crazy brawling with everyone around the ring more than it is a way to keep the wrestlers confined. Plus, since the lumberjack match failed to keep them in the ring, I suspect the next step (or at least the eventual step) will be to put them in a cage.

Now if they do get the cage match . The breaking the stip won't bother me.

[FedEx227]

the best thing they could do tonight is have no Cena on RAW and have Lesnar come out and squash random fools throughout the night like back when he first debuted just to put over the fact that there is NO ONE who can stop him.

 

I personally think the best thing they can do (given their new business model) is not have Brock on Raw whatsoever. You want to see Brock? You buy the damn Network. You want to see the current WWE Champion? He wrestlers on the Network only.

[KrisZ]

I think in their own way, they did honor the stip. The lumberjack match is now a match that will involve lots of crazy brawling with everyone around the ring more than it is a way to keep the wrestlers confined. Plus, since the lumberjack match failed to keep them in the ring, I suspect the next step (or at least the eventual step) will be to put them in a cage.

 

It was brought up on our postshow last night that Hell in the Cell is perfect for them

[Matt D]

It's weird to me that they're not using Cesaro (maybe with a secondary belt) as the Heyman guy stand in for Brock while he's off Raw. He could be the herald of galactus, basically.

[Guest Eduardo James]

Dean's going away for a little while to film a movie. I wonder if Reigns is going to move on to Rollins and then Triple H.

[Shining Wiz]

Just saw the main event.....Cena took an ass kicking. You know it's bad when the crowd starts to feel sympathy for the heel in a match.

[Superstar Sleeze]

Finally finished Summerslam 2014, I don't think anybody on this board declared this the best Summerslam of All Time, but on my twitter feed there was definitely that hyperbole, but I don't even see how this was better than last year, which had two MOTYCs (Punk/Lesnar was my WWE MOTY). This year had one match that really knocked it out of the park (Cena/Lesnar), a fun, fun Rusev/Swagger match and a collection of good, but not great matches. It was basically a barrage of *** matches. It was probably one of the most consistent PPVs of all time, but it lacked the highs that other PPVs have, which probably have lower lows.

Ziggler/Miz - I am a sucker for matches with simple character hooks like "Dont punch my beautiful face". It is an easy way to either create two payoffs or make the finish extra sweet. It also allows for a good story at the outset. Ziggler is much better as a face. He has a lot of standard babyface offense and has made his big bumps into a great sympathy device. Miz would be so better off as a manager, but we have to suck it up that he is a wrestler. How come heels dont cheat anymore? Why doesn't Miz eyerake or choke? Superkick made me pop, but should have been the finish because the rest of the match was forgettable. The secondary titles are so meaningless. They should be on Rollins, Ambrose or Reigns.

Paige/AJ - It is so WWE to discover a pop culture term years late, totally misuse it and shove it down out throats. Hogan/Savage are frenemies. Paige/AJ are just enemies. The match was better than last month. It was short and sweet. I actually liked the finish.

 

Swagger/Rusev- U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A! For me this has overtaken Ambrose/Rollins as the second best feud in the company. I would say besides Cena/Lesnar, the only match that worked in a way that was actually befitting of the storyline. From the opening Pearl Harbor of Swagger backfiring and leading to seriously wounding the Russian Juggernaut, Rusev (sounds better than Bulgarian Brute) with the Patriot Lock, which fits in perfectly with last month's countout finish. Rusev's selling was bitchin' and Swagger is a great power wrestler. Then we get dueling body part psychology with Rusev targeting the injured ribs and the Swaggerbomb slowing Swagger down. The Patriot Lock was a false finish that a lot of people bit on. Rusev winning makes sense, but they have another smoldering babyface on their hands, which they should stoke rather than smother. I would put this right under MOTYC, but I would not argue against someone who has it higher.

 

Rollins/Ambrose - This was so disappointing for me. Pete, my man, I usually agree with you when wrestlers work a match contrary to the stipulations, but this was not Attitude Era wrestling where the stipulation was just randomly ignored. They actively fought through the stipulation. It showcased how out of control this feud was that all these wrestlers could not contain The Lunatic Fringe (Does anybody else always mistake that song for Pink Floyd's Young Lust?). They established that lumberjacks would actively contain the wrestlers until Ambrose lost it. Then when Rollins tries to escape they all carried him back. This part of the story was the highlight of the match. It was everything less I didn't like. The match started off oddly tepid. I never care for crowd brawling. Then the finish just seemed rush. It had a good hook, but not enough meat around it.

 

Wyatt/Y2J - They basically wrestled the same match as last month except with a couple bigger spots (DDT on apron and Top Rope Frankensteiner) and a different finish. It was still Wyatt dominated, Y2J flurry, Wyatt cutoff, rinse lather repeat. I am totally ok with this formula it just lacks heat because there is no real hook. Jericho would be better off in a workrate feud with the likes of Cesaro than a "violent" feud with Wyatt. What bugged me the most was that they did same flash knockout finish with the Codebreaker, but this time Wyatt was able to kick out (yes, he was supposed to get a rope break, but still it was lame). This leads to the big Wyatt finish. Again another fine match, but lame finish.

 

Stephanie/Brie - First, since it came up the Four Horsemen signal was because the Four Horsewomen (Rousey's crew) were at ringside. This match was so weird. It was a complete departure from the storyline, It was wrestled as if Brie was trying to prove herself to Stephanie. It was wrestled more like a heel championship title defense or a strong veteran taking on an underdog rookie. I acknowledge Stephanie is a giant compared to Brie. I would remiss not to mention that Stephanie looked damn fine in that outfit. The match we were given was actually very good match. Stephanie is the best heel (Lesnar is close) on the roster. Everybody else just sort of wrestles their match without trying to cheat, be a coward or be an asshole. I would have liked Stephanie to show a little more ass (no not that ass!) in terms of bumping and stooging, but here comes HHH to sell for Brie! LOL! Best moment of the night. I am disappointed by the turn because I just don't give a flying fuck about Nikki and really didn't want this to continue. I wanted Brie to get her payoff and everybody to go home happy. Brie vs. Nikki sounds like yuck!

 

Orton/Reigns - Another tepid match. I probably like Orton more than most. I think his offense looks good and violent like his headbutts, the Garvin stomp, but damn those chinlocks could kill off the hottest crowd nevermind this LA crowd. I think Reigns is fine at selling, but he needs to open these matches up hotter. He needs some offense at the outset to rouse the crowd. His finishing sequence takes too much time to set up. The Superman Punch and Spear should out of nowhere moves to set up his Powerbomb or something of the such. In my opinion, maybe somebody else can answer this better, but isnt the RKO one of the most protected finishes. It is usually one and done. So for Reigns to kick out clean was a pretty big deal for me. Yet seems totally underplayed on the web. The out of nowhere Spear was a great use as I mentioned above. I am not as down on Reigns chances as many since there is plenty of time to get him ready (and also fuck him, I realize) for the Lesnar match. I would actually argue that putting him in with Lesnar and doing a Hansen/Kobashi '93 match at Night of Champions is the way to go. Then build from there with Reigns getting closer and closer to beating Lesnar until Wrestlemania doing a strong sports build.

Lesnar/Cena - Shocking and awesome. The balliest move this company's made since 2011 CM Punk. I love they really shook things up Not as good as the Extreme Rules matches, but few are. I am sure this may sound pretentious and perhaps irritating, but I thought of this more like an angle than a match. It was awesome, awesome angle. I loved the Seahawks/Broncos vibe they went for. As a match, it falls short of MOTYC status for me and I would rate right around the Swagger/Rusev match. The closest two matches I could compare this to are Vader/Sting GAB '92 and Lesnar/Rock '02. In both though, while the monster heel came in on his first crack and mauled the top babyface star, it was still much more competitive than Lesnar/Cena. In both those matches too, each roster had much more depth in terms of talent to combat the new monster heel without stretching the bounds of credibility. This is one of the most shallow rosters since the mid-90s in terms of main event talent. Outside of Cena, they really have no true, bonafide main event stars. Bryan was on his way until he was derailed. In addition, to how you work around this new monster is how Cena reacts to this. Cena should not only be broken psychically, but mentally too. I would love to see Cena build himself back up from the ground up for the rubber Cena/Lesnar rubber match. How great would it be if they started showing Cena training in MMA to try to combat Lesnar ala Tito learning the figure-4 to break Valentine's leg? VINCE BOOK THIS SHIT!!!

 

I agree with everybody that outside a Cena rematch there nobody seems to Lesnar's league. Reigns needs more work in firing up a crowd in the ring. Ambrose is great as a frentic, wild man, but he seems like a Piper to me, not a Hogan. Rollins is their best chance to fill the void of a traditional working heel complete with cowardice. So many heels are bruisers it would be nice to have one to be a bumping machine with big offense ala Flair mold. I love Sheamus and Cesaro to death, but they are so dead in the water. If they double turned those two, I think they could resuscitate them, which rules out Sheamus. My dark horse is Jack Swagger. He has the size and amateur credentials to compete with Lesnar. He is the hottest he is ever been. Of course, the big problem is that he is totally utter dogshit on the mic. If I was running the show, I think you at the very least double push Riegns and Swagger and by December you got to choose. I would go so far to have a Swagger vs. Reigns match on a PPV to really see who the crowd is behind. Like I said this was before, this was a really, really ballsy move. They is much bigger chance they fuck this up, but it really could be a big boon.

It was a really consistently good show. There was one great match on the undercard with Rusev/Swagger. Steph/Brie was very good, but inconsistent with the story and finish I am apathetic too. There was a lot of good matches, but they are ultimately forgettable or disappointing. Cena/Lesnar was a big time match that gave Summerslam that big angle they love. As always coming off Summerslam, there is a lot of cool possibilities. In 2011 and 2013, they fucked it up. Third times a charm, right? Right? RIGHT?

[shoe]

Martin we do disagree on the stip. I still think it was abused and made Ambrose look like a stupid babyface. I haven't seem a lot of support for this. I'll say I'm in the minority, but minority doesn't mean wrong.

 

The rest of the card you summed up how I felt for the most part. I understand your complaints about Steph/Brie. I thought Reigns/Orton was the worst match of the night. One thing I haven't seem brought up is I love the Garvin stomp. Though their is no way Reigns should have taken the move. The GS is such a I've beaten your ass and I own u spot. Reigns doesn't 't need to look that weak.

[pol]

 

I think in their own way, they did honor the stip. The lumberjack match is now a match that will involve lots of crazy brawling with everyone around the ring more than it is a way to keep the wrestlers confined. Plus, since the lumberjack match failed to keep them in the ring, I suspect the next step (or at least the eventual step) will be to put them in a cage.

 

It was brought up on our postshow last night that Hell in the Cell is perfect for them

 

 

I would love to see a chain match, personally. Fits Dean's old-school character. The lack of blood would suck though.

[JaymeFuture]

Reigns was extremely green and heavily protected in the Shield. He absolutely deserves some credit for having a great look and charisma, which helped him get big crowd reactions in the Shield, but so much of that was booking and positioning in the group. For 2 years Reigns basically got to be the cleanup hitter for that group and was very much enhanced by teaming with two superworkers. All Reigns really had to be was a great hot tag within the group. WWE deciding that because he shined in that context that he would be a sure thing as a singles star is a logical fallacy, and them handpicking him to be their next big singles star when he hadn't even had a significant singles match is the opposite of an organic push.

 

This is a little bit of a harsh comparison, but: The hot tag clean-up hitter, handpicked because of his "look" that earns him a push as a surefire singles star despite some noticable voids. Where have I seen this before....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[mvc2 sentinel]

I didn't see anyone mention this, but it seemed to me that the suplexes from lesnar were meant to be a reference to suplex that caused the undertaker's concussion.

[Matt D]

At the very least, the Lumberjack match decision wasn't made in ignorance. Ambrose talks about it for a few seconds or so on the Shield special.

[Timbo Slice]

Yeah, they were trying to come up with ways to keep the crowd guessing as opposed to just having a confined match with your usual lumberjack shenanigans. They should be applauded for changing things up like that instead of them not confining themselves to the match. It made things fresh.