[1991-Monterrey] La Fiera vs Jerry Estrada (Chain)

[Loss]

Talk about it here.

[Loss]

Interesting match to start things off. All of the elements were there for a great brawl, but it seemed to be missing something. I couldn't really tell if they were putting over the chain or if they were really just that awkward using it. But there were lots of long pauses with nothing happening where they were trying to untangle the chain from something, or take it with them wherever they were going, that knocked this down a peg. I think they realized this, because they worked the final 10 minutes in the ring and the match got much better. There's too much to love here to not call this a good match, but the first few minutes were kind of a mess. It's really cool to see a chain match in Mexico, and in a perfect world, this would have been the catalyst for it to become a staple of lucha libre, with the gimmick being improved over time. The double KO finish was fantastic.

[goodhelmet]

This is how crazy thoughts on one match can differ. Phil Schneider and I watched this match when we first got the Monterrey discs and both of us thought this was a MOTD contender until the bad finish. Loss didn't think so and loved the finish. Fucking wrestling.

[Phil Schneider]

Yeah how could you like that terrible finish?

[Dylan Waco]

Don't want to pile on to Loss, but that finish came across like one of the cartels had gotten to the ref pre-match and wanted him to work the finish or his children would be killed. Might not have been so bad with a legit count, but the speed of the count made it the "you've got to be fucking kidding me" inverse of Hogan v. Sting.

[Gregor]

I'm with Loss, and in fact I loved the finish just for obviously bogus it was. The ring area was a war zone, the two men were flinging each other around like maniacs, and the referee had already taken a shot to the face; he saw both guys down and realized that it was his chance to put a stop to this and get the hell out of there.

[Loss]

I just rewatched this after giving myself a little space from the 1990 Yearbook. It was much better this time. Great match, and I agree with Will and Phil about the finish being so abrupt, and cutting short whatever momentum they were building. It wasn't so much the fast count nature of it, it was that it seemed to happen in the middle of an arc they were building to the "real" finish. This was gritty and messy, taking place in a torn up ring, with both guys swinging the chain like they are Gogo Yubari. Really awesome brawl, and probably the best start we've had yet for a yearbook.

[shoe]

Man alive is that ring just nasty. I might have gotten a staph infection just watching this match. What a fucking brawl. The opening moments with the chain were like you're expecting someone to get maimed. The guys really lay in the shots, they rip the ring apart even more. I loved the spot where both wrestlers get tangled in the chain and both of them went into the chairs. I loved the visuals of them brawling on the floor and mothers are scooping up their children prepared to protect them. That finish was just throw up in my mouth bad. Still just a great bloody brawl.

[Childs]

The ring was actually one of my favorite parts of this when I first watched it with Phil -- just disgusting and the perfect setting for a gritty brawl. My reaction to the match was standard -- terrific fight with a cartoonishly bad finish. But I didn't like it quite as much on second viewing, probably because I was comparing it to the great wager matches from the end of 1990.

[soup23]

MOTYC to start us off the bat. One of the grittest brawls I have ever seen with some nasty headbutts, mat ripping, and a great dive spot using the chain. The finish is real abrupt but was not a bad idea in concept. Great start to the set.

[PeteF3]

Well, I thought this was ultimately underwhelming. The setting is probably the grittiest in the history of wrestling between the torn-up ring, chains, lighting, and blood. And there were some great spots here--the dive, both guys tumbling over the top rope to the floor, and I-forget-who getting slung into the seats. But there was a lot of dead time and it took a long while to get going. I also thought a lot of the strikes were bad--and that was doubly disappointing because I know Fiera knows how to pound the shit out of somebody and Estrada seems like a guy willing to oblige him. Then the sheer WTF-ness of the ending...I'm not opposed to a double-KO but the referee suddenly deciding to officiate this like an Olympic match (topical!) with a 1-count finish was too fucking much.

[soup23]

We may have found the most divisive match of 1991 int he first one. I do add a lot to the fact that the setting was so grimey that I had to stop eating my lunch and lost my appetite while watching.

[Kevin Ridge]

The ring mat is all torn up. They take a few minutes before referee can chain them each at the wrist. Doesn’t seem to be one of those touch all four corners matches as they aren’t going for them. Big spill to the floor on a suplex attempt. Did not get the finish as both guys go down on the mat and the referee counts both of them at three. That's not a proper KO spot if only a count of three. Ref rules it a draw. I agree with the gritty type match comments and the poor finish.

[soup23]

Im pulling a Loss and rewatching the start of the set now that I am done with AWA.

 

This one remained great. The opening takes a while to get going but once they do, the spots with the chain and into the crowd were crazy and hectic. I do think I give the finish more of a pass than some others as the main thing I am most bothered by is the fastness of the count by the ref.

[Zenjo]

What a way to kick off the set. A brutish, nasty, dirty, vicious dog fight. The ring was filthy and the mat was torn to shreds. The setting was perfect. No turnbuckle touching, the chain was there for pain. It's a shame there weren't more close ups as they were bleeding hardway from the chain shots to the torso as well as the head. Both combatants fought dirty in a savage brawl.

 

I for one absolutely loved the unique finish. The referee quickly counted both men down because he couldn't bear to see any more of the brutality they were inflicting on each other. Things had gotten so wild and out of hand that the ref felt he had to save them from further punishment.

[spooner]

The ring looks like an old cardboard box, and the gritty arena gives the match a grind house feel. Sadly the match felt flat to me. Sure, there were some nice spots, but overall the wrestling was poor. Tons of stalling at the beginning, and the hilarious finish was ridiculous. Perhaps a match that needs a second viewing.

[garretta]

I think that the ring was in a lot worse shape than it looked, which is saying a mouthful, and neither one of these guys wanted to be in it more than they had to be. That explains why most of the match took place on the floor. That's also why there weren't a lot of hard bumps when the match made it to the ring. I don't know about the screwy finish. I highly doubt that it had anything to do with how horrific the match was (not very, compared to what it could have been). I think the ref simply didn't want to be in that ring any more than the wrestlers did and took the first opportunity to count shoulders down that he could just to end the match before the whole thing either collapsed or was torn to pieces. That might also explain why the wrestlers took so long to get hooked up; they might have been trying to figure out what they could do out on the floor where it was safer.

 

I'm not rating this match at all, even unofficially. It was a mistake to have it in such unsafe conditions. Let these guys hook it up in a proper ring and then we'll see what they can do.

[DR Ackermann]

Just to be sure, Fiera is the one with the bandana, correct?

[drew wardlaw]

I don't know if they put the ripped up mat on just for this match or what, but it really added something for me. Really raw feeling. Honestly, this one was kind of boring until the chair dive spot, but the kind of dark spectacle with great visuals throughoutt. I really liked the finish. I liked the rushed confusing feeling of it, coming too soon when it seemed like something was being built too. Added to the match for me.

[JKWebb]

Yeah, this was extremely brutal. I'm with Chad on the finish - the odd part is the fast count. Some of the striking wasn't so great, but a lot of it was. The chain choking was ferocious. I loved the headbutt to the ref on the outside. This is a hard match to grade, but I'll say it's definitely memorable.

 

#439 - placetobenation.com/countdown-top-500-matches-of-the-90s-450-401/

[JKWebb]

I came back to this one today since I'm working my way through 1991. I think I enjoyed it more this time around, I feel like my comment on "some of the striking wasn't great" was unfair. It's really just a few of the early strikes in the match, because everything else is really brutal. I can't remember which guy now, but I love the spot where one of them is trying to get back in the ring, and the other is on the outside pulling on the chain. He eventually grabs some chairs and starts going to town on him. I said it was hard to grade before, but this is a great match with an abrupt finish.

[dawho5]

Great brawl, but I will second (15th?) the awful finish. Can't blame them for wanting to not be in the ring any longer than they had to be though. That suplex spot gone wrong to the apron looked particularly nasty. Impressive dive with the chain involved as well. Strong start to 1991.

[Microstatistics]

Overrated and loses a bit of steam near the end but still really good for the chaos, creativity, nastiness and violence. Fits the setting perfectly. ***3/4

[cactus]

Yeah, this one didn't do much for me. Aside from the no contest finish, I can't remember what else happened during this match. They had decent punches at least. The juice, the chains and utterly grim ring gave this a gritty aesthetic, but this was all sizzle, no steak. 

★★

[Clayton Jones]

What a hate-filled brutal brawl. From the beginning these guys go at each other with a familiarity of utter contempt. I'm not surprised opinions are so all over the place as it's a unique one to say the least, but man is this up my alley. Going from 80s Fiera to this was an abrupt shock but that may also be because the setting and footage of this match feels like it travelled through time and space. The one thing I'll disagree with is the downtime some criticized, I thought every moment of this was riveting and worked with an intent to end their opponent. The finish was fitting in the sense that after simmering right at the edge of a boil the entire time, the second the chain comes off these two are like bulls charging each other and immediately double KO. I also like the take that it was a mercy kill from the ref. The execution was head scratching but somehow just adds to the snuff film quality of my new favorite match. A trillion stars.