WWF announcing debate mega-thread

[flyonthewall2983]

What's the overall opinion on Lawler as an announcer? I really couldn't get used to him once he replaced Heenan as heel announcer, but my opinion started to change once he started to be more of a tweener and gone the route to where he is today.

[goc]

I have the exact opposite opinion and think he was much better as a heel commentator, especially when he and J.R. were more argumentative instead of being very buddy buddy like they were in their later years.

[victory]

I liked Lawler in the mid 90's and for the most part during the Attitude era. After he came back in 2002 or so not so much. He's kind of become a parody of himself by this point.

[Jimmy Redman]

I actually have a lot of time for King on commentary. He was probably better as a heel, but at the same time, when he's actually on he's still better than anyone else currently in the picture. Like when he gets his 'serious world title match' face on and starts talking about how certain things affect you in the ring, or when he comes up with the perfect one-liner. I remember during the Cena/Rey TV match, halfway through King suddenly says "Guys, I don't think John Cena has thrown a single punch in this match." And he hadn't, and it was the perfect comment to highlight how unique such a super babyface match was, and Cena's attitude to it. Stuff like that I really like. He still has that instinctual wrestling mind and every now and then he busts it out.

[El-P]

Lawler was fine as a heel color guy, but really became unbearable during the Attitude Era. "Puppies !" was the beginning of the end.

[Matt D]

I really like Lawler on commentary in 1993. He had a lot to offer between the magistrater being so quick and hilarious, the fact he has a joke for everything and some pretty good heel chemistry with Savage where you could sort of tell they had history even if it was never really drawn upon. And it's obvious how big a hit it was when he left and we were suddenly saddled with poor Stan Lane.

[flyonthewall2983]

Maybe it's just me then. I heard a little about him from Apter mags but didn't see him on television until he made his debut on Prime Time in '92. Looking back, some of what he said was funny but I despair a little because Heenan could have lifted the product so much during those lean years when he was in WCW not doing a whole lot.

[PeteF3]

No question the Lawler of '93 is better than the Lawler of '99, but the main thing that separated him from Ventura or Heenan is his complete inability/refusal to ever praise the babyfaces for anything, or criticize the heel for anything. It's really the same symptom as his heel promos where he doesn't put his opponent over, just belittling them instead. Jesse or Bobby's occasional acknowledgment of what a babyface could do well, or a mistake made by a heel, gave just a little bit more credence to their usual heel shtick. Lawler was a lot more blindly allegiant to the heels, to his commentary's detriment.

[flyonthewall2983]

That's the primary reason why I didn't think he was good then, if I think back to what separated Lawler during that time to his predecessors. I suspect why a lot of why Jerry got better is because of Jim Ross. I remember more stuff with the two of them after Jerry came back than in 1999, and they were a damn good team up until J.R. was moved out.

[Matt D]

Savage starts getting really passive aggressive after WMX. Whenever Vince asks a question about who could win a match, he jumps in and says that HE could win the match and he's often trying to make things about him. It's ultimately both funny and sad and definitely writing on the wall. The two man Vince/Savage team is not great.

 

EDIT: hey, it wasn't just me that noticed. Dave said this in the 4/25/94 WON

 

Randy Savage did about the worst job in history on color on the 4/18 show. Bottom line (the most overused phrase in wrestling history). He was overbearing and had nothing to say.

[efrim]

Bottom line (the most overused phrase in wrestling history)

Poor 1994 Meltzer, he had no idea how much worse it would get in a few years.

[flyonthewall2983]

I like Graves and the English guy. Cole and Wade have really good chemistry too. I thought WM this year was an almost perfect show and haven’t heard it this well announced since JR and the King. 

[KawadaSmile]

Michael Cole has honestly had an all time great run since they started doing those CWC and MYC specials. I distinctly recall him being really damn good for that UK tournament, too. 

[sek69]

Michael Cole is legit a great announcer when he's not having to do Vince bullshit. 

[PeteF3]

For me the Cole well was poisoned so long ago that it literally doesn't matter how technically good he is now. He's always going to be an insincere fake-laughing ninny.

[Brian Elliott]

On 8/2/2023 at 5:19 AM, PeteF3 said:

For me the Cole well was poisoned so long ago that it literally doesn't matter how technically good he is now. He's always going to be an insincere fake-laughing ninny.

Cole is outstanding at filling the air with words in the utterly unfeeling and unmemorable manner that WWE encourages. 

[Robert S]

I was paying a bit attention during Summerslam at what Michael Cole was saying and he sounded about as human as wrestling announcers did in late 90ies wrestling video games. A barely trained AI language model has better chances in passing a Turing test than this Cole does. And considering that Vince AFAIK is not around shows lately, you cannot blame that on him.

[Embrodak]

I wish some company would take the MSW trick of having someone who’s not wrestling that week doing color for the whole show, instead of just sitting in on individual matches. Gives the guy a chance to grow on the audience in a different way, prevents the dynamic of the fixed announcers from getting too stale, allows storylines to develop without endless in-ring blather.

[C.S.]

I know Dave shit all over them, but Gorilla Monsoon, Lord Alfred Hayes, and Sean Mooney were all infinitely more listenable (is that a word?) than Michael Cole, because they at least sounded like real people with real emotions. WWE Prime Time Wrestling filler matches with Mooney and Lord Al on commentary just bantering about utter nonsense - like the pronunciation of Kato - remain happy memories from my childhood.  

[flyonthewall2983]

I have the commentary shut off on 2K25. Just not the same for me without Jerry and JR. Takes me back to the older games like Super WrestleMania when there was just a little funny frames of animated Vince and Bobby calling the action. I’ve seen a few things on YouTube of more recent custom games that have lines from Vince, Gorilla and Jesse tailored specifically to the guy on screen in such a way that it had an arcade game feel to it. The 91 and 95 games are works of art if you ask me.

I really like that Jesse’s back.