Ridiculous quotes from WO.com columnists

[Jingus]

The only fights this creates that you want to see are Cena vs. other Nexus guys, specifically a rematch with Barrett. That would seem to be the logical conclusion to all of this, but what's happening in the mean time that we should care about? This isn't Sting in the rafters. Cena is going to be called upon to do something between now and whenever he gets out of Nexus. What match does Cena have as an unwilling member of Nexus that we want to see? And how do you do it without making him look like a wimp or a heel? "Hero is brought low" isn't the problem. It's to what end.

I can think of a couple of possibilities. The easiest one would just be to have Nexus get in a beef with another heel, someone who the audience really despises and would never cheer. Cena volunteers to go after that guy, giving him a little mini-feud which could easily kill time for a month or so. Then Nexus keeps interfering and giving Cena unwanted help in his matches, which rekindles the conflict between him and them, which brings us back to the main storyline.

[Loss]

I don't think they would have had Cena win the match unless they had plans on turning him heel. I also think that this will in the end somehow result in Michael Cole, the real mystery GM, managing a heel John Cena, which will be out of this world if they ever do a Cena/Danielson program, or even a one-time angle on Raw.

[tomk]

I think the problem is less ham actors( well yes Michaels is a particularly hammy actor who provides specific problems) than the type of acting/oratory that wrestling traditionally has been based on.

 

The point I used to make about the problem with sitcom writers in wrestling was that they write for post microphone/post recorded sound/post radio/post television world of small vocal gestures. While wrestling oratory was the last place where people still worked in model of William Jennings Bryan and not intimacy of FDR fireside chats, Al Jolson and not Bing Crosby. There are guys who use intimacy with audience in their oratory, but it is a tool in larger Jolson style big showman performance. You can write great stories for Al Jolson or William Jennings Bryan or Bert Lahr,etc.. But I don't want to hear chet Baker attempt to sing Jolson or opera and I don't expect Bryan to be able to deliver a fireside chat.

[MikeCampbell]

I'm all for Cena being a full blown heel, but I'm with SLL as far as what to really do with him. The only babyface on RAW currently seen as his level is Orton, and Orton/Cena is far from a fresh program, even with roles reversed.

 

Any word on how long until HHH is due back. I could seriously dig an angle where HHH makes his big return, like in 2002, only for Nexus to spoil it and attack him with Cena being forced to join in. Then leading to a PPV with HHH vs. Barrett, with Cena's freedom from Nexus at stake, only for Cena to help Barrett win to go complete heel.

[sek69]

I hope Cena goes full heel soon, because if he just ends up free of Nexus it's just teaching the fans to not get into anything potentially interesting because things will just go back to how they were before in a couple of weeks.

 

Also it would be hilarious seeing people do a 180 re: their opinion of Cena once he isn't forced to do those stupid forced-funny babyface promos.

[Johnny Sorrow]

Cena didn't look like a wimp for Christ's sake. They completely played up the "He's a man of his word" deal as soon as the GM reminded him that the contract said he had to do Barrett's bidding. It's a mixture of Cena "having to keep wrestling cause it's all he has" and "keeping his word, even though he was cheated."

If he got fired and showed up causing chaos until he made Wade piss himself with a fake gun, he'd be Austin. He's not Austin.

 

And what the fuck does "wimp here as definied by mother nature" even mean?

[Guest Slickster]

If anything, they made Cena look like a stronger babyface for sticking to his word despite being forced to work for his sworn enemies.

[S.L.L.]

On one hand....

 

If anything, they made Cena look like a stronger babyface for sticking to his word despite being forced to work for his sworn enemies.

This. I love me some Eric Embry, but boy, did I ever hate him losing the loser leaves town match to Gary Young, lashing out at everyone around him, and expecting me to side with the sore loser as he and Percy Pringle bullied Frank Dusek into reinstating him.

 

Johnny is right. Cena isn't Austin. Austin was Clint Eastwood. Cena is Roy Rogers. You don't book Rogers to start acting like The Man with No Name out of nowhere.

 

On the other hand....

 

I hope Cena goes full heel soon, because if he just ends up free of Nexus it's just teaching the fans to not get into anything potentially interesting because things will just go back to how they were before in a couple of weeks.

If having Cena under his thumb helps further establish Barrett as a main event heel, I guess that counts for something, but there were probably better ways to do it. If you have Barrett take the title from Orton, only for Cena to escape from Nexus and challenge him, I think that would make a meaningful difference, but there still would have been better ways to get there, and I don't even know if that's really a good idea in the first place.

 

If they turn Cena heel, it creates a whole new set of problems, the first of which is that I don't see how this angle logically transitions to a Cena heel turn. OK, so he's forced to do the bidding of heels now. Is he going to develop Stockholm syndrome? Do they do a double turn with an entire stable? How does this set up a heel turn? And if he does turn, what happens next? Is his drawing power fading that much that they are willing to gamble on the precisely zero other draws they have on the RAW roster to carry the brand? The Orton thing isn't exactly working as planned. Is HHH really going to do better in that role? Are we ready to push Daniel Bryan to the moon? Have you had a look at the RAW roster page at WWE.com lately? It's kinda heel heavy. You turn Cena, the biggest drawing face on their active roster might be Jerry Lawler. And while I'm all for building up new drawing cards, you might want to get that done before you toss the one you have.

 

This isn't about who is and isn't a wimp. This is about WWE Creative writing themselves into a corner that they are not talented enough to get out of.

[KrisZ]

They could get him over as a heel when the longer he doesn't hit Wade the fans really start to boo him because they want him to do it and he can't so they lose faith in him. Cena then somehow is able to leave NEXUS but he cuts this big promo on the fans for losing their faith in him and he doesn't need them anymore.

[S.L.L.]

I think pulling that off requires nuance far beyond what WWE Creative is capable of. Cena has to give a performance that suggests he's likely becoming complacent/pussing out, but is actually ambiguous enough that when it's later revealed he wasn't doing those things, it's believable. That's a pretty complex acting task for a wrestler. If you can trick the fans into thinking he's turning heel, then show he was face all along when he breaks from Nexus, but then have him turn heel because the fans had thought he had turned heel before....honestly, just writing that makes me think it's too complex for it's own good. Maybe if you bring back Darren Young in whiteface as "Nexus Cena" to trick people into thinking Cena's becoming more of a heel...nah.

[Loss]

It also seems to me if that they are going to turn Cena, Rey or Undertaker need to be involved in this angle, since they are the only other babyfaces over enough to turn him. Undertaker coming back for revenge on Nexus for their attack a little while back, where he has cleared the ring except for Cena and the two just sort of face off before Taker turns his back and Cena attacks him, seems plausible, and also sets up a nice WM match.

 

You also have to admit that Cena in a program with Rey would be bonkers.

[KrisZ]

Heel Cena ending the streak at WM would be glorious

[Coffey]

It's a crazy world we live in now as wrestling fans. When I was growing up, the last thing on my mind was Hulk Hogan or The Ultimate Warrior turning into bad guys or Rick Rude or Honky Tonk Man turning into good guys. Nowadays, it's just expected it seems. I don't see a problem with Cena just staying a babyface. Although the talks of him turning heel have been going on ever since he was stabbed by Carlito's Jesus on Smackdown!

[artDDP]

Heel Cena drops the strap to babyface Triple-H at WrestleMania. That's still where I think this is going.

 

And, thanks S.L.L., for the new signature quote!

[Guest Slickster]

I think pulling that off requires nuance far beyond what WWE Creative is capable of. Cena has to give a performance that suggests he's likely becoming complacent/pussing out, but is actually ambiguous enough that when it's later revealed he wasn't doing those things, it's believable. That's a pretty complex acting task for a wrestler. If you can trick the fans into thinking he's turning heel, then show he was face all along when he breaks from Nexus, but then have him turn heel because the fans had thought he had turned heel before....honestly, just writing that makes me think it's too complex for it's own good. Maybe if you bring back Darren Young in whiteface as "Nexus Cena" to trick people into thinking Cena's becoming more of a heel...nah.

Honestly, I think WWE's writing staff circa 2000 could have made this work, but I'm not sure about today's team.

 

I'm hoping that Dave and Bryan are wrong and that Cena helps Barrett win the WWE Championship. I think the idea that Cena was forced to help give the WWE Championship - the most important thing in the world to him - to his sworn enemies is a great concept that can generate massive amounts of sympathy for him.

 

Picture Wade Barrett celebrating in midring sitting on Otunga and Cena's shoulders holding up the WWE Championship. Everyone in the ring is jubilant - except for John Cena, who is staring at the WWE Championship over Wade's shoulder.

[sek69]

Maybe if you bring back Darren Young in whiteface as "Nexus Cena" to trick people into thinking Cena's becoming more of a heel...nah.

 

I think it would be great if they did a Bourne Again style gimmick with him and had Young going around wearing jorts and like 12 armbands on each arm thinking he's really Cena.

[rovert]

I thought Foley rehabbed himself a lot in his interview with Dave and Bryan.

[Jingus]

I thought Foley rehabbed himself a lot in his interview with Dave and Bryan.

How so? Anyone willing to provide a piratical download?

[Johnny Sorrow]

I enjoy listening to Alverez and Verhei gush on about how great the 80's stuff they watch on WWE Classics, but it brings up a strange difference between Sports Journalists and Wrestling Journalists. It always baffles me when they start praising the wrestling they've never seen before. Wouldn't it be part and parcel of being someone who writes about a subject to know about the history of all of it from before you started watching it?

 

Minor quibble, but whatever.

[Log]

I'd be willing to bet there are a lot of sports journalists who would praise say, Roberto Clemente, without having seen him play at all. Same with any number of "classic" players. They'd be basing it on reputation and what they've heard/read from others. I'm not necessarily saying that's right. I just would venture to say it happens a lot.

[goodhelmet]

That's true, I praise guys like Bill Russell who retired 5 years before I was born or John Havlicek who retired 2 years after I was born. Now, someone like John could probably praise Jerry West or Elgin Baylor without much trouble

[KrisZ]

You can praise guys by doing research on them for sure either by reading or watching tapes.

[jdw]

This depends on who and/or how Bryan and Vinny are tossing around the praise for.

 

If this is a baseball analogy, a reporter who was born in 1975 and started covering the sport in 1995 (similar to Bryan), we would expect that reporter to know about guys like Mike Schmidt, Rickey Henderson, Fernando, Doc Gooden, etc from the 80s: Big Stars. If the reporter was a little late in getting into baseball, and hooked up in say 1988 when he was 13, he may not have watched a lot of Schmidt (whose last strong season was 1987). But the name is one a baseball fan of that age range would know, and a baseball reporter of that age range would know since he was going into the HOF right around the time he started covering the business. Ricky would have still be active in the late 90s, similar to Savage and Hogan.

 

We'd expect a baseball reporter to know things like that, and probably some basic info about them. Schmidt hit 500 HR, won a bunch of GG, was a Philly, and was thought of as one of the greatest 3B's of all-time (frankly The Best). But details? Probably not unless he was a total baseball history junky.

 

We also wouldn't expect the reporter to know a lot about say Steve Sax. That's not even a jobber being tossed out there: few all-star games, starting 2B on a world championship team, major market, etc. But he wasn't a Big Star, so if you weren't a baseball junkie as a young kid, you wouldn't know a lot about him. Sax also vannished for the most part once his career was done, so there isn't much foot print.

 

Can't expect Bryan to be terribly different. I don't think he's ever claimed to be a historian, nor that that Fig 4 is aimed in anyway at historically minded readers. It's more than any of the three newsletters aimed at the "present".

 

It's kind of cool that he's enjoying old stuff on 24/7.

 

John

[jdw]

That's true, I praise guys like Bill Russell who retired 5 years before I was born or John Havlicek who retired 2 years after I was born. Now, someone like John could probably praise Jerry West or Elgin Baylor without much trouble

Saw very little West, and don't recall Baylor at all. More than willing to praise them based on what I've read. Then again, none of us saw Babe Ruth or Ted Williams hit, but we know they were good.

 

John

[Wahoos Leg]

I can see both sides of this argument.

 

I'm a sports journalist, and my frame of reference is pretty much restricted to the mid 1980s onward. For the stuff before that, got to rely on highlights and statistics and make the best comparisons you can.

 

I think comparing guys from different eras in sports is a bit silly given the jumps in physical conditioning and medical ability to repair sports injuries so I try to stick to "best I've seen" when it comes to doling out the hyperbole.