The Pro-wrestling Curve of Attractiveness

[Boss Rock]

 

I think you can look at it like this. Who has come out of a feud with Alexa better off than before? I think she is a Hunter project because her feuds seem a lot like Hunter's biggest run in 02/05.

 

Its not her fault the Nia matches were bad. Nia is really bad, but Alexa is not good enough to go that long in a match without someone leading her. I think that is why they did not do the feud the first time.

 

Her promos are scripted similar to Miz, where she gets to say things to bury the face and the face is not allowed to retaliate. Both also win way too many matches cleanly. I don't know who has the mentality heels should win matches cleanly. But its one of the worst things WWE does.

 

Heels like Miz and Alexa should not be winning matches cleanly. Alexa having a knock out punch feels like Alexa fan fiction.

I actually absolutely believe that heels should win cleanly (at least sometimes). It drives me absolutely crazy when someone turns and all the sudden they can't win matches cleanly, like overnight. It also gives the faces a challenge to overcome other than cheating, which alleviates some of the intuition to start putting gimmicks around the match that should "even" the odds. I also draw a distinction between bending the rules a bit throughout the match to get an advantage or maybe even going past the line of sportsmanship and cheating to get the actual decision. The former is something that should be built into a heels DNA, the latter should be used fairly strategically. Heels shouldn't win clean ALL the time, but I find the pattern of heels only (or even the vast majority of the time) cheating to win super irritating.

 

Spot on about the nature of Alexa's promos and who has come out stronger (or more accurately not) from her feuds, but I really attribute that to them not sticking with much long term for her (aside from Nia). To me, the Sasha feud left a lot on the table. Sasha and maybe even Bayley came out worse for feuding with her because it felt - at least to me - like things moved forward unresolved ultimately. I also think both of those two at least have been the product of waffling booking for a long time now so I am hard pressed to pinpoint a single thing that caused their decline in standing. Both were overdetermined in my mind. Bayley did get buried in those promos though, but that was at least part on her for not being ready for that.

 

 

Couldn't agree more. Heels should be credible enough that they can beat 98-99% of the roster clean. If they need loads of cheating to beat even mid-carders (see Seth Rollins circa 2015), then the audience loses interest. I also like the idea of bending the rules/taking a few shortcuts throughout the course of the match even if the finish is clean to ensure the heel doesn't look like TOO much of a coward and the face doesn't look like they were 100% inferior.

 

And I also agree that the Sasha/Bayley feuds suffered because the heel went over while leaving so much unresolved. The heel was basically proven right and that was that.

[gordi]

I like how this thread has morphed from what it was originally intended to be, into just listing which wrestlers we find attractive, and then into a discussion of how the WWE women's division should be booked. I feel like a complete double morph like that is relatively rare, even here.

[SomethingSavage]

What's the general consensus on the Bellas? I only mention them, because I think they could make for interesting discussion. There are clear similarities but also obvious differences - both in terms of appearances AND in-ring skill. Does one impact the other? Like, did Nikki's improvement between the ropes suddenly boost her hotness with the diehards? Or does Brie get bonus points for her association with indie darling D-Bry? Lots of ground could be covered there.

[Mad Dog]

Brie is more attractive post-pregnancy than Nikki. Nikki is okay in the ring and Brie is terrible as a wrestler.

[Victator]

I don't hate heels winning clean depending on the heel. Brock, Braun, Joe and to a degree Rollins, AJ and Nak.

But Miz and Alexa should never win cleanly.

[Alucard]

 

I think you can look at it like this. Who has come out of a feud with Alexa better off than before?

 

I feel like that could be said for about almost any feud in the women's division, not just Alexa. Did anyone come off better after feuding with Bayley? Certainly not Nia who tapped out clean to her in their first match, not Sasha who had her character destroyed ever since, and not Charlotte who just kept on losing to Bayley over and over until she switched brands. People also said Sasha came out of the Charlotte feud worse cause she always lost in the end. Whereas for one example, I would say Naomi came out of the Alexa feud better than before, she won the title from her twice and beat her at every turn, that's the feud that established her as a top female.

[Victator]

Some of its terrible booking. Some of it is nobody knows how to cut heel promos anymore. I personally blame suit era Jericho for ruining an entire generation.

[Johnny Sorrow]

My buddy Wolfman thinks Charlotte is just the height of beauty. He also is the biggest Ric Flair fan I've ever known, so I totally get that he now can think about fucking his idol without having to deal with deeper issues. Which I bring up every time we talk. I'd tell him that I think Tamina is beautiful, but I'm not giving him those jokes, not just yet.

[thebrainfollower]

I saw Emma at a restaurant a few hours after an ROH show and kind of thought to myself "she's hot, probably the hottest woman here but not by that much". But in ring she looked spectacular and knows how to look like a star.

 

Mandy Rose is most likely getting the intended Emmalina and Eva Marie pushes but her stoic goddess routine is another example of not letting a person work their natural talents into their characters, as she's actually quite goofy outside of WWE.

 

Alexa as Braun's mouthpiece isn't the worst idea ever.

[Victator]

Yeah but Braun is better at talking.

[SomethingSavage]

I had to search for this thread, because I knew I'd get death threats if I posted a comment about anyone's appearance in any other average thread.

So yeah. I realize we're supposed to pretend we don't notice how people look or anything, but hey. I have working eyeballs. And so I noticed a few things on the Elimination Chamber show.

That Billie Kay chick freaks me the fuck out. There's something about her face. It's like she's one part Flo the Progressive lady & one part Jigsaw the murder doll from the Saw franchise.

How she passes for a sex symbol or whatever the Iiconics are supposed to be is beyond me. But to each their own.

And seeing Charlotte in street clothes made it glaringly obvious that she is very much her father's daughter. I mean, I always noticed the broad shoulders and lanky Roger the Alien arms before, but she's got no real figure at all. Not a curve in sight.

[El-P]

45 minutes ago, SomethingSavage said:

I had to search for this thread, because I knew I'd get death threats if I posted a comment about anyone's appearance in any other average thread.

Fuck those people. Pretending pro-wrestling isn't selling bodies and sexuality is beyond hypocritical. You think Kota Ibushi getting those crazy reactions from women has nothing to do with his body and look ?

Anyway, I hear you on Billie Kay, although she's funny (in a goofy way) and got character, which is halfway through sexy to me. That being said, what cracks me up about the IIconics is everytime Meltz mentions them as not being any good in the ring, I'm waiting from some angry tweet from Royce, but apparently saying you suck at your job is nothing compared to an awkward yet inconsequential remark about your body (reminder : the IIconic are selling sex-appeal, that's half of their gimmick). 

The ressemblance between Charlotte and her father never struck me before. Tessa on the other hand...

[SomethingSavage]

Meh. I think Tessa is hawter than a fresh fucked fox wearing wool socks sometimes, but A LOT of that admittedly comes from her swagger. She carries herself like a boss. And that ass meat ain't too shabby either.

But yeah. The Stan Smith jawline is an unfortunate tragedy.

Charlotte just does nothing for me. It's all strictly personal preference, but I can't look at her without thinking about Ric in drag. She's uncensored!

[C.S.]

Yeah, certain posters here seem to make it their gimmick to be perpetually offended.

Wish I could find and quote the post, but someone here somewhere said that a wrestler's in-ring skills have the effect of making them even more attractive than they are already. I agree.

Also, having something upstairs counts for a lot in my eyes. For example, Torrie Wilson was an astonishingly beautiful woman, but the minute she opened her mouth, she lost all attractiveness for me because she came across like a massive airhead.

My favorite in the Attitude era was Molly. Looked amazing and natural, and became even more attractive to me because she was the best female worker in the company by a mile. (Don't waste your time rebutting with "but Trish" when she got more matches and longer matches to strut her stuff.)

Here's where I stand on a few of the modern wrestlers, including some mentioned above:

Emma/Tenille Dashwood: She was probably the most attractive to me, and not far behind in her ring skills either. It's a pity she's now being wasted in ROH's DOA women's division. (Is she even still there?)

Iiconics: I find Peyton the more attractive of the two, but I think they're attractive together as a pair. The accents really help.

Alexa: She has a modern-day Nicole Eggert vibe going for her.

Nia Jax: I'm in the minority, but I think she's stunning. Even her clumsy recklessness doesn't change that for me.

Naomi: Very beautiful woman and fun to watch athletically. 

Four Horsewomen (WWE): Charlotte does nothing for me, not because of her looks, but because she comes across as such a spoiled brat whenever she and Ric are together on Network specials. Total turn-off for me. Sasha, Becky, and Bayley are all gorgeous in their own way, with their great wrestling skills and characters that make them even more attractive. I might change my mind about Sasha if I met her at an airport though - she's supposedly not the fan-friendliest. (Then again, I don't make it a habit of bothering people in airports.) 

Ronda: People don't seem to realize she's beautiful because she's such a badass and they're all afraid of her. 

Finn Balor: I'm not gay, but damn, this is a handsome man! (Honorable mentions to Johnny Gargano and Karl Anderson.)

[WingedEagle]

4 hours ago, SomethingSavage said:

That Billie Kay chick freaks me the fuck out. There's something about her face. It's like she's one part Flo the Progressive lady & one part Jigsaw the murder doll from the Saw franchise.

Legitimately laughed out loud at this.  Bravo.

Aesthetics are a vital and undeniable part of this or any performance business.  Performers should look the part, but that doesn't mean they should all look the same.  Attractive, fit, athletic, huge, small, whatever the case may be -- diversity of appearances go a long way.  Its why monsters who can be marketed as 7 feet stand out when used sparingly and why Daniel Bryan wouldn't work if he had Randy Orton's size and look.  

There's no shame in acknowledging or judging how a given look is an asset or detriment to a particular role or character.

[sek69]

Charlotte is just so physically bigger than nearly everyone else on the roster she comes off looking mannish as a result. So many of the women are either barely over 5 feet tall, stick thin, or both while Charlotte just towers over everyone not Nia or Tamina. 

[El-P]

9 hours ago, C.S. said:

Also, having something upstairs counts for a lot in my eyes. For example, Torrie Wilson was an astonishingly beautiful woman, but the minute she opened her mouth, she lost all attractiveness for me because she came across like a massive airhead.

This. No idea if that's the true about Wilson, but yeah. Smarts and character changes a ton in term of perception. And as far as pro-wrestling goes, talent. Or comical lack thereof (because clumsiness can be quite charming IRL, and I say that being clumsy as hell myself). Speaking of which, I think Lacy Evans is gonna be a gift.

Matt Morgan totally looks awesome, and he has this really *sympathetic* face which makes him very appealing. Maybe the fact he's got that reputation of being a very nice and friendly guy plays a part, but yeah, he's got something going for him. (Randy Orton would be the opposite exemple in term of "guy with great genetics", he looks like a complete creep)

Finn "facefuck me" Balor, yeah, no shit. If I had that face and body...

Speaking of character, Scarlett Bordeaux is only hotter because her character is actually fun, she's a complete throwback to burlesque strip-tease artists, she's doing the sexy-yet-comical bit very well. 

And yeah, Tessa Blanchard looks like Tully with Dat Ass, but her charisma, attitude and talent in the ring makes her super appealing and charming. That girl, AEW needs to sign her yesterday.

[Big Pete]

The Iiconics aren't sex symbols, they're a comedy duo who flout the rules. That isn't to say they're not presentable, they're obviously very fit but compared to say the WWE's portrayal of Mandy Rose or even Lacey Evans, they clearly have a different utility.

The Iiconics are in this strange position where I feel they're not utilised to their potential, but I couldn't see them possibly being champions or in a championship program. I see them in that Edgeheads type of role where they can be good ancillary characters but not quite stars. I would have thought debuting them as Carmella's insurance policy and giving them a couple of protected double team moves would have been a way to get them over, but they were cast into the background pretty quickly.

As far as Meltzer, it was pretty classic Dave where he made a fair point but phrased it so poorly it backfired tremendously. Dave has a tendancy to be really cute and make all these references and innuendo when he should either just come out and say what he means, or just leave it.

[Mad Dog]

14 hours ago, SomethingSavage said:

Meh. I think Tessa is hawter than a fresh fucked fox wearing wool socks sometimes, but A LOT of that admittedly comes from her swagger. She carries herself like a boss. And that ass meat ain't too shabby either.

But yeah. The Stan Smith jawline is an unfortunate tragedy.

Charlotte just does nothing for me. It's all strictly personal preference, but I can't look at her without thinking about Ric in drag. She's uncensored!

You know, you catch her at certain angles and she's a dead ringer for Tully. She's a great worker but she does nothing for me looks wise because of how close she resembles her dad at times.

[Coffey]

On 5/16/2018 at 9:29 PM, Coffey said:

And I wish they would build the women's division around babyface Becky.

Prophet Coffey!

I'm an ass man (♫DUNT DUNT! ♫) & I'm not a fan of cosmetic enhancement surgeries. I think Bayley has an incredible body. She has a ton of curves. Still think she has the best female body in WWE though. When she was doing those sit down interviews in that brown dress in NXT? Son...

 

I actually kind of wish they would get away from the whole hugger kid character thing they have Bayley doing. I think she could do a lot more. Like give her character a reason to dress up. Have we seen her in non-gear on RAW at all? Probably but I don't remember it.

Charly Caruso, although not a worker, is fucking stunning. She is drop dead beautiful.

I think Liv Morgan is cute but I would prefer if she were a valet instead of a wrestler. I can't buy her matches at all. She's like 90 lbs. No denying she's pretty though. Same with Alexa. Sonya is also pretty. Mostly though WWE goes crazy with all of the make-up & stuff for on camera. It's really noticeable in HD. Especially fake tan. The dudes are especially guilty of that one big time.

[El-P]

31 minutes ago, Coffey said:

It's really noticeable in HD. Especially fake tan. The dudes are especially guilty of that one big time.

Picture Orange Hogan and all the steroid freaks from the 80's in HD. Fucking scary. Not to mention the scarred forehead of the NWA guys. Yeah, shitty VHS were good for those times...

[sek69]

The best is when someone overdoes the fake tanner (I seem to recall Miz being guilty of this more than once) to the point it leaves brown stains on the mat like someone shit themselves in the ring.  There was also that awkard time when HD first started to become a standard and TV makeup crews had to adjust, resulting in a year or so where half the people on TV looked like they were wearing clown makeup. 

6 hours ago, Mad Dog said:

You know, you catch her at certain angles and she's a dead ringer for Tully. She's a great worker but she does nothing for me looks wise because of how close she resembles her dad at times.

Looks aside, she absolutely has Tully's smug charisma down to a T. The reason why Tully was such a great heel is he'd tell you how he was better than everyone and then he'd go out there and do it, and come back even more smug the next time all "See, I told ya!". 

[KawadaSmile]

Since we are here, I think it is also relevant to bring Aleister's appeal and how it could lead to him being super over.

Is he a good wrestler? Yes, absolutely. That sure as hell counts.

Would he get tons of screaming fangirls upon his debut on Lafayette, one of the worst possible crowds, if he weren't handsome? Doubt it. I mean, the tattooed, brooding look alone would be in many people's graces, but then you have a tall, good looking dude who has a nice voice, and people are undoubtedly going to be fawning over him.

Similarly, I think Ricochet is also getting over due to being very good looking with gnarly abs, in addition to his batshit insane athleticism.

[SomethingSavage]

I never saw those Bayley segments before, but yasss. 'Preciate ya, Coffey. Lord's work & all that.

[Alucard]

I have never seen any appeal in Bayley, mannish as people say about Charlotte, facially. Alexa & Sonya are my top 2. I think the overdone makeup/lipstick is what hurts Billie Kay, she was always really pretty in the indys and people always figured she would be WWE bound because of her seemingly natural good looks. No hangups with Tessa, I think she looks great all the time - especially this past week on tv.