JerryvonKramer Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 Several of us on this site have written many match reviews. My own entries are in the 100s. In this thread, I'm interested in views on reviews.* I've been thinking about this recently after reading the introduction to Frank Kermode's The Uses of Error. We often write reviews without really thinking much about the process of writing them. On one memorable occassion, jdw reviewed one of my reviews (the match was Rey vs. Santito), and gave it one star. But this sort of thing is memorable precisely because it is so uncommon. Although there have been exceptions, the vast majority of my reviews follow the same format: Many times, I've thought about trying to do this: Here are some questions, obviously this is directed at people who actually read and / or write reviews: 1. When you read reviews, do you read the whole thing or just the final paragraph and the rating? 2. If I lost the middle section of mine, would you miss them at all? 3. What are you looking for in a review of a wrestling match? 4. Who's reviews do you like reading? Why? What do they do well? 5. When you are writing your own reviews, what are you looking to achieve? Hopefully this will get some meaningful conversation going. --------------------------- *Note I review matches in two different forms of course, on here and on podcasts. I generally prefer the latter form not only because I have someone to bounce off, but also because I usually host and so someone else does the heavy lifting (Chad on WTBBP, Pete on Titans, I just carry Steven on AJ Excite!) which allows me to come in with some observations at the end before we move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOTNW Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 Just speaking for myself, I don't like writing about play by play and it's my last resort "I can't think of anything else but want to write about how great this is so here" and even then I like to keep it to the point. In general I like talking about why I liked or disliked something by giving a clear sense of why I did without giving away too much as that's something I would dislike to find in reviews if I were reading them myself. As far as other people's reviews, in general I loathe anything long as most people's match analysis just aren't that interesting to me to spend so much time on reading them. I like a couple of good sentences that give me a strong idea of what someone's view of the match is. You can always go into more detail if someone disagrees. For the questions: 1. When you read reviews, do you read the whole thing or just the final paragraph and the rating? Depends on how much I care about a match. If they're Parv-style (which is what you're obviously asking about) mostly just the final paragraph and the rating unless it's a match I would really go bat far.2. If I lost the middle section of mine, would you miss them at all? No4. Who's reviews do you like reading? Why? What do they do well? Man all my favourite reviews are gone from the internet now. Daniel of puroresu.tv and DVDVR influenced my style the most. Wayback machine should have some of that stuff. I also love DEAN's reviews but for completely different reasons, as his personality makes a format I generally dislike not just bearable but super fun. I enjoy Segunda Caida reviews as well for similar reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotJayTabb Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I find play-by-play a bit tedious and it's something I try to avoid unless I really can't think of much to say about the match. I generally try to pick out the bits that are important to the match result and bits of the match I like/dislike. For example, if someone hits a nice highspot or does something logical that I want to comment on, I'll put it in there. Likewise if something looks really shit or something about the match annoys me. It's tricky sometimes though, and I do sometimes use too much play-by-play as a crutch to mask my limitations at analysis. I actually think your reviews are really easy to read JvK. You explain what's happening in the match, but with little bits of your own opinion in there to give it some flavour. I like guys who get over their own opinions in the review, and aren't afraid to be honest for fear of going against popular consensus. Dylan had a thread here where he reviewed full shows for a year that I really enjoyed, and I go to Segunda Caida every day. The recent NXT review, where they were laughing at "Giant" Colin Cassady for wrestling like a cruiserweight, was terrific and spot on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 To take all your questions and answer them as a whole, I have very little use for play by play in reviews. Pretty much the only reason I read reviews of a match is because I've watched a match, thought something about it, and am interested in what other people thought about it. I've already seen the match, 98% of the time, so I don't need to read someone recapping it. I skip PBP when reading. I think the only time I have any use for PBP is when I'm unsure about a date for a match and look up reviews to look for some detail that confirms to me that yes, this is the particular match I'm looking for. I'm interested in opinions, ratings and analysis on the match. Even PBP that is littered with "that was a really nice clothesline" instead of "he hit a clothesline" is still not particularly compelling to me. I haven't written reviews with any frequency in a long time. From memory, when I did it was mostly in a stream of consciousness, reacting-in-the-moment way. Basically long paragraphs of marking out (or exhibiting whatever emotion I had about the match). I think the only time I went into PBP was when I got truly excited and said something along the lines of "let me proceed to list every little awesome moment in this match". It's either that or delving into the story of a match really hyper-analytically, like I've done most recently when looking at Cena/Owens or Sasha/Bayley. Almost like reviewing a movie by focusing on the overarching theme and how they explore it, rather than a normal match review. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supremebve Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I've been thinking about this a lot lately. I've been writing more and more reviews lately, and I never really know how I'm going to go about it until I'm doing it. Sometimes I find myself doing play by play, which I don't really like, but sometimes that is all that comes to me. The thing that I really find difficult is how to write the review of the 6th match between the same people. In the next couple of weeks I'm going to start posting my reviews from 1990, which will feature roughly 10,000 All Japan 6-man tags. All of those matches are really good, but by the fifth or sixth match, there is absolutely nothing new to say about them. I've gradually changed my review style to trying to find the interesting things about the wrestlers and/or the match, but I think it will always be a work in progress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted February 2, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I've been thinking about this a lot lately. I've been writing more and more reviews lately, and I never really know how I'm going to go about it until I'm doing it. Sometimes I find myself doing play by play, which I don't really like, but sometimes that is all that comes to me. The thing that I really find difficult is how to write the review of the 6th match between the same people. In the next couple of weeks I'm going to start posting my reviews from 1990, which will feature roughly 10,000 All Japan 6-man tags. All of those matches are really good, but by the fifth or sixth match, there is absolutely nothing new to say about them. I've gradually changed my review style to trying to find the interesting things about the wrestlers and/or the match, but I think it will always be a work in progress. Another thing I wonder about is how do you review when you are the 5th or 6th person reviewing a match that other people have covered. One reason I do all of mine in Microscope threads as opposed to in the Yearbooks section is because I like my take to be my own and not just "yeah, what Loss said". This also happened with the 80s Projects a little bit. Not only is it the fact that by the time you are comment number 15, you are feeding on real scraps, but also, I was finding myself unduly influenced by previous posters which rankled with my sense of honesty. It makes a difference if you are watching a match 15 people have called great / shitty vs. going in blind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwin Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 1. When you read reviews, do you read the whole thing or just the final paragraph and the rating? If it's an opinion based review instead of a play-by-play review; I read the entire thing. If it includes play-by-play, I just look over that and just go for the final paragraph as it usually includes the persons opinion. If it's a match I've never seen before, I'll skip the play-by-play even faster as that could play spoiler. 2. If I lost the middle section of mine, would you miss them at all? If by middle section, you mean play-by-play, then honestly, no. Not trying to be a douche, but I value more your opinion than play-by-play. 3. What are you looking for in a review of a wrestling match? Their opinion namely on what they disliked/liked or thought worked/didn't work and why. Nothing more, nothing else. 4. Who's reviews do you like reading? Why? What do they do well? I enjoy reading anyone's reviews who like keeping it simple and straight forward. I don't have any preference honestly, but some people are to overly critical and negative I just avoid them entirely. One thing that irks me is fans who review stuff and if you don't agree with them will quickly cut you off and try and offend you simply because you disagree with their train of thought. 5. When you are writing your own reviews, what are you looking to achieve? To express my sentiment on it and bring across my train of thought. If it's something I feel is being overlooked, hopefully my thoughts on it can captivate others to at least give it some consideration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supremebve Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I started my own thread, because I actively try to avoid other reviews until I write my own. I generally go to those threads once I'm done to see what other people say about a particular match, but I don't want my opinion to be swayed beforehand. As time goes on, I've found myself trying to add personal anecdotes to my reviews so I don't know if it matters. I just don't know how much of my review would be my opinion and how much would be what I expect the match to be based on other's opinions if I read them first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted February 2, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I started my own thread, because I actively try to avoid other reviews until I write my own. I generally go to those threads once I'm done to see what other people say about a particular match, but I don't want my opinion to be swayed beforehand. As time goes on, I've found myself trying to add personal anecdotes to my reviews so I don't know if it matters. I just don't know how much of my review would be my opinion and how much would be what I expect the match to be based on other's opinions if I read them first. Yeah the same. It's actually one of my FAVOURITE things to do and one of many reasons to love this board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradhindsight Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I use a similar style and I think an important thing here is the "Description of the match" is not play-by-play; it's more high-level with anecdotes mixed in around the crucial parts that make up the meat of any match. For example "There's something not quite happening in this match" is something skipped if you fast foward to just the summary. This pretty much mirrors Parv but: Intro: match stips and background, incidental information about the crowd or aesthetic that frames the moment in time the match is taking place. Match description: overview of match sans move-for-move play-by-play with mixed in notes around psychology and other points of interest (funny stuff counts here too) Evaulation; Things I liked, followed by things I didn't like, and a recap of my thoughts and match rating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted February 2, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I use a similar style and I think an important thing here is the "Description of the match" is not play-by-play; it's more high-level with anecdotes mixed in around the crucial parts that make up the meat of any match. For example "There's something not quite happening in this match" is something skipped if you fast foward to just the summary. Yeah, this is one reason I've struggled to drop it before, because it's a process and I feel the JOURNEY doesn't come across if you cut straight to the conclusion. Here's what the first page of Learning to Love Dory would look like with the description cut entirely. Dory Funk Jr. vs. Horst Hoffman (12/15/75) I'll start with this because someone here told me it's Dory's least boring ever performance in a match and I'm intrigued. This is from All Japan. Horst Hoffman is someone I know nothing about. He has a good moustache and looks vaguely German. Can someone look German? I think so. Dory is sporting the mutton lamb-chop 70s sideburns, it's a good look for him. This was an interesting battle of attrition. I'm not sure if it's the "least boring" Dory's ever been because he was working in his 70s technical style and this wouldn't be a match to show to someone resistant to that style. His matches with Bruiser Brody and Jerry Lawler are brawls, and they show Dory more fired up and working with more brutality than he does here. However, this might be a match that might get someone more into this style of work because the struggle was pretty great at times and I got the impression that Hoffman was pushing and teasing Dory throughout. But this was more "simmering tension" than the outright hatred we see against Brody. One of the things that came out of this match for me was the smoothness of Dory's transitions and counters. It's almost exhibition stuff, but it worked here because everything counted. Neither man wanted to give an inch so the elaborate counters were necessary to gain the upper hand. My main criticism would be that Dory seemed like he wanted to hit more of his high spots but Hoffman didn't let that happen on several occasions, whereas Hoffman was allowed to hit several of his big bombs. I got the impression that Dory's failure to hit his bombs was a result of non-cooperation. This hurts the match overall because when Hoffman does hit his bombs, Dory very quickly goes into something else each time rather than selling them -- which somewhat diminishes their impact. At times it seemed more like a battle of who was prepared to give who what. Hoffman didn't seem to want to give Dory the bombs, but came out second best in the mat war; Dory was prepared to give Hoffman the bombs but not to sell them. All of which, for me, prevents this going much above the 4 stars. **** Dory Funk Jr. vs. Kevin Sullivan (08/09/87) [?] This was in Florida. From what I can tell, the only singles match between them was on the date I've provided in Orlando. Sullivan certainly looks like 87 Sullivan to me. Dory never changes, although his sideburns are gone. No commentary, arena footage. Fairly effective juice brawl, but it lacked real energy and the heat seemed to be on Humperdink rather than on Dory, who was "just there". Both men seemed to start bleeding out of nowhere and the spots leading to that didn't really seem violent enough to warrant the blood. The most over I've ever seen Humperdink though, but yeah he still sucks ass. **1/2 Dory Funk Jr. vs. Abdullah The Butcher (12/06/75) Let's go back to All Japan in 1975. This seems as good a match-up as any to test my theory that, contrary to his rep as the supreme technician, Dory was arguably more engaging working brawls. Fairly standard Abdullah brawl, that seemed to lack real intensity or heat. In fairness to Dory he was laying in his strikes and punches with venom, but this one struggled to get out of 3rd gear and boil over. *** Now, as a basis of comparison, I want to see what Terry Funk did against Abby a couple of years later ... Terry Funk vs. Abdullah the Butcher (12/01/78) This is from AJPW Classics #11 by the way, which I'm basically going to watch in its entirety because apart from this, it's all Dory matches. Some excellent promo music to start which reminds me of the boxers' theme music from Super Punchout!! for the SNES. I'm assuming the Japanese voice over is telling us "we're gonna be watching a lot of the Funk brothers in action on this tape". Oh yes, can't wait. Despite the incredible visual of Terry bleeding from the ear, I honestly thought the Dory match with Abby from 75 had more going on during it. This match seemed to grind to a halt as soon as the ear injury happened and came off more like an angle than a match, which it effectively is. I did enjoy Dory being all pissed off and protective as Terry's concerned older brother though. **1/2 Dory Funk Jr. vs. The Sheik (12/01/78) No time wasted, Dory takes his tracksuit off and is all business. He is ready for The Sheik whose hair has gone white, he looks like he was getting on -- he was, Sheik was born in 1924, Dory not until 1941. So at this point Dory was about 37, Sheik was about 54. And to think he had another 20 years in him! In fairness to him, apart from having white hair, Sheik's body didn't look too bad here -- better than old man Flair's body at a comparable age, for example. For such a short match, this was great. Again more like an angle than a match, but the storytelling and the way it built on the last match was truly great. Dory was as fired up as I've ever seen him too, a very good performance. Although Terry would have to be the MVP despite not officially being part of the match. ***1/2 Terry & Dory Funk Jr. vs. The Sheik & Abdullah the Butcher (2/3 falls match, 07/15/79) We are treated to footage from the locker room as The Funk brothers prepare themselves. They are wearing yellow tracksuit tops with red sleeves. Giant Baba is sitting in the background with *I think* a very young Tenryu, or it's Jumbo with his slightly curlier hair at this point. Dory has a patch on his head. They walk to the arena like a pair of bad asses. Come out to a loud pop. The commentator lapses into his "THE FUNKS ... spinning toehold-ah" business, which I can't get enough of. Sheik and Abby walk through the crowd to the ring with a procession following them. This has a really big match feel to it, crowd are clearly psyched too. I am as well, to be honest. Well this was fucking wild. Match for the ages, which I'd imagine is legendary in Japan, and rightly so. Real hatred and passion from The Funks who both give as good as it gets in terms of fire. Terry's stuff around the injury shows what a great sympathetic babyface he was in AJPW, but my focus is on Dory here and he showed tremendous fire here and ... stoicism. That's an unheralded quality, but Dory had it in spades here, especially in that third fall which he basically carried during about a 10-minute stretch when it was 2 on 1. I have to pause for a word on Abby and Sheik here too, say what you want about them, they knew how to work their gimmicks, and around their limitations. You'll seldom see VILLAINY on the scale that those two take it in this match. The first fall is a masterpiece in storytelling around the foreign object, but it's the way they build up the layers of evil as the match progresses. By the time they've injured Terry so he's effectively out of the match and have Dory isolated 2 on 1, they STILL go to the lengths of using the rope to choke him out while double-teaming him and using the object. It's a study in evil. This has everything: great performances, storytelling, blood, chaos, the crowd, and a bell that rings forever! ****3/4 Terry & Dory Funk Jr. vs. Giant Baba & Jumbo Tsuruta (11/30/79) Dory's stubble has become a beard by this point. Maybe they didn't stock the razor blades he likes in Japan. It's probably the best look for him. This was a great match with some terrific action worked at a fine pace. Perhaps a little bit too "your turn, my turn" in places, it was at its best when Dory and Terry were on top working a classic US-style heat/FIP sequence. They were superb tagging in and out and Dory was particularly excellent when controlling and hitting his bombs. I think it's fair to say that as a tagteam, they are at their best either when Terry is selling, or when Dory is on top. Great match by anyone's standards though. ****1/2 Terry Funk vs. Killer Tor Kamata (12/03/79) With Kamata being such a Titans of Wrestling legend, I couldn't NOT watch this now could I. NO CHANCE MR WHALEN. I can justify watching Terry matches in this thread because he's a perennial basis of comparison. Not bad at all and Kamata is a decent worker doing what he does, I'm sure if we had more of him on tape he'd have a bigger rep. This at least as good as the earlier Terry-Abby match without the bloody ear to carry it. **1/2 Dory Funk Jr. vs. Mr. Wrestling (12/03/79) I didn't know Tim Woods worked in Japan. It is him though, all in white. Dory has the beard still, it's a bit fuller now. Mr Wrestling looks like he's getting on in years. I don't like Mr. Wrestling's mask, it looks cheap. Oh dear oh dear. *1/2 Terry Funk and Dory Funk Jr vs. The Sheik and Abdullah the Butcher (15/12/77) Thanks to my man Kelly for recommending this one. I think he said that this was the match that made The Funks big babyfaces in Japan. This was fun, but not the absolute classic that the 79 match is. It's a bit short and is missing the extended heat segment for Abby and Sheik. I do like them though as kind of like the Dick Dastardly and Mutley of All Japan. ***1/2 Terry Funk and Dory Funk Jr vs. The Sheik and Abdullah the Butcher (9/19/78) Dory looking cooler than usual here with his beard. Terry is bobbing and weaving in antipaction for the match. Funks get a loud ovation from the crowd. It's Terry and Sheik to start but Sheik is going through his pre-match ritual. He wants to pray. Is there anything emptier or less sincere than The Sheik's prayer? Ha ha. This is about as wild, bloody, brutal and downright sadistic as any brawl I've seen and it reaches Magnum-Tully levels of primal rage and hatred. The sequence where Dory is beating on Sheik is breathtaking, and has to rank as one of Dory's all-time career performances. He came across as a man who'd been pushed beyond the point of reason and had just snapped and broken here, it's an incredible performance. INCREDIBLE. The beating that Sheik takes at the end goes beyond the point of justice and retribution, he's beaten so badly by Dory that you almost feel sympathy for him. But since his cheating and villainy before it is so outrageous, and since he's been doing that shit for so many years, it's like all his chickens came home to roost at once. He had it coming to him, but this was the ultimate "he had it coming to him". One of the best things I've ever seen in wrestling. I have to take a break, maybe have an ice cream and settle down, because I wasn't prepared for something as good as this tonight. Blown away, I put this in the same bracket as Magnum-Tully "I Quit", transcendant. ***** Dory Funk Jr vs. Steve Keirn (05/08/81) Dory was Floria Heavyweight Champ around this point. Incidentally in 81 he was also the first NWA International Champions in All Japan after they brought that belt back. This would have been between the AJPW tours. Dory spent most of 81 either in All Japan or Florida. Of course, Solie on commentary and he says Keirn is in the condition of his life. Shame the same can't be said of his hair! This is quite cool, don't get to see studio wrestling from Florida very often Too short really to get more, but Keirn looked good for the brief-running length and we get to see more Psycho Dory as he completely destroys three men. The attacks on the ref are so random that I found them really funny. This was interesting because it was Dory working as an out and out heel and presumably a top heel anchor for the promotion around this time; he worked differently. He bumped around a bit more, he gave more to Keirn, and was willing to show ass as he was booked to do. Very interesting to see the contrast between his work here, and how he was working in All Japan as a top babyface. **1/2 Dory Funk Jr vs. Mike Graham (08/13/81) Again, I don't have the date, but this looks like it was part of the same run and presumably the incident in the last match helped to set this up. Gordon Solie says that both men have agreed that this will be under "Australian British Empire rules": six, seven-minute rounds. Solie says that Dory as a former NWA champion he'll have vastly more experience in this sort of match-up than Graham. "Coach" John Heath agrees and says that he thinks Dory is probably the smartest man in wrestling. This is for the Florida title, of course. Winner of the most rounds wins. Dory gets some heel heat when he's introduced. With at least 1/2 a star added for the quality of the commentary helpling to make this an intriguing encounter, debating whether to go higher. I don't give out ****1/4 as a rating, but this is round around there. Listening to Heath and Solie during this match, added a completely different dimension to some of the matwork, and it really helped me appreciate the psychology of the counter wrestling some more, while teaching me the names of some holds in the meantime. HOWEVER, this was not worked in the dry technical manner that you'd expect. Dory was in heel mode, and seemed at times to be trying to turn it from a technical affair into a brawl. When Terry turned up, Dory was happy to break every rule in the book to regain the advantage, and in the contest of such a theoretically technical match as this, with people talking up his rep as a former NWA champ etc. etc., I thought that was some great dickery on his part. I thought this match showed a glimpse of what your typical Dory broadway might have been like back in the day if he was working in a dirtier heel mode, maybe against a local hero. Dory's highspots: the delayed double-under-hook suplex, the vertical suplex, the gutwrench suplex, the belly-to-back suplex and the piledriver are all very well executed. The psychology in this match was also great, with Dory trying first to outwrestle Graham but quickly getting frustrated and desperate and resorting to dirty tactics and cheap shortcuts. I'm surprised by how much I enjoyed this, because on paper it looks like it would be an absolute snooze-fest. **** Dory Funk Jr vs. Tully Blanchard (sometime in 1980?) This is from Southwest Championship Wrestling where Tully had several feuds with The Funks. I read over at Kayfabe Memories that in one angle around 81/82, Tully viciously attacked Terry with a clawhammer and Dory had a match with him to avenge it. However, I believe this match is from 1980 when Tully was still a face and the SWCW champion, Dory is the challenger. As for the match, I can't really give it a rating because we only got the last 12 minutes or so of a 30-minute match. I thought some of it looked a bit sloppy, but Tully looked good working that headlock and taking the bumps. Dory seemed to be working especially dirty, as a proper cheap heel. Dory Funk Jr vs. Dick Slater (1981?) I can date this to 81 or 82 because Slater is the SWCW champion and he had two different runs with the belt in those two years. The commentator is very Texan, I think it is Gene Kelly, and this whole place has a great and unique vibe. I wonder how much Southwest from this era is out there. This was a match where I thought Slater and Dory were working two different styles and not meshing well. Slater was bumping around and running around and working his ass off, Dory was in early 70s mode and not really prepared to work the sort of match Slater seemed to want, so you'd get awkward spots where Dory, for example, hit a mild atomic drop and then Slater basically bounced, on his own, to take a big bump to the outside -- almost Mr. Perfect style. I don't know if it's a knock on Slater or a knock on Dory, but something wasn't clicking here. Dory was also not really fired up enough in the angle with Tully at the end. Really feels like he was saving his A-game for All Japan and Florida and had turned up for a paycheck here. ** Dory Funk Jr and Terry Funk vs. Scott Casey and Relampico Leon (1981?) I'm guessing this was a few weeks before the last match and before the claw/hammer angle. The Funks are just superb as a tag-team: a well oiled machine, totally aware of each others' strengths and they know exactly what to do: when to work a heat segment, when to feed a comeback etc. But they were working with some pretty shitty opposition here who really drag this match down from being an enjoyable competitive squash to an embarrassment of sorts for the promotion that made it look like The Funks shouldn't really be there. At one point the commentator tried on the "main event in any arena in the world" line, and I don't think a single person in the world then or now would buy that. Leon, in particular, looked poor and Casey not much better. ** Dory Funk Jr vs. Carlos Rodriguez (1980?) This seems like it was earlier. Gene Kelly is not on commentary, it's a more sprightly chap who is joined by Jose Lothario who is here to provide expert analysis. Nothing match really. I don't think Dory is best-placed working squashes against young no-namers like this. Doesn't really play to his strengths. * Dory Funk Jr and Manny Fernandez vs. Tank Patton and Moon Mulligan (late 1981? / early 82?) Gene Kelly mentions early on that the clawhammer incident was a couple of months ago which puts this late on in 81 or very early in 82. Moon Mulligan is a bit like an early 80s Max Payne spliced with pure jobber. Dory has a wristlock on Tank Patton, but Moon intervenes. Kelly is a real character on commentary, a real good ol' boy. *1/2 Dory Funk Jr. vs. Bruiser Brody (2/27/88) This is from Puerto Rico. I like the match from All Japan from around 83, so this should be interesting. Brody has grey in his beard at this point. We're outside in some sort of stadium, there's a great "big sports" atmosphere and feel to this. Brody is hussing and the fan favourite. Dory is in a cowboy hat waiting in the ring. Weirdly, the commentator has said only one line in about four minutes. Well that was disappointing. Brody seemed exceptionally limited here. After a spirited start, the energy drained out of the match and the finish just sucked. **1/2 Mil Mascaras vs. Dory Funk Jr (1/30/79) This is from All Japan. Not positive on the date, but this is from 1979 and the numbers "30" and "1" can be glimpsed in the Japanese text, so I'm guessing that means 30th January. I love the Funks' All Japan music (Spinning Toehold. Mascaras comes out to Sky High. AJPW is just so cool during this period. Dory is sporting a beard. Mascaras takes off his mask to reveal another mask. This wasn't a very good match. It was worked super clean babyface vs babyface with clean breaks and handshakes. That isn't a problem in and of itself but the feeling out process never came to an end. It was parity all the way, with neither guy really giving the other guy much. Too much protection all around. ** Mil Mascaras and Dos Caras vs. Dory Funk Jr and Terry Funk (12/7/79) This is from the Real World Tag League of 1979, All Japan. Sky High hits but the crowd doesn't seem to care too much. They seem to pop bigger for the Funks. I wonder if that makes the Caras brothers de facto heels here? Doubt it. This was quite a long match, about 25 minutes. I don't know if Mascaras and Caras make the best foils for the Funks, it's a strange mixture of styles. Again this is worked very clean but much less stop-start than the singles match. The action really picks up in the last ten minutes when they start exchanging bombs, but I don't like all this even-stevens parity stuff. I prefer tag matches especially to have some control segments, and neither side was prepared to stay down for long in this one. Never the less, some great counter wrestling and big high spots. Good without being great. ***3/4 Dory Funk Jr and Terry Funk vs. Nick Bockwinkel and Jim Brunzell (12/9/80) This is from the Real World Tag League of 1980, All Japan. Bock has magnificent hair. The Funks come through the crowd. Terry has a wreath of flowers around his neck. Brunzell has a beard here and doesn't look like his regular self. This should be interesting. This has some really good moments without anything really standing out too much. It is smartly worked by Bock and Brunzell, who I guess were in the spot of "making up the numbers" during the tournament as AWA's representatives. They work de facto heel, and work a very solid gameplan cutting the ring in half, first with a headlock and later with the figure-four. Structurally, you can't fault it. This was left off the AJPW set, which suggests that the committee didn't like it. I can sort of see in the overall context of All Japan in the 1980s that a match like this wouldn't stand out, but it was better than quite a few matches that did make the set. More of a tactical war than an all-action match, but I thought it was quite compelling. I'd like to see Bock vs. Dory one on one (not Slamboree 93). ***3/4 Dory Funk Jr and Ken Patera vs. Ric Flair and Crusher Blackwell (7/4/82) This is from St. Louis, Larry Matysik and some other dude on commentary. Dory starts out in a leglock. Flair counters with a back suplex. Flair goes for the figurefour, reversed into an inside cradle. Tag to Blackwell, Dory tags in Patera. Stand off here and both men tag out again. Dory gets an arm wrench on Flair who flips over. Massive European uppercut by Dory. Awesome. And another one. Flair begs off. Flair replies with a chop, but Dory levels him with another uppercut. Knee to the stomach by Flair, goes for a suplex, but Dory slips back down to come back. Flair begs off again. Knee to the gut again, whips Dory into Blackwell who tags in. Massive running splash by Blackwell. Cover brings Patera running in. Crowd pop for this. There's clearly an angle going on between Patera and Blackwell around this time with Ken as the face (Dylan surely must know more). This match was worked very logically. They were building a Patera vs. Blackwell feud and Dory vs. Flair sort of served as a the side dish to that. So naturally this meant keeping Blackwell and Patera apart for most of the match. That means what we get for the longest portion is a Flair vs. Dory one on one, which features some neat counter wrestling. It's an interesting contrast of styles and you can see how Flair is intent on keeping this all-action. All in all, a very good 20-minute studio match. ***3/4 Terry and Dory Funk Jr. vs. Nick Bockwinkel and Blackjack Lanza (09/21/78) Back to All Japan in 78 for this one. Lanza has a terrific moustache, Bock as sexy as ever and shows off what I assume is the AWA belt when he's introduced. This is a fantastic match, which centred on Terry being a great FIP. But it built wonderfully to the highspots which were generally delivered by Dory. This is one of those matches where those who aren't watching closely would just think is "The Terry Funk" show, but that's selling Dory way short of what he brought here. The block forearm on Bock was thunderous. The butterfly suplex and piledriver really popped the crowd. My only slight criticism is that Bock and Lanza probably stooged too much here and the Funks were booked a little too strong for my tastes. That criticism is somewhat offset by the extended FIP sequence though, and this match is just another exhibit in the sizable catalogue of evidence for the Funks laying claim to the mantle of GOAT tag-team. They must be as strong candidates as anyone I can think of. ****1/2 Dory Funk Jr and Terry Funk vs. Ricky Steamboat and Jay Youngblood (12/2/82) I'd again have to wonder why the 80s AJPW committee would leave a match like this off the set when they found room for all that Jimmy Snuka crap. Not having a go, just a bit baffling to me that's all. On paper, this is something of a dreammatch, as the legendary Funks take on one of the hottest territorial tag acts in Steamboat and Youngblood. This was a good match, but not a great one. The Funks worked this from underneath, but I felt for long stretches Steamboat and Youngblood couldn't think of much interesting to do when they were on top. By the end they were hitting innovative-looking double team spots left, right and centre, but it might have been too little, too late. I also think that -- weirdly for Steamboat -- he didn't give the Funks enough when he was selling. He was reversing and countering everything, so you never get that sequence you'd hope for with the Funks hitting big offense on Steamboat. All-in-all, good, but slightly disappointing. ***1/2 Dory Funk Jr and Terry Funk vs. Rick Martel and Tom Zenk (11/29/86) Again, this is in All Japan, where the Can-Am Connection worked a tour. Matt D recommended this one. Terry has a moustache here which makes him look a bit like Jake Roberts. Wow, what a match this was, and one that should have definitely been on the All Japan set. Rick Martel was absolutely sensational here, and everything that Steamboat wasn't in the 82 match. So full of spunk and energy and fire here, and he made the PERFECT foil for The Funks who were having fun as heels. Dory was a dick just dumping Martel outside and refusing to fight a clean match. Terry was psyching him out with chicken-shit tactics and it was quite funny to see Martel chase him all over. Zenk did what was best for him and mainly played 4th wheel and took the pin. I really enjoyed this. The FIP sequence on Martel was great. Thanks Matt. **** Dory Funk Jr and Terry Funk vs. The Road Warriors (10/20/86) From that same run in All Japan in 86. Another dream match. Heel Terry with his moustache. Another match that I think would have been nice to see on the All Japan set. The Funks seem like they were really under-represented there. I wonder if anyone on the committee who is reading this could comment? Seems very strange with Will being such a big Terry fan and all. There was surely space to include a match like this in place of the 32nd iteration of some of those endless Tenryu and Hara tags from 1988. Just my feeling. Anyway, this is surely one of the best ever Road Warriors matches isn't it. They worked more like The Steiner Brothers than the typical Road Warriors style and the bombs were flying everywhere here. I don't recall Hawk doing so many suplex variations before. I thought this was a really good "big team vs. big team" match. Some snobbier fans might not like this sort of thing, but this was perfectly worked for what it was aiming for, and I loved the big bombs. I can't think of another Road Warriors match that I've liked as much as this one. **** Dory Funk Jr and Terry Funk vs. The Road Warriors (9/30/87) This is from Puerto Rico. Terry is in crazed mode jawing at fans and picking fights with people in the front row. Road Warriors have their Iron Madain theme. Chairs and rubbish are flying already. Road Warriors clear house to start. Announcer introduces them as "Terry and Hoss Funk". Nowhere near as good as the All Japan bout. Too short and seemed to lack heat. ** You get the concluding thoughts and the thoughts alone, but I can't help but feel that something is lost along the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew79 Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 Here are some questions, obviously this is directed at people who actually read and / or write reviews: 1. When you read reviews, do you read the whole thing or just the final paragraph and the rating? Depends on the writing and the match. 2. If I lost the middle section of mine, would you miss them at all? No. 3. What are you looking for in a review of a wrestling match? If the match is worth watching and why it's worth watching. 4. Whose reviews do you like reading? Why? What do they do well? Bill Thompson as he focuses on the story of the match. 5. When you are writing your own reviews, what are you looking to achieve? To record my thoughts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingedEagle Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 Here are some questions, obviously this is directed at people who actually read and / or write reviews: 1. When you read reviews, do you read the whole thing or just the final paragraph and the rating? 2. If I lost the middle section of mine, would you miss them at all? 3. What are you looking for in a review of a wrestling match? 4. Who's reviews do you like reading? Why? What do they do well? 5. When you are writing your own reviews, what are you looking to achieve? Hopefully this will get some meaningful conversation going. --------------------------- *Note I review matches in two different forms of course, on here and on podcasts. I generally prefer the latter form not only because I have someone to bounce off, but also because I usually host and so someone else does the heavy lifting (Chad on WTBBP, Pete on Titans, I just carry Steven on AJ Excite!) which allows me to come in with some observations at the end before we move on. 1) Read the entire thing unless the play by play (or some other part) becomes absurdly and unnecessarily long, at which point we start skimming. Doesn't happen with yours or others who's review I enjoy. 2) Yes. Sometimes a reminder of things I may have forgotten about a match, but always provides context for your concluding thoughts. 3) Brief context, what happened and any context for that, what you thought of the match, what did/didn't work and why. That's all! I like star ratings or some kind of statement that allows for a comparative evaluation. I appreciate putting it in perspective with other matches a reviewer has seen. 4) In no particular order yours, soup23, Sleeze, Loss, PeteF3, probably a few other standouts I'm forgetting off the top of my head. 5) Ideally, exactly what I said in #3 above. My problem is I'll often go watch more instead of stopping to review something. Hope that helps. Keep up the great work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodear Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I don't write a lot since I'm lazy (let us be honest) but I subscribe to 'Matt D. style' where play-by-play is relegated to a live notes portion of the review (usually under a spoiler tag) so you can see where certain strands of thought came from that are referred to in the main body of the review. I find that covering things from a long-range viewpoint is generally better than getting into minutia but you should be able to support your thoughts with specific information. I always like to include the finish to the review and I feel it serves as a good ending note especially if you are telling the story of the match from a narrative perspective. Looking at one of Parv's reviews I grabbed (because it was short) allow me to show where I would change things in bold. I'm not trying to pick on Parv in any regard here because this is obviously a 'quick hit' review where he is boiling things down for the sake of length although I would argue that fewer reviews with more information would be my preference. Mil Mascaras vs. Dory Funk Jr (1/30/79)This is from All Japan. Not positive on the date, but this is from 1979 and the numbers "30" and "1" can be glimpsed in the Japanese text, so I'm guessing that means 30th January. Dates don't mean nothing to me because my brain doesn't work that way. But I have to ask if the date is in any way significant? To me, dates only matter if there is some sort of context there. 'Dory would be a year into his reign or something..." I love the Funks' All Japan music (Spinning Toehold. Mascaras comes out to Sky High. AJPW is just so cool during this period. Dory is sporting a beard. Mascaras takes off his mask to reveal another mask. This is all very 'what' but doesn't answer the question of 'why'. Why does the the music work? Why do the beard or extra mask matter? This wasn't a very good match. It was worked super clean babyface vs babyface with clean breaks and handshakes. That isn't a problem in and of itself but the feeling out process never came to an end. It was parity all the way, with neither guy really giving the other guy much. Too much protection all around. Here is where I think you can add some meat to your review by using specific examples that build to your conclusion. Were there handshakes that stopped the match's momentum? Are there examples where one guy blew stuff off inappropriately? This is also where having a description of the finish would help the review as it helps tell your story of the match being too even. Was there a 30 minute draw? Did Mil take a count out? Matches are supposed to tell a story, reviews are you telling us what that story was. ** Star ratings work as a short hand. I have no issues here on a short review like this just tossing stars. For longer reviews, I think a summary would help here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I generally skim play by play. I want to know a few key things you liked or didn't like about the match, backed up by some description. If it's an exceptional match, I want to know if you think it ranks with the best of the year or best ever. And I want to know how your thoughts about the match play into your overall thoughts about the promotion or wrestlers involved. I generally like your reviews, Parv, because you're willing to disagree on sacred cows and you back up your thoughts.. Regarding the ones above, you could have trimmed a little play by play from the Kawada-Hase review, but it didn't drag too much. You connected each of your descriptions of the action to broader thoughts about the wrestlers, which is what I'm generally looking for. I liked the Funk reviews better in their original form. The edited versions above feel a little slight for a thread trying to expand our collective understanding of Dory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted February 2, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 Dates don't mean nothing to me because my brain doesn't work that way. But I have to ask if the date is in any way significant? To me, dates only matter if there is some sort of context there. The dates thing comes from 1) helping other people find these matches and 2) experience of writing lots of reviews and many podcasts in which sometimes the ONLY thing people will comment on is a mistake. Finding dates sometimes takes as long as watching the match. And even then I sometimes get the wrong one and someone (hey OJ! will almost immediately come in with a date correction ... I recall GOTNW recently said no sooner than I'd hit post "you could have at least got the date right" after one review ) -- so there's your answer This is all very 'what' but doesn't answer the question of 'why'. Why does the the music work? Why do the beard or extra mask matter? These little comments at the start of matches are usually there as a "human connection". Again, it's probably a legacy of doing podcasts, where I'll often mention stuff like that as a lead into to "well, Chad, what did you make of this one?" Which is to say that none of this stuff like the beard or the music matters much. But if the reviews were all serious biz all the time I probably wouldn't be able to get through writing them. Here is where I think you can add some meat to your review by using specific examples that build to your conclusion. Were there handshakes that stopped the match's momentum? Are there examples where one guy blew stuff off inappropriately? This is also where having a description of the finish would help the review as it helps tell your story of the match being too even. Was there a 30 minute draw? Did Mil take a count out? Matches are supposed to tell a story, reviews are you telling us what that story was. Star ratings work as a short hand. I have no issues here on a short review like this just tossing stars. For longer reviews, I think a summary would help here. Well, here's what was cut from the middle: Back suplex by Dory to start. Abdominal stretch. Headlock takeover. Mascars answers with some flash. Masaras starts focusing on the arm now. Dory answers by working on the leg. A bit stop-start so far. A few counter sequences follow. Eventually Dory hits his butterfly suplex for two. Mascaras answers with a flying crossbody and a suplex of his own. Two. Uppercut by Dory. Hip toss and a drop kick by Mascaras. Single-leg takeover and a grapevine by Dory. Goes for the spinning toehold but is kicked off. And again. Flying cross body from the top by Mascaras gets two. Dory keeps going for the toehold. Bell goes and we hit a time-limit draw. See, for me, the "specific examples" are all there. And this is what I mean by process. You can see I'm starting to edge towards the conclusion in one comment ("A bit stop-start so far."). And whoever reads that conclusion can then look up and see "well, oh yeah, the suplex was met by a suplex, the uppercut was met by a hip toss". This is no defensiveness on my part, I have considered cutting the middle portions out for some time, but I really want to think through why it's there in the first place and why I've struggled to get rid of it before now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeCampbell Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 1. When you read reviews, do you read the whole thing or just the final paragraph and the rating? It depends on the review. If it's just a recap of the match itself, then no, I don't read the whole thing. 2. If I lost the middle section of mine, would you miss them at all? N/A for me, I don't think I've ever read of of your reviews, Jerry. 3. What are you looking for in a review of a wrestling match? Analysis and discussion of the match. No offense to anyone here, I'm not trying to be a dick, but anyone just can rattle off the list of the spots of a match, and then throw on some snowflakes and call it a day. 4. Who's reviews do you like reading? Why? What do they do well? I'm in the same boat as GOTNW, in that most of the people I liked have moved on from this sort of thing. My old friend JD Dunn, and Dean Rasmussen both come to mind. All I really read nowadays is the stuff in the match discussion folder here. 5. When you are writing your own reviews, what are you looking to achieve? The same thing that I hope to find in reading reviews from other people. Analysis and discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 The same way I don't read movie reviews or album reviews for movies or albums I haven't watched or heard, I don't read wrestling reviews of matches I haven't watched for the most part. If it's a match I haven't seen, I'm likely to go right to the star rating (anything ***+ is worth my time) and maybe the last few sentences that should in my mind summarize the overall thoughts. I'll go back and read the whole thing after I've watched the match. There's nothing more impractical to me than skimming a long match review and not understanding clearly if the reviewer is telling me I should see it or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I also never take notes at all, but I also never took notes in classes or meetings at work. I just pay attention. It's extremely rare I write anything down during the experience itself because I think it distracts from my overall engagement. There were some exceptions during the yearbook project just because of the volume of stuff I was watching, which probably explains the occasional wacky match rating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I started my blog and at first I was doing play by play, but I don't think that is what people want. I know just try to explain why something is good or bad. I know when I read reviews I skip the play by play parts and just read the analysis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted February 2, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 See, I was always taught to provide textual evidence for claims, and I feel that "analysis" by its very nature is not just pure opinion, but rather a kind of partial description. I've marked enough papers where I've given "this was description not analysis, we already know the plot of the play, you don't need to tell us again" in the feedback, but now I think about it criticism requires some degree of description to actually function. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ButchReedMark Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 My tastes are simple in a review. "Did I enjoy reading it?". I'm not fussed how people get there style wise as long as they entertain me. There's no hard and fast rules to writing a review. Or at least I'd hope there isn't - write it however you please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 Here is a review I did last week, that I was pretty proud of. Tried to avoid play by play and just explain why this match is good. https://prowrestlingsuperblog.wordpress.com/2016/01/28/aj-styles-vs-cm-punk-iwa-ms-8th-anniversary-show-10232004/ AJ Styles vs CM Punk (IWA-MS 8th Anniversary Show, 10/23/2004) Let’s get this out of the way first, this match is really great. It’s a great mix of old school and new school to create a modern classic. The Old School This match starts with a collar and elbow lock up and moves into matwork. The first 1/3 of the match is spent with Punk attacking AJ’s arm with submissions. AJ gets some counters and it’s a well laid out slow build to set up the rest of the match. There is a lot of neat old school things while working the arm, like AJ whipping Punk into the corner while Punk holds on and viciously drags AJ to the mat. Later on CM Punk misses a move and his neck is hurt. This means that each wrestler has a focus for their offence and an easy way to get counters. Through out the match both men go back to the other’s injury to survive the contest. By the way, AJ Styles has an amazing dropkick. It’s Jim Brunzell level. The New School How does Punk injure his neck? A missed tope. Of course a lot of the offense is not old school. Instead of lariats by AJ, we get discuss lariats. There is a plancha, a tope, plus all of CM Punk and AJ Style’s trademark offense. There is no true heel or face in this match either and the crowd is split. A Modern Classic The first comeback by AJ is such a great sequence after numerous awesome hope spots. It starts with AJ being able to toss Punk to the floor. He goes for a plancha, but Punk moves. Punk goes for a tope, where he moves which injures his neck. One of my favourite moments of the match is AJ going for his Asai Moonsault into a Reverse DDT that is countered by Punk grabbing the injured arm. Punk then tries a suplex, but he can’t do it with his injured neck. We move on for some great nearfalls, before AJ is able to hit that Asai Moonsault into a Reverse DDT, but it was on the floor. That looked amazing. It lead to a very dramatic 19 count where Punk got into the ring at the last second. The finishing sequence is really hot. AJ goes for the Styles Clash, but Punk gets into the corner. Since that didn’t work, AJ goes for a superplex. Punk tries to counter with a Pepsi Plunge, but the injured neck allows AJ to fight out. A Tornado DDT is thrown off and AJ hits two discus lariats for a huge nearfall. A Shining Wizard by Punk gets two, then Punk’s Anaconda Vice gets a dramatic tap out submission. AJ’s arm was too injured to survive. Rating: **** 1/2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrainfollower Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 Read my Trish microscope thread for how I write reviews. I've never put that much though into a writing style for that to be honest, It's just a wrestling review. I usually don't do PBP unless it's a match I doubt most of those I am writing for have studied or looked at beyond a cursory glance. Anyone doing PBP for the 3 match Flair-Steamboat on here at this point, I don't see the need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeCampbell Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 See, I was always taught to provide textual evidence for claims, and I feel that "analysis" by its very nature is not just pure opinion, but rather a kind of partial description. You're exactly right with that statement. But, there's a big difference between saying "Brock Lesnar did this, that, and the other thing, and then he gave Big Show the F-5. It was a great match." And saying "Brock did this to Big Show, and it worked for this reason, but, that and the other thing didn't work for this reason, so it was a shitty match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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