Grimmas Posted September 17, 2014 Report Share Posted September 17, 2014 Discuss here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W2BTD Posted September 17, 2014 Report Share Posted September 17, 2014 Had him 25th in a list I did in 2009/2010. Obviously if I did it again he'd be in the Top 20 somewhere by now, after putting together two of the greatest years ever, and taking part in the best series of matches since Misawa/Kobashi, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan4L Posted October 10, 2014 Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 Incredible "big match" wrestler. Almost never lets you down in a title match or in a big G1 match. He's had a silly amount of MOTYCs since 2007 just churning them out year after year. Only detraction for him (and honestly it's probably been a smart move on his behalf) is that in your regular run of the mill tour shows he generally just does his trademark stuff (especially in tags) and it's rarely anything worth seeing. The live crowd enjoy it though as he's so charismatic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W2BTD Posted October 10, 2014 Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 Maybe the best "big match" wrestler of all time. In the conversation at minimum. His match structure and ability to peak his matches at just the right time are elite level. A big Tanahashi match never runs long or feels like it never ends. When was the last time he had a big title match or main event or major G1 bout that wasn't great? The guy just delivers time after time, like a machine. I can't even think of the last bad big match he's had. He's probably never had one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted October 10, 2014 Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 Maybe the best "big match" wrestler of all time. In the conversation at minimum. His match structure and ability to peak his matches at just the right time are elite level. A big Tanahashi match never runs long or feels like it never ends. Holy fucksticks. Almost every Tanahashi main event feels too long to me, because usually everything between the opening gambit and the big finishing run is boring as hell and inconsequential, I start thinking about what to have for dinner, then I realise I'm getting distracted and think maybe I shouldn't bother with another 25 minutes of this shit if I can't even concentrate on it, and then oh hey! Finishing run! Pops! Woo! It's mostly the Okada matches I'm thinking of with this. I think there was only one of their matches that I didn't get bored with halfway through. It's not often I make this point, but every one of their matches would be improved by cutting out 10 minutes. Admittedly this is also a symptom of modern puro main events in general because I feel that way about a lot of modern puro main events, but just woah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dawho5 Posted October 11, 2014 Report Share Posted October 11, 2014 I think that's one of his biggest problems. He works within the style of main events that he does, which for me handcuffs him. His match structure and execution is great, but it always leads to useless elbow/slap exchanges and endless nearfalls instead of following what is usually a good to great first 15-20 minutes. If you like that kind of ending tacked onto whatever match came before it, then he's fine for you. I don't care for it, but Tanahashi is easily one of the more entertaining guys over the later half of the 2000s and into 2014 as far as the New Japan guys go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan4L Posted October 11, 2014 Report Share Posted October 11, 2014 I like the first 15-20 minutes of his big matches alot. Especially in the case of the Okada ones. They set the stage for what is an epic closing stretch. The way they carry themselves, the way they carry the match with the pacing, it's beautiful to watch and it's beautiful to watch how the fans react to it. They often throw in some great little extra things too - for instance in one of the big title matches last year (pretty sure it was the October one) Tanahashi had an awesome heelish knee injury fake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W2BTD Posted October 11, 2014 Report Share Posted October 11, 2014 I like the first 15-20 minutes of his big matches alot. Especially in the case of the Okada ones. They set the stage for what is an epic closing stretch. The way they carry themselves, the way they carry the match with the pacing, it's beautiful to watch and it's beautiful to watch how the fans react to it. They often throw in some great little extra things too - for instance in one of the big title matches last year (pretty sure it was the October one) Tanahashi had an awesome heelish knee injury fake. The thing that struck me about the Okada series, is how different each match was. You had the shocking Okada win in the first match, you had the match where Tanahashi worked over the arm trying to take away the Rainmaker (this was Invasion Attack if memory serves, which I went ***** on), the knee injury bluff Alan mentioned, the G1 30-minute draw, etc. Tanahashi demonstrated this ability again with the recent series of matches vs Nakamura, which again were all very distinct in structure & layout, even more so than the Okada matches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan4L Posted October 11, 2014 Report Share Posted October 11, 2014 His 2007 series with Nagata was another great one. I'd say their April title match that year is one of the top 5 IWGP title matches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingedEagle Posted October 11, 2014 Report Share Posted October 11, 2014 I like the first 15-20 minutes of his big matches alot. Especially in the case of the Okada ones. They set the stage for what is an epic closing stretch. The way they carry themselves, the way they carry the match with the pacing, it's beautiful to watch and it's beautiful to watch how the fans react to it. They often throw in some great little extra things too - for instance in one of the big title matches last year (pretty sure it was the October one) Tanahashi had an awesome heelish knee injury fake. The thing that struck me about the Okada series, is how different each match was. You had the shocking Okada win in the first match, you had the match where Tanahashi worked over the arm trying to take away the Rainmaker (this was Invasion Attack if memory serves, which I went ***** on), the knee injury bluff Alan mentioned, the G1 30-minute draw, etc. Tanahashi demonstrated this ability again with the recent series of matches vs Nakamura, which again were all very distinct in structure & layout, even more so than the Okada matches. You both hit then nail on the head here. I haven't found any of his main events unnecessarily long but rather consistently building to hot finishing stretches with different focuses, be they the arm the Okada arm or G1 draw matches, the arm vs leg limb war vs. Suzuki or the Nakamura series this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmare007 Posted October 11, 2014 Report Share Posted October 11, 2014 I agree with dawho, he's one of the most entertaining New Japan guys in the last decade. I'm not enamored with his work like Joe or Meltzer but I'm also not down on him like other people. I think he's a very good wrestler that can be great at times and almost always shows up for big matches. As far as current "Aces", I think Cena is better in almost every way. As far as current puro guys, I'll probably have Sekimoto ahead of him, but they are gonna be close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOTNW Posted October 12, 2014 Report Share Posted October 12, 2014 No chance. The Okada 2013 King Of Pro Wrestling match made me hate pro wrestling for a couple of weeks. I never find him great, I often find him good in a particular format (~15 min singles matches that aren't overly ambitious) but I've found him appaling in big matches far too many times, especially in 2011. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timbo Slice Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 I'm gonna have a tough time putting him on here even with me putting an emphasis on working in big matches. He's had as many as anyone on this list, but I don't think they have been nearly as good as a lot of others who worked main events, and even then, I haven't seen him as the best worker in a lot of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted October 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 Last year I ranked the top 50 workers in the world and Tanahashi didn't make that list. If he isn't make a top 50 list in a prime year, then he isn't make a top 100 of all-time list for me. He's solidly behind Nakamura for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohtani's jacket Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 The idea that Tanahashi wasn't in the top 50 workers in the world last year is a little hard to swallow. I mean I can understand him not being on someone's list of personal favourite wrestlers, but realistically speaking he would be in the top 50 workers in the world. It would be like leaving Manami Toyota or Shawn Michaels off a 1996 list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted October 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 The idea that Tanahashi wasn't in the top 50 workers in the world last year is a little hard to swallow. I mean I can understand him not being on someone's list of personal favourite wrestlers, but realistically speaking he would be in the top 50 workers in the world. It would be like leaving Manami Toyota or Shawn Michaels off a 1996 list. When the best match I saw from him (I watched all the pimped ones) was the Invasion Attack match at 4 and 1/4, then it makes sense. Also, he was like 97 on the WKO poll, so I'm not alone. To me, the matches just seem soulless. It's like they are done on a video game. Not to say he doesn't have some great matches though, but his overall style of match leaves a lot to be desired from me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillThompson Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 The idea that Tanahashi wasn't in the top 50 workers in the world last year is a little hard to swallow. I mean I can understand him not being on someone's list of personal favourite wrestlers, but realistically speaking he would be in the top 50 workers in the world. It would be like leaving Manami Toyota or Shawn Michaels off a 1996 list. I'd leave Michaels off a top 50 1996 list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exposer Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 Obviously, I'm going to have to watch at least a handful of Tanahashi matches for this project, but I'm not looking forward to it. I don't think he was awful last year, but I'm pretty sure he didn't make my top 100. I would have a hard time putting him on a list like this, but I'll at least give him a chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 I doubt I would list Tanahashi but at the same time, think it's completely reasonable for him to pop up in some top 10s and top 20s. If you like what he does, he's been doing it at a high level for a long time now. He's earned a grudging respect from me in recent years. When it's time for him to perform on a big show, the guy works his ass off and absolutely carries himself like a star. I might not love the modern NJ main event style, but a lot of people do, and he played a big part in defining it. He's not some mindless twit reeling off moves; he's a performer who has to be reckoned with if you want to understand the state of the art in 2014. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR Ackermann Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 I'm curious, Bill. Who would be in your 1996 top 50? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillThompson Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 In no particular order, and if I took a deeper look at the year there are probably wrestlers I would swap in/out plus more people I would rank ahead of Michaels, Bret Hart Owen Hart Jeff Jarrett Davey Boy Smith Mankind Psicosis Juventud Guerrera Jushin Liger Rey Misterio Jr. Damian 666 Ultimo Dragon Shinjiro Otani Aja Kong Kyoko Inoue Manami Toyota Meng Johnny B. Badd/Marc Mero Steve Austin Vader Brian Pillman Hakushi/Jinsei Shinzaki Goldust Savio Vega Mariko Yoshida Megumo Kudo Kenta Kobashi Takao Omori Gary Albright Stan Hansen Akira Taue Mitsuharu Misawa Toshiaki Kawada Jun Akiyama Yoshinari Ogawa Sting Steven Regal Patriot Too Cold Scorpio Mikey Whipwreck Genichiro Tenryu Chris Benoit Brian Christopher Wolfie D Jerry Lawler Tracey Smothers El Dandy Silver King Koji Kanemoto Shinya Hashimoto Eddie Guerrero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Cooke Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 Tanahashi and Styles had a good match this morning at the New Japan PPV from Sumo Hall from the bits and pieces I saw while doing a couple of other things. His horrible forearm strikes were absent, so that automatically helped the match a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR Ackermann Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 That sounds pretty reasonable for the most part, although I'm not that familiar with 96 as a whole. Do you really think Meng, Goldust and Ultimo are better that year? What I've seen of Goldust's first run was pretty poor and i can't believe that Michael's 'best year' is outshined by Ultimo who I've never seen as good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 I think the general point is that there's nothing wrong with ranking Shawn outside of a 1996 Top 50, Tanahashi outside of a 2013 Top 50, or anyone outside of an anything Top whatever, if you really feel that 50 other wrestlers are better and can back up your opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 My favorite 96 Michaels match is probably the Goldust ladder one, for what it's worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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