SteveJRogers Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Things that make you go "Hmmmmmm..." Its 11:20pm est, and CM Punk's profile is still in the "Active Superstars" listing on WWE.com, in fact he is still listed in the "Featured Superstars" options on the menu drop down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timbo Slice Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 There's a bigger chance about it being a work than anything considering WWE hasn't come out and said anything yet. Plus, since his contract isn't up for six months, there is a guarantee involved of some kind, so they wouldn't mention it unless there was some type of settlement reached on what was left on it. Which might take a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peachchaos Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Far-fetched idea time. Punk purchases Ring of Honor from Sinclair. Relocates the promotion to Chicago. Only runs Chicago. Becomes the Jerry Lawler of Chicago. ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Why would he even need to buy RoH? I'm pretty sure he could just announce he was going to start a promotion, sign up whatever is out there and then wait for the RoH contracts to expire. Not that he is going to do any of that since the word is that he is smart with his money and not a complete fucking idiot as to waste it all opening a vanity promotion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Oh God, I hope it's not a work. That's some Vince Russo shit there. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cZtuwjdPJU "CM Punk refused to follow the script and walked out! Now Paul "Triple H" Levesque takes matters into his own hands and takes on Phil "CM Punk" Brooks in a unscripted, no-holds-barred MMA match at Elimination Chamber!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W2BTD Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 I don't actually think this would happen, but New Japan has to know they're probably getting decent iPPV buys from the US based on their coverage in the country. So, why not make a Godfather offer ($500k or $1 million for one match) to him for a Tokyo Dome match versus Tanahashi or Okada? According to the latest Observer, international (meaning non Japan) iPPV buys are topping out at around 1,500. That's not only the U.S., but Europe and everywhere else too. They are doing about 100,000 total worldwide for the biggest shows, which is great obviously, but 99.9% of it is coming from Japan. New Japan has grown exponentially in Japan since 2011, no doubt, but the growth abroad is still tiny and really just the hardest of the hardcore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cross Face Chicken Wing Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 This thread has lost its mind. Let's go back to thinking of hippie-themed angles for Daniel Bryan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovert Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 CM Punk's last public comments: Terrible timing for Colt Cabana WWE seemed to be finally moving on him and wanted him to work on the WWE Network. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 There is no precedent for WWE running a work that isn't initiated and played out on television. This is not a work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 There is no precedent for WWE running a work that isn't initiated and played out on television. This is not a work.The people running around yelling "work" are just the worst kind of fan. They are so worried about being smarter than everyone else, that EVERYTHING is a work because "I'm too smart to get worked" I'm sure the same people yelling "it's a work!" are the same who thought Daniel Bryan getting fired the first time was a work or even that Lawler's heart attack was a work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 The HHH perspective on this is interesting. Dave said on the breaking audio last night that HHH does feel disrespected because Punk really didn't want the HHH build and match and that's part of the reason he walked out. His opinion is that he shouldn't come back, but he's letting Vince handle this entirely because he doesn't want to create a perception that he's making this a personal issue. So Dave said he's biting his tongue for the most part and not speaking up even though he has a major problem with how Punk left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Well on a personal level I think it's entirely reasonable that if someone was leaving the company, and cited really not wanting to work with you as one of the reasons why, you'd be miffed. Hunter is human. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Yeah, I actually think his point of view in this case is pretty reasonable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 There is also the mindset that Punk should have at least given some notice instead of leaving 30 minutes before RAW started, and I can't say I don't understand that either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 The "HHH build and match". Who would want that ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Log Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Now that IWA Mid South is running again, I just want another Punk/Hero 90 minute match. (not really) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chief Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Punk came out of the first HHH program worse off then where he was before, I can't blame him for not wanting to work with him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJRogers Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 I'm sure the same people yelling "it's a work!" are the same who thought Daniel Bryan getting fired the first time was a work While I wasn't around the IWC at the time or even watching, to be fair it was brought up on air by Wade Barrett to explain why he wasn't out with Nexus any more. They didn't have to do that with a fired employee unless something was "up" in terms of Bryan returning down the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 I'm sure they planned to bring him back down the road the minute they fired him, but that doesn't mean that the firing was a work. Same thing with Finlay when he was the scapegoat for some PR nonsense. Isn't he back working now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cross Face Chicken Wing Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 If someone told me that I'd be working with HHH (or Randy Orton) at Wrestlemania, I wouldn't be able to run out the door fast enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vicious&delicious Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 HHH v. Punk would've been terrible. The last decent feud HHH had was with Sheamus. If you recall that ended with HHH squashing Sheamus (a la Batista on ADR) and stripping him of any/all credibility to show that he was back!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveJRogers Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 I'm sure they planned to bring him back down the road the minute they fired him, but that doesn't mean that the firing was a work. Oh I agree with that, my point is that I can see someone thinking it something like that was a work, as opposed to health scares or other more insane marks trying too hard to sound smart theories. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrisZ Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 From WON The status of C.M. Punk has become a major talking point in WWE, as he told Vince McMahon about 30 minutes before the start of Raw on 1/27 in Cleveland that he was flying home, and did. He wasn't on the show and didn't appear at the Smackdown tapings the next night. WWE has since pulled him off all shows, although at press time he was still being advertised for Elimination Chamber on 2/23 in Minneapolis. We're told that he will eventually be pulled off that show as well. It's sketchy what happened. Over the last week, ever since Punk's interview with Ariel Helwani before the Chicago UFC show where he openly brought up that his contract was up in July and didn't want to say what he was going to do next, several people who know him had noted not to be surprised if he leaves. Two different people said that he was "as good as gone" in July, and one said that they didn't expect him to even last until July. There were frustrations with creative and with money, even though he has made great money the last several years. This was not a spur of the moment thing as much as something that had been building. The way we were told was that he couldn't take it any longer and told McMahon that he was going home. McMahon had been tied up all day since they were rewriting the show, based on what happened the prior night at the Royal Rumble to figure out a way to keep the show under control and not have the audience hijack it again. Punk had been scheduled for an interview on the show to presumably build up a match with Kane on the PPV, which would lead to his planned WrestleMania match with HHH. Because McMahon was so busy, Punk didn't see him until 7:30 p.m., when he told him he was leaving. The reason the Kofi Kingston vs. Alberto Del Rio match on Raw went so long is because it came during the period laid out for Punk's interview and had to go a second segment to cover the time, so the key "money" segments would be in their correct time slots. The working assumption internally has been for several weeks that Punk was leaving in July and not going to sign a new deal. The belief was that he is not a spender, has saved his money and doesn't have to work. It was a weird dynamic because he's one of the few guys on the roster that the company and Vince McMahon knew believed he didn't need them, and financially, really doesn't. So they can't deal with him from the same level as all the other guys who are scared to lose their jobs and spots. Within the company, the reason was that he came to the realization that he would never be positioned higher than he was. His goal was to main event WrestleMania, as in be in the real main event. He felt that because he didn't fit the mold of what they think the top star in the company should look like, he would never be the guy and the centerpiece. It's not known at press time what caused the situation to get to where it did and what was the straw that broke the camel's back. Another person close to the situation who was aware it was coming, just didn't know when, said it was a classic case of being burned out, and noted the dichotomy that he's never had a job where he's made anywhere close to the same amount of money, nor ever been as famous, and gotten more out of wrestling than this one. But, he has been miserable at the job for some time, and he was a guy who loved working in pro wrestling when he made nothing or very little. It was noted that he never had the personal connection with Vince McMahon that most of the big stars had, and always knew he was not their kind of guy, didn't have the look they thought a star should have, and felt he got over in spite of how he was used and not because of how he was used. The feeling was that there was a communication issue and lingering unresolved issues that dated back some time, probably most of the last year, combined with frustration regarding creative going forward and of late. Sheamus will be replacing Punk at all the Smackdown tapings where he was largely advertised as the main star. It is a brave new world and you can never rule out the possibility it's a work, and you won't know for sure unless Mania comes and goes without a return. Daniel Bryan will be advertised as the main star on Smackdown going forward since John Cena is not booked often on the Tuesday tapings. Punk was at the Wizard World Comic Con in Portland, OR, on 1/25, as he flew form Chicago to Portland, then back to Chicago for UFC that night, and then to Pittsburgh for Rumble before leaving from Cleveland. During the Q&A, he seemed very lackluster about WWE. He basically said that he used to argue the creative but now he just shows up and does what he's told. He pushed the idea that he felt this was Daniel Bryan's year and knocked the short-term booking and planning several times. In many ways, this was similar to when Steve Austin left in 2002, when he publicly started complaining about creative, and a week later he was gone (of course that was precipitated by them wanting him to job to Lesnar clean with no build-up on Raw as opposed to Lesnar going through everyone to set up their first match on a major PPV). Punk did a long interview with MMAFighting.com reporter Ariel Helwani from his home, since UFC was in Chicago. He said at the time that his contract was up in July and said there's no point in saying anything about it. He said if he doesn't sign, he wouldn't say so now, and if he says he is looking at not signing, and then he does, people will think he was working an angle. Plus, he said in 2011, when he started that angle where he was leaving, he was in his mind, 100%, out the door at that time. The circumstances that ended up taking place led to him signing a three-year deal. He's always said that he won't be around as long as people think. Many in WWE have noted to us that Punk has not been happy with his creative. At the same time, of the full-timers with the company, Punk, Batista, John Cena, Daniel Bryan and Randy Orton are the top tier. Batista is scheduled full-time but he is 45 and has had a lot of injuries in the past, although to his credit his body held up for an MMA camp, which is more intense than a wrestling schedule. The difference is the MMA camp is two months and a wrestling schedule never ends. While WWE doesn't "need" anyone, even Cena, Punk does have significant value given the lack of depth on top and injury rate. You can also see with Batista and others that if you do really leave for a while, your value can increase greatly by not being there if you want to rest for a few years and then come back. There's the legends role of a few big shows a year, the Jericho role of half the year or so full-time (although as we've seen with Jericho and RVD, that role does limit greatly how much they'll push you), or leave, rest up injuries and come back full-time, waiting long enough for a Batista level return. The one thing with Punk is he is a big enough star that if he does leave for several years, his return would be a big deal. Still, very few walk away at 35. Batista and Jericho left, but they both did so for other entertainment ventures. Punk hasn't seemed like he's interested in that direction. He said some days he's hurting really bad and other days he's not, noting he's taken very little time off over the last ten years. He said when he took the two months off last year, that he probably should have taken more time. He wasn't fully healed but came back because the Payback PPV was in Chicago and he worked with Chris Jericho, starting a babyface turn. As noted many times, the reason he turned heel when he was a hot babyface, was recognizing that he could be the top heel in the company, but would always at best be the No. 2 babyface. But after the heel run, he was turned back. Still, he was always in top programs, was beating The Shield in 1 vs. 3 matches consistently and was being groomed for a match with HHH at WrestleMania, which while not the main event, was guaranteed to be pushed as one of the key things on the show. Vince McMahon does like a challenge in the sense if a guy looks like he wants out, like Punk did the last time, he may be able to cut a better deal than the guy who the company knows isn't going anywhere and is so glad to be there and afraid of losing their job that they'll take anything. It's an interesting game because he is valuable, maybe second or third most valuable guy in the company, at a time when value of the individual means less than it ever has. He was also asked about doing MMA. He talked about it like he'd like to do it, and noted that he knows people think he can't do it and looks at that as a challenge. He noted that people thought he couldn't do what he did in wrestling and he loves proving people wrong. Bellator has already expressed at least preliminary interest in him. He would be free and clear of any WWE contractual obligations in July. He thought some people who wanted him to fail would tune in to see him get beat up, but he gets punched in the face four times a week anyway. I get the impression a part of him would like to do it the same way Batista did it as a bucket list thing. With Batista, it seemed on the surface to be a real bad risk, but in the end, he did it and wasn't hurt at all. With Punk, on the surface, it would seem the same thing. A theoretical big risk. There was a time when a giant name pro wrestler doing MMA would have been huge, as noted by Brock Lesnar's UFC debut. But I don't see UFC using an 0-0 guy for the same reason they never used Herschel Walker, and at least with Lesnar and Kurt Angle (who they made a strong pitch for), they had the high-level wrestling credentials to make them real. Bellator should take him, but that limits the upside and PPV money. The key is he's 35 and his body is beaten up from years of pro wrestling. While he does train in fighting disciplines, he doesn't have the competition background at a high level in any fighting sport. That is very old to start out in unless you want to compete at the beginners level. It's also hard to say if he goes against someone legit and loses, how it would affect him for a WWE return, either with the fans, or with management. And I'm not sure exactly what kind of challenge he'd be up for. Herschel Walker was up for the challenge, got a lot of publicity, but was put in with guys below his level that he was going to have no trouble beating. But he's also one of the great athletes of modern times. Alberto Del Rio's previous MMA means nothing good or bad for him because most fans don't know of it. But Punk is such a big star people would know. Batista did one fight and few saw it and it meant nothing one way or the other, but he also didn't lose. Had he got knocked out, would it have made a difference? I'm leaning toward no from a fan standpoint because wrestling fans know the difference and if you are a star to wrestling fans, no matter your personal life shortcomings or screw-ups, in the end, you are still a star to them. Punk also said he's told Vince McMahon (via text) that he'd like to induct Ultimate Warrior into the Hall of Fame, although one would think his leaving may nix that, and there probably was never a chance of it to begin with. He said he's never met Warrior, but Warrior texts him inspirational messages before PPVs and they have a connection. He noted that Hulk Hogan, who is rumored to be the one who inducted Warrior, hates Warrior. He tried to downplay the Michelle Beadle/A.J. Lee thing. His description of what happened with he and Beadle was exactly what we heard, well with one added thing. She was with a few of her girlfriends and walked past him and said, "Hey, fuckface" and then high-fived them. I heard everything but the high-five to her friends, which I guess would explain why he wasn't too happy about it. She had claimed it was a greeting of endearment (the two dated at one time briefly), and later went on Twitter and made a comment about girlfriends ruining guys' friendships with girls. His description of what happened with A.J. Lee (whose name he never mentioned, only saying "my girlfriend") was very different, trying to low-key it and play down that anything happened. He said the connection with HHH and Rener Gracie is that HHH and Stephanie brought Rener and Eve Torres (the former WWE star who now is involved in teaching Jiu Jitsu to women) to teach their kids Jiu Jitsu and he put over how great both of them are at teaching kids. When asked about the network, he said as a fan in 1997 he'd have loved if such a thing existed. As a wrestler, he doesn't know, because nobody knows how it'll affect PPV bonuses and none of the wrestles have been told much of anything. Across the board, among the wrestlers, there is a lot of curiosity regarding WrestleMania paychecks. The one thing is, with all the new money coming in, all the wrestlers should make far more because the revenue will be way higher presumably come October when the new TV deals are in place. However, wrestlers have never been paid a cut of the TV deals in the past, and the bulk of their income is either their downside guarantee if they are hurt or not used well, or a formula based on the house show revenue, the PPV revenue, how their merchandise does and a fee from the video game. The network won't hurt house show revenue significantly or at all. It may hurt PPV revenue a lot, and may hurt revenue on DVDs somewhat. So that's a situation to look at. But if PPV and DVD business goes down with the network, but the company gets as much or more revenue based on network subscribers, what cut of the network will the wrestlers be getting is a real issue. In a sense, with more revenue coming in presumably, wrestlers should be paid better. Yet at the same time, with so much of that income more guaranteed rather than generated based on individuals, when it comes to the key guys and big moneymakers, how will their value be measured? He said he has no problem with Batista coming back in a Mania main event spot, but he did have a problem with Dwayne Johnson because he doesn't think you should be in the business part-time and take a WrestleMania spot from someone who deserves it, but since Batista is around the long haul he has no problem. I hope he doesn't really mean that because it would tell me he doesn't understand the concept of a drawing card, since the three Mania shows Johnson came back for were the three biggest grossing events of all-time because of that fact. I really don't think Batista will make anywhere close to the same difference this year that Johnson made the last three years, not that he may not help. The subject of Bryan came up and he said that Bryan gets the biggest crowd reactions at the shows, but he doesn't know if it's Bryan that is popular or the most popular wrestler, or that people just like screaming "Yes, Yes, Yes." An interesting note is a few days later at a Q&A at a comic con he did, he said he thought this was Bryan's year and he'd like to see Bryan in the main event at Mania instead of Batista, said Batista was his friend, he's glad he was back. He said he had no problem with Batista in the main event because he's back full-time. He said his belief Bryan should be in the main event was meant as no slight toward Batista. It's a weird deal because things are self fulfilling in many ways. The Bryan & Punk shows haven't done the kind of business the Cena & Orton shows do, and that would indicate the "Yes" chants aren't selling tickets like Cena, but the biggest draw in most cases is going to be the guy pushed as the biggest star. He said he was happy for Bryan because he knew where he came from. Helwani asked about Bryan stealing the chant from Diego Sanchez but never acknowledging it (Bryan has acknowledged it in a few interviews I've heard) and Punk said something about how today people know while in the past people didn't know Superstar Billy Graham stole everything from Muhammad Ali and that Ali stole from Gorgeous George. Graham did take a lot from Ali, but tailored it for his own thing and created a lot of new stuff. Dusty Rhodes took a ton from Graham, as he was in the AWA with Dick Murdoch when Graham was in his AWA heyday, and then used the same interviews when he went to Florida as a heel after the AWA, but also tailored it and created his own stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stomperspc Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 I don't actually think this would happen, but New Japan has to know they're probably getting decent iPPV buys from the US based on their coverage in the country. So, why not make a Godfather offer ($500k or $1 million for one match) to him for a Tokyo Dome match versus Tanahashi or Okada? According to the latest Observer, international (meaning non Japan) iPPV buys are topping out at around 1,500. That's not only the U.S., but Europe and everywhere else too. They are doing about 100,000 total worldwide for the biggest shows, which is great obviously, but 99.9% of it is coming from Japan. New Japan has grown exponentially in Japan since 2011, no doubt, but the growth abroad is still tiny and really just the hardest of the hardcore. Agreed. However, if New Japan is serious about running the US sometime in the next couple of years as they have indicated having Punk as the US headliner on those cards would be their best bet to not have it end in disaster. There is a good chance that the talk of running the US soon is all bluster, of course. If they are determined to do so, getting their feet wet by running a smallish, well-promoted tour with few shows headlined by Punk in places like Chicago and New York would seemingly give them their best chance at making such a risk worthwhile. There are a lot of question marks in that statement, but the point is it is probably not ridiculous to think that New Japan might reach out to Punk because they see the potential for him to help them in the US market. Whether that is prudent or not is another subject altogether. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steenalized Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Far-fetched idea time. Punk purchases Ring of Honor from Sinclair. Relocates the promotion to Chicago. Only runs Chicago. Becomes the Jerry Lawler of Chicago. ... This is my dream. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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