sek69 Posted July 24, 2019 Report Share Posted July 24, 2019 Ziggler's a guy who *should* be a star, he checks all of Vince's boxes, has real life cred, and can bring it on promos when motivated. Yet he's not. Like you know how people bag on Miz by saying he's a dude playing pro wrestler? That's how I feel about Ziggler. I never get invested in anything he does since it comes off like a guy who's memorized a How To Be a Sports Entertainer textbook. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alucard Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 With the way he's been booked since coming back, and the two shots lately, I wouldn't be surprised at all if we get Goldberg squashing Dolph at SaudiMania IV in Nov. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 FS2 HD is being added to most Comcast lineups tomorrow, just in time for it to be turned into the WWE Side Programming Channel come October. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FMKK Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 12 hours ago, sek69 said: Ziggler's a guy who *should* be a star, he checks all of Vince's boxes, has real life cred, and can bring it on promos when motivated. Yet he's not. Like you know how people bag on Miz by saying he's a dude playing pro wrestler? That's how I feel about Ziggler. I never get invested in anything he does since it comes off like a guy who's memorized a How To Be a Sports Entertainer textbook. Everything about him, especially the 'stealing the show' gimmick when he does nothing out of the ordinary and never wins, just screams fake pro wrestling. At least Shawn calling himself the Showstopper could be explained away as him being a guy who did comparatively high flying moves for his era as well as actually winning the championship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomethingSavage Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 Tbf, I don't believe creative has done much to help boost him either. The start & stop stuff surrounds guys like Dolph at every turn. The Lana angle was terrible. The follow-through on every one of his angles seems nonexistent. I don't think he's anything extraordinary, but Dolph was pretty over for a time there in 2012-13. It felt like they had the chance to do something halfway special with him after that Payback match with Del Rio, but they totally shit the bed instead. I do think he struggles to be likeable for any length of time though, so perhaps a big babyface run was never really going to stick anyway. That's what makes the Miz feud of 2016 all that more impressive. I don't know. I think Dolph is just a case of a guy being touted as something special by a select few, when there really isn't much actual evidence of it. Athleticism and fitness doesn't always automatically translate to being a premiere worker - although I feel like even people within the business trip up over that notion. You see it with Dolph, and you definitely see it with Seth. So yeah. Dolph has been hamstrung by bad creative, but who hasn't at this point? He's also not creative or artful enough to rise above it in any capacity, which is why he's just kind of there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.S. Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 Jimmy Uso was arrested again for DUI. Fuck him. And fuck WWE for constantly looking the other way and giving him a million "second" chances. "Jonathan Fatu is responsible for his own personal actions." When the next DUI ends with a casualty, WWE will be responsible too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KawadaSmile Posted July 25, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 Dolph tries too hard to be liked when he's a heel, and just doesn't work as a face because he's just not likeable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
...TG Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 14 minutes ago, C.S. said: Jimmy Uso was arrested again for DUI. Fuck him. And fuck WWE for constantly looking the other way and giving him a million "second" chances. "Jonathan Fatu is responsible for his own personal actions." When the next DUI ends with a casualty, WWE will be responsible too. This is Jimmy's first DUI I can find. When he was tased in Detroit he was obviously drunk, but Naomi was driving. Jey had a DUI in 2018. Regardless of the details, 2 alcohol arrests in five months is not good, especially when it was joked about on Monday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 Also fuck WWE for fining weed use to the point guys just accept it as a "pot tax", but someone putting lives at risk is "responsible for their own personal actions".  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMJ Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 I know its Pro Wrestling Only around here, but as someone who made a mistake in my life involving driving while I was intoxicated, I always just want to note that getting a DUI is a terrible, terrible thing and the Usos (and myself) and everyone else who has ever had a DUI without hurting/killing somebody (or ourselves) are very, very lucky that our actions did not result in the worst possible consequences. But I'm also glad that my actions did not immediately cause me to lose my job or, if I had children, the ability to remain a parent. The mistake I made was and will be the only time I ever make that mistake. In the 4 years since I got a DUI, I haven't drank a single beer and gotten behind the wheel. No more "just one after work" Happy Hour engagements. Using Uber/Lyft every single time you drink away from home is way cheaper than a DUI, I can assure everyone. It was an absolutely life-changing, incredibly embarrassing experience for me that I think about every day. Many people I talked to at the required meetings and community service sessions were on their 2nd or 3rd or 4th DUI. It was mind-boggling. My DUI experience had been so shameful that I couldn't imagine how anyone could risk having it happen again. I learned not to judge those people too harshly though, because, in some cases, they were in really, really dark places in their addiction and were still there as we picked up trash on the side of the road.  So, while I don't think individuals should lose their job for DUI arrests (especially first offenses), I do think the WWE should be asking the Usos an important question about why this seems to be happening to them again and again (1 DUI for each brother + Jimmy's arrest in February for a drunken incident in Detroit) and why literally escaping death, a manslaughter, or murder charge hasn't been enough for them to rethink their alcohol use. I'm no teetotaler and even after my DUI I knew that promising my family complete abstinence was unrealistic, but I damn sure knew that there were things I could actively do to make sure I never put anyone else in harm when I decided to use alcohol. Sorry - if a mod wants to delete this, I totally understand if its not on-topic enough. Just felt like sharing as someone who got a DUI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KawadaSmile Posted July 25, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 2 minutes ago, DMJ said: So, while I don't think individuals should lose their job for DUI arrests, I do think the WWE should be asking the Usos an important question about why this seems to be happening to them again and again (1 DUI for each brother + Jimmy's arrest in February for a drunken incident in Detroit) and why literally escaping death, a manslaughter, or murder charge hasn't been enough for them to rethink their alcohol use. I'm no teetotaler and even after my DUI I knew that promising my family complete abstinence was unrealistic, but I damn sure knew that there were things I could actively do to make sure I never put anyone else in harm when I decided to use alcohol. Sorry - if a mod wants to delete this, I totally understand if its not on-topic enough. Just felt like sharing as someone who got a DUI. I think you are totally on point, bubba. It is a worrysome issue and while each individual is not a repeated offender, the timeline of those incidents is way too close and raises some concerns. It can lead to worse things if not properly attented to, and while alcohol is not a wellness violation (unless it's 12h before an event), repeated offenses and worse outcomes should be something they have to think about.  This is a totally fair and well thought-out post.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 @DMJ Your post will not be deleted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.S. Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 Great post, @DMJ. For me, a DUI is one of the worst crimes because it's reckless, selfish, and could potentially end other people's lives (not to mention the driver's). In your case, you made a mistake, learned from it, felt genuine remorse, and will never do it again. I can only respect that. I'm not seeing the same thing from The Usos. When WWE says (and not for the first time) "Jonathan Fatu is responsible for his own personal actions," that to me reeks of insincere bullshit - because the next time this happens, if a life is lost, WWE is fucking responsible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 The thing that makes it upsetting is WWE criminalizes practically every other avenue of pain management and with things like Monday's skit basically condone drinking and driving.  It's not like the Usos are alone, we just had Jeff Hardy get another alcohol related arrest and Ric fucking Flair was in the ring with a beer in his hand in the closing segment of Raw after nearly dying months ago from years of alcohol abuse. It's clear this company does not see the seriousness of these situations and will only do as much as needed to avoid bad PR. This is after all the same company that wanted to cut ties with Kurt Angle at the height of his problems because Vince didn't want a Olympic medalist dying on his watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 As someone who has spent years in a relationship with someone with an alcohol issue and who *always* wanted to drive when she was fucked up, and the endless nights of battles, insults and violent behaviour I had to endure to prevent her to take the wheel when wasted, I don't have much patience or tolerance with fuck-heads like the Usos or Jeff Hardy, who seem to get a pass from fans and the company apparently. Drive drunk and you can kill or severely hurt yourself or someone else and totally destroy your and other people's lives. WWE making jokes about it on the air is yet another reason to say fuck to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FMKK Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 12 minutes ago, sek69 said: The thing that makes it upsetting is WWE criminalizes practically every other avenue of pain management and with things like Monday's skit basically condone drinking and driving.  It's not like the Usos are alone, we just had Jeff Hardy get another alcohol related arrest and Ric fucking Flair was in the ring with a beer in his hand in the closing segment of Raw after nearly dying months ago from years of alcohol abuse. It's clear this company does not see the seriousness of these situations and will only do as much as needed to avoid bad PR. This is after all the same company that wanted to cut ties with Kurt Angle at the height of his problems because Vince didn't want a Olympic medalist dying on his watch. The pain management element is interesting. Are these guys just douchebags or are they drinking to deal with physical issues from years in the ring? Has it become a dependency? Also, do we have a time on when this happened? He wasn't coming to or from a WWE show was he? Because that brings back around the stuff from that Bayley interview where the Fox presenter couldn't believe that the wrestlers have to handle their own travel between shows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 While I can't speak of the douchebag element (despite the implied level of doucheness contained from repeated offenses), wrestlers always are looking for something to manage the pain of having to bump on a near daily basis. Drinking has always been seen as the "safest" and most socially acceptable method, especially after cocaine fucked up so many people in the 80s and Somas did in a lot of folks from the 90s. It's one of the reasons RVD was so outspoken about his pot use as he felt it helped him with pain management without having potential life altering side effects and how it was bullshit WWE singled it out to fine people for. In addition to the pain management aspect, there's been the mindset that if you didn't go drinking with the boys after the show you were some kind of pussy. Obviously that mindset is changing, but how many times to you here guys (not always old timers either) making jokes about wrestlers these days just wanting to go play video games instead of partying after the show. Plus you figure with the environment the Usos grew up in, you know the "you have to party with the boys" was the mindset they were taught. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 1 minute ago, sek69 said: Obviously that mindset is changing, but how many times to you here guys (not always old timers either) making jokes about wrestlers these days just wanting to go play video games instead of partying after the show. Funny thing is that AEW is being built on those non-drinking, playing video games guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War is Raw Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 I was disappointed with this arrest. Had to double check if it was the same Uso twin. What was frustrating is that he didn't take any responsibility about the last time's incident (he and his wife blamed the cop), so I am waiting for this time's excuse. It should be noted he's not the first in his large wrestling family to get into trouble with the police in Florida, so it may be something he is a magnet for.... WWE should put him in alcohol rehab instead of giving him tag titles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 14 minutes ago, War is Raw said: WWE should put him in alcohol rehab instead of giving him tag titles. That surprised me how that kind of flew under the radar. Everyone was expecting the Usos to get buried under the arena floor after news of that arrest broke, but they ended up more or less being rewarded by winning the titles (as much as winning tag titles can be seen as a reward in 2019 WWE). Everyone's reaction was more or less "huh, didn't expect that" and the world moved on.   Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZThomas Posted July 26, 2019 Report Share Posted July 26, 2019 On 7/24/2019 at 6:44 PM, sek69 said: Ziggler's a guy who *should* be a star, he checks all of Vince's boxes, has real life cred, and can bring it on promos when motivated. Yet he's not. Like you know how people bag on Miz by saying he's a dude playing pro wrestler? That's how I feel about Ziggler. I never get invested in anything he does since it comes off like a guy who's memorized a How To Be a Sports Entertainer textbook. Ziggler works like he purposely doing impersonations of his favorite wrestlers at different parts of the match. Almost like he's saying "look I'm Rick Rude" *swivels hip the elbow "look I'm Mr Perfect * Slingshot into the corner bump "look I'm Billy Gunn" *FameAsser . And he must have heard Agents say selling is a dying Art, so he sells like he is trying too hard to impress the agents in the back. It's like he Wrestles like he's trying to impress the Wrestlers he grew up watching by the way he sells. Selling is a lost art but like Austin says, he sells to much to the point it has made him too vulnerable to be taken serious as a top guy. He's past that widow now anyway but still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Sorrow Posted July 26, 2019 Report Share Posted July 26, 2019 5 hours ago, War is Raw said: I was disappointed with this arrest. Had to double check if it was the same Uso twin. What was frustrating is that he didn't take any responsibility about the last time's incident (he and his wife blamed the cop), so I am waiting for this time's excuse. It should be noted he's not the first in his large wrestling family to get into trouble with the police in Florida, so it may be something he is a magnet for.... WWE should put him in alcohol rehab instead of giving him tag titles. Just this, and in no way am I defending either drunk driving or being one of these "WWE apologists" that keep being brought up that don't exist here. While he was drunk when Naomi was pulled over, I'm positive that was some profiling shit, and perhaps he got hot knowing that while drunk. We're in an age of black people getting killed for nothing during traffic stops. I'm not  excusing his behavior, but I can see him thinking it'd be appropriate in his state to confront the cop about it, being a "celebrity ", and being angry about the current state of affairs. And that was the arrest Cena "rapped" about. Yet EVERY headline is "Second DUI". No, this was his first. The media is like me. Can't tell twins apart. And there's no such thing as" Alcohol rehab ", nor can an employer force someone to go. If you work at almost anywhere and you get enough DUI's  to even lose your license? As long as you can still get to work and driving isn't part of your job, you don't get fired. Especially if you're an "independent contractor ". Driving fucked up is awful, and should be punished by the law to the fullest extent., but anyone who ever laughed or loved a story about old school guys "drinking two cases of beer while driving down the roads, talking about the business" needs to hush. I mean, you know Jericho is gonna get popped sooner rather than later on the road for AEW.  Will the outrage be as loud here? I wonder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted July 26, 2019 Report Share Posted July 26, 2019 Jericho seems to be smart enough to keep his drunken adventures to Twitter at least. Plus between his wrestling and music gigs I would assume he probably has a bus or some other method of transportation where he doesn't drive himself. But if he got busted for DUI and they did a joke about it on TV it would be just as much bullshit.  1 hour ago, Johnny Sorrow said: And there's no such thing as" Alcohol rehab ", nor can an employer force someone to go. If you work at almost anywhere and you get enough DUI's  to even lose your license? As long as you can still get to work and driving isn't part of your job, you don't get fired. Especially if you're an "independent contractor ". No such thing as alcohol rehab? You can probably make an argument if it's effective (I personally don't think anyone can get clean unless they deal with the underlying issues that cause them to use in the first place), but it definitely exists. Also since most states are "at-will" when it comes to employment, you can get fired for anything that isn't codified in the law (race/gender/religion/etc). WWE was known to fire people the second they sniff any possible bad PR, the only reason they don't do it now is because they are deathly afraid of handing AEW their next big star.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.S. Posted July 26, 2019 Report Share Posted July 26, 2019 6 hours ago, Johnny Sorrow said: Driving fucked up is awful, and should be punished by the law to the fullest extent., but anyone who ever laughed or loved a story about old school guys "drinking two cases of beer while driving down the roads, talking about the business" needs to hush. I mean, you know Jericho is gonna get popped sooner rather than later on the road for AEW.  Will the outrage be as loud here? I wonder. Weird comment re: Jericho. I would absolutely be outraged. His entire third book was a drunken embarrassment. It made him look like an asshole, and I said as much at the time. With that being said, Jericho doesn't have a history of DUI (that we know of) - The Usos do. I'm glad you brought up the stories we've all heard about wrestlers in the '70s and '80s taking a six pack and driving from town to town. It's a miracle there weren't more casualties. The Usos or Jeff Hardy are going to have to fucking kill someone before WWE gets serious about this, stops rewarding bad behavior (The Usos won titles the last time something happened), and maybe moves to a bus touring system or some other solution. Some of the top guys already have buses, or at least that was a thing 5-10 years ago, but not everyone is going to want to spend their money on that. WWE should step in and provide it. They already do for NXT and overseas tours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted July 26, 2019 Report Share Posted July 26, 2019 6 hours ago, Johnny Sorrow said: Just this, and in no way am I defending either drunk driving or being one of these "WWE apologists" that keep being brought up that don't exist here. While he was drunk when Naomi was pulled over, I'm positive that was some profiling shit, and perhaps he got hot knowing that while drunk. We're in an age of black people getting killed for nothing during traffic stops. I'm not  excusing his behavior, but I can see him thinking it'd be appropriate in his state to confront the cop about it, being a "celebrity ", and being angry about the current state of affairs. And that was the arrest Cena "rapped" about. ... I mean, you know Jericho is gonna get popped sooner rather than later on the road for AEW.  Will the outrage be as loud here? I wonder. So, you're not defending drunk driving nor excusing his behavior BUT. Any sentence starting with "I'm not defending blablabla" then having a "but" in it basically means whatever comes after the "but" is bullshit and you're really defending the guy and looking for excuses. You're not being one of those WWE apologists, under quotation because none of which exist here, then you're making an assumption that if someone from AEW would get pop up, there would maybe not be any outrage on this board and you "wonder why"... Okayyyyyy...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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