Comments that don't warrant a thread 2010-2011

[Loss]

While I'm here. What exactly did people hate about the NWA TBS show in 87? Watching it on 24/7 and the last month of shows have been great.

People hated the 30 second squash + 90 second promo format of the Saturday night show.

 

At least that's always been the talking point from Dave, that ratings dropped considerably when Dusty started that format.

 

I'm curious if we look back how many shows actually follow that format. I'm sure it's there, but it may not be as like clockwork as it was made out to be at the time.

[tomk]

-One of the points I made again and again when I was reviewing TNA, was that booking Nash (wether someone else booked him, or he booked himself) as tough and intimidating was always a mistake. When Nash is booked as tough and intimidating he comes off as clumsy and fragile. There are lots of ways to book Nash strong and to play to his strengths. But if you’ve seen him live, Nash may be the least tough or intimidating guys of his height. Shawn Kemp is more menacing. If he thinks that the period when he drew was a period where he had an aura of toughness around him, he has no self awareness.

I think the key point is "of his height". But how many others are even in the equation? Onscreen, looking at a legit 7' 300 lb dude (wearing those pants that cover his chicken legs) he's easier to be bought as a badass than a guy whose half his size. In the initial Diesel years and then after the disastrous babyface run, they were able to make him look like a killer. Nash then brought some of that with him to WCW, added the comedy schtick and drew ridiculous money. He wasn't playing chickenshit heel during the NWO years. Sure he's completely broken down now but to say Nash never drew money as a guy that was a "threat" is incorrect.

 

 

Did not see any of the Diesel stuff live, but did get to watch lots of Nash in WCW stuff live. And I stand by my point. At his most succesful Nash had an aura around him but it wasn't an aura of toughness.

 

Live he didn't give off the tough aura of either Oddities ear Kurggan or Giant Silva. Not physically threatening.

 

Nash's Jimmy Valiant, I represent the street people charisma when booked properly gave him a main event aura but that wasn't physically tough or intimidating charisma. The "I'm too cool to be involved with your bullshit macho games" isn't guy chickenshit running from trouble, but at its most effective it has similar dynamic (guy who acts like he's too good/above the sillyness of the wrestling around him where the fans want to see face drag him kicking and screaming into that sillyness). The fans never did get that payoff, and Flair could run from Brody for an hour holding onto his belt. It worked for a while. But honestly Flair's chickenshit stuff was more about toughness than Nash's cool act.

 

Nash not seeing that isn't exactly surprising. But it is lack of self awareness.

[Coffey]

One of my biggest pet peeves is typing "loose" instead of "lose." Stop it!

 

That being said, first of all, Happy New Year to everyone. Secondly, any predictions for the upcoming Royal Rumble? Also, is this C.M. Punk/Nexus feud going to build all the way to a Wrestlemania match, or just simply be blown off in the matter of a couple weeks? I think Punk/Cena could be huge.

[Victator]

People hated the 30 second squash + 90 second promo format of the Saturday night show.

The shows I'm watching have had mostly extended squashes and competitive matches. One week had all Horsemen (minus Flair) matches. Arn had a really good match with Mike Jackson with Arn using the spine buster (not named that yet) as a flash finisher like the Diamond Cutter.

 

The main event of the Windhams vs Midnights did disappoint me and in 87 I know it would of pissed me off. The match was like a 2000 Nitro main event. They go two minutes like it will last awhile then all of a sudden it breaks down. But I know if every wrestling show could be as good as the TBS show in 87 I would be happy.

[Loss]

People hated the 30 second squash + 90 second promo format of the Saturday night show.

The shows I'm watching have had mostly extended squashes and competitive matches. One week had all Horsemen (minus Flair) matches. Arn had a really good match with Mike Jackson with Arn using the spine buster (not named that yet) as a flash finisher like the Diamond Cutter.

 

The main event of the Windhams vs Midnights did disappoint me and in 87 I know it would of pissed me off. The match was like a 2000 Nitro main event. They go two minutes like it will last awhile then all of a sudden it breaks down. But I know if every wrestling show could be as good as the TBS show in 87 I would be happy.

 

They changed to that format much later in the year. People aren't as down on spring/summer 1987. It's more post-Bash tour.

[Victator]

Lex Luger was in one match and he improved so much in nine months. Watching his first appearance in January and he seems awkward and he has a hard time getting a jobber up in the torture rack. Fast forward to September and he can do it all. Good on promos, oozing personality and good in the ring. But I think you would have to work not to improve working with the Horsemen.

 

I watched an episode of NWA Pro with the Midnight Rider debut. It was way more over than I heard. I can imagine why some would hate it as the entire show had everybody talking about the Rider. But the big angle of the Rider trying to lynch Tully and JJ getting a posse of all the heels was great. If they had to kill it suddenly they should of unmasked the Rider and revealed him to be Dirty Rhodes. Just to give some closure.

[Guest Slickster]

Maybe I haven't watched enough NWA TV from 87-88 but in my opinion the storylines and upcoming matches weren't as established or made clear as they would be on WWE programming from the same period. You almost had to wait for the post-match interview to get a clearer understanding of who Wrestler X was, who he was feuding with, and when/where they would be facing each other. During the matches, the focus seemed to be on the match itself at the expense of promoting their characters and their active storylines.

[Victator]

The difference between the WWF and the NWA at that time was not everyone was involved in a feud. So when guys were wrestling on TBS if they did not have an issue they talked about the wrestler and the match. If he had a feud or story they put it over. One thing about wrestling in the 80s was there was something for everybody. The big promotions provided different things.

[Strummer]

Hulk Hogan's mother, Ruth Bollea, passed away

 

She actually made a few appearances on WWF television. In Hogan's post match celebration after beating Iron Sheik she is seen in the locker room and in a great real life moment seems scared to death to be around all the huge wrestlers. She also appeared on SNME at Cyndi Lauper's Mother's Day party

[Ditch]

Someone at PWT just uploaded a metric ton of old WONs. Which could mean that Loss is no longer the only one able to do recaps, hint hint.

[Boondocks Kernoodle]

I just read the one recapping Bash '89. Apparently the followup PPV was originally to be called "The Holloween Holocaust." I think it's obvious why they changed that one. They spelled "Halloween" wrong!

[rovert]

There is disbelief on F4W over the fact that Chris Masters is a good worker, I dont think we are out of 2010 yet. Ha ha.

[Dylan Waco]

How did that even come up at F4W?

[rovert]

How did that even come up at F4W?

Mykill posted an isnt Masters awesome thread, people have referenced there Masters love in thread before by the way. Cue DVDR and Henry>Angle references.

 

As someone who has ploughed up that hill last year what in particular do you think makes people oppose the mere notion that Masters is a good worker?

[Loss]

Heavyweights who aren't headliners are incapable of being good.

[Cox]

I think it's that preconceived notions are hard to break. When Masters first came up a few years ago, he was still REALLY green. Between that and the huge, roided out bodybuilder physique, which was something that Meltzer always used to equate with bad worker dating back to the 80's in the Observer, and I think it was hard for some folks to accept that Masters had not only improved, but became damn good.

[sek69]

To be fair, guys with bodybuilder physiques being good workers was far more the exception than the rule so it's not like Dave was out in left field as a general rule. I know for me it was more that Masters' improvement came on shows that very few people watch, like Superstars. A lot of people only remembered him as the jacked up stiff who full-nelson'ed people and then got mocked by DX after he got off the gas.

 

Hell, a lot of casual fans only watch Raw, so if anyone got sent to Smackdown they may as well have been endeavored in the eyes of a lot of people (at least while it was on MyNetwork).

[cm funk]

Someone at PWT just uploaded a metric ton of old WONs. Which could mean that Loss is no longer the only one able to do recaps, hint hint.

I don't want to step on Loss' toes, but I might give that a shot

[Victator]

Masters was already good by 06/07 he improved rapidly from the time he debuted til he got fired the first time. Right now he has Lex Luger syndrome. Every week he was just now improving. With Luger it started at the point he beat Nikita for the U.S belt. Masters will probably never get the proper acknowledgment since he is stuck on the C show.

[rovert]

Bryan disses some people on here in a comment that probably wasnt meant as a diss in the first few minutes of the show:

http://media001.f4wonline.com/free/010511bvshow.mp3

 

In reference to college lecturers over analysing lucha

[Ditch]

Has anyone here seen the Flair vs Tenryu matches from '92? Now that I know how much Flair wanted to do the match in '88, I'm curious to see how they turned out.

[tomk]

Bryan disses some people on here in a comment that probably wasnt meant as a diss in the first few minutes of the show:

http://media001.f4wonline.com/free/010511bvshow.mp3

 

In reference to college lecturers over analysing lucha

 

don't see that as a diss to anyone here at all. In fact it’s followed up by a discussion of dragons gate/ Angle v HBK type matches that almost sounds likes it was transcribed from something Schneider wrote 4 years ago.

 

The actual shot he took is based on this article:

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...1010202440.html

 

There are two college profs quoted in the article; one is a professor specializing in economics of underground drug traffic who also happens to be a lucha fan. The second is Heather Levi who is anthropology prof at Temple who was one of writers of "World of Lucha" (which I haven't read) and wrote academic articles on Exoticos as far back as 97 (some of which I have read). She isn't a college lecturer commenting on some cultural phenomenon the she isn't familiar with. She has done ethnographic work with luchadors and fans, and I think she may have trained. She's been writing about lucha for as long as Alvarez has been writing his sheet.

 

I thought the article needed an actual lecturer on narco-culture (someone like Alma Guillemoprieto) who would point out that the narco culture is so pervasive that you don't need a character to be an actual "drug dealer" to be a character that celebrates narco culture.

 

I assume Bryan is taking a shot at Levi’s “over analysis” . Not sure how you could call that an over analysis as essentially her explanation is “people go to lucha shows to boo the corrupt refs, cheer the good guys, and yell slurs at the assholes…which is awesome and cathartic cause you can’t do that in actual day to day life”.

[KrisZ]

Just finished recording F4D with Dr. Lucha and there is lots of IWRG/Black Terry pimping on the show by yours truly but I am mad at myself for forgetting to ask Chico about the Pierroth/Cuban Assassin footage.

[rovert]

Bryan disses some people on here in a comment that probably wasnt meant as a diss in the first few minutes of the show:

http://media001.f4wonline.com/free/010511bvshow.mp3

 

In reference to college lecturers over analysing lucha

 

don't see that as a diss to anyone here at all. In fact it’s followed up by a discussion of dragons gate/ Angle v HBK type matches that almost sounds likes it was transcribed from something Schneider wrote 4 years ago.

 

The actual shot he took is based on this article:

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...1010202440.html

 

There are two college profs quoted in the article; one is a professor specializing in economics of underground drug traffic who also happens to be a lucha fan. The second is Heather Levi who is anthropology prof at Temple who was one of writers of "World of Lucha" (which I haven't read) and wrote academic articles on Exoticos as far back as 97 (some of which I have read). She isn't a college lecturer commenting on some cultural phenomenon the she isn't familiar with. She has done ethnographic work with luchadors and fans, and I think she may have trained. She's been writing about lucha for as long as Alvarez has been writing his sheet.

 

I thought the article needed an actual lecturer on narco-culture (someone like Alma Guillemoprieto) who would point out that the narco culture is so pervasive that you don't need a character to be an actual "drug dealer" to be a character that celebrates narco culture.

 

I assume Bryan is taking a shot at Levi’s “over analysis” . Not sure how you could call that an over analysis as essentially her explanation is “people go to lucha shows to boo the corrupt refs, cheer the good guys, and yell slurs at the assholes…which is awesome and cathartic cause you can’t do that in actual day to day life”.

 

I know but it was funny listening to Seguanda Caida and B&V back to back and to hear that.

[Guest kowking]

Bryan disses some people on here in a comment that probably wasnt meant as a diss in the first few minutes of the show:

http://media001.f4wonline.com/free/010511bvshow.mp3

 

In reference to college lecturers over analysing lucha

 

don't see that as a diss to anyone here at all. In fact it’s followed up by a discussion of dragons gate/ Angle v HBK type matches that almost sounds likes it was transcribed from something Schneider wrote 4 years ago.

 

The actual shot he took is based on this article:

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...1010202440.html

 

There are two college profs quoted in the article; one is a professor specializing in economics of underground drug traffic who also happens to be a lucha fan. The second is Heather Levi who is anthropology prof at Temple who was one of writers of "World of Lucha" (which I haven't read) and wrote academic articles on Exoticos as far back as 97 (some of which I have read). She isn't a college lecturer commenting on some cultural phenomenon the she isn't familiar with. She has done ethnographic work with luchadors and fans, and I think she may have trained. She's been writing about lucha for as long as Alvarez has been writing his sheet.

 

I thought the article needed an actual lecturer on narco-culture (someone like Alma Guillemoprieto) who would point out that the narco culture is so pervasive that you don't need a character to be an actual "drug dealer" to be a character that celebrates narco culture.

 

I assume Bryan is taking a shot at Levi’s “over analysis” . Not sure how you could call that an over analysis as essentially her explanation is “people go to lucha shows to boo the corrupt refs, cheer the good guys, and yell slurs at the assholes…which is awesome and cathartic cause you can’t do that in actual day to day life”.

 

Bryan Alvarez is the worst.