NXT TakeOver Toronto/WWE Survivor Series Weekend

[victory]

WTF. The only match I really wanted to see and it was a 45 second squash. I stopped my wife and kids from watching the Walking Dead for this. Well that will never happen again.

[Parties]

I'll take "Goldberg's Shoulder Was More Severely Injured Than Reported" with a dash of "Delayed Punishment for Lesnar's Bad PED Press".

 

I'm more interested in talking about what a HHH-style finish that was to RAW vs. SD. Heel Orton/Motorhead Guitarist give Smackdown its meaningless, bi-annual token win. Roman blows it again. Seth and Dean get to look cool even in defeat.

[Grimmas]

Loved the main event!!! Goldberg!!

[Coffey]

WTF. The only match I really wanted to see and it was a 45 second squash. I stopped my wife and kids from watching the Walking Dead for this. Well that will never happen again.

 

You got to see it. Goldberg won.

[El Dragon]

Some minor credit on the booking: How do you follow a 1 hour long slog? Catch them off guard with a 90 second squash.

[Childs]

Loved the main event!!! Goldberg!!

Bless your positive outlook. I would have been furious if I'd bought a ticket for that show.

[KawadaSmile]

So does that mean that any chance of putting some active talent over strong by beating Brock is gone now? I mean, his main characteristic, that he was this unbeatable monster is pretty much gone now that he lost to a guy who hasn't wrestled in 12 years, in under two minutes.

[Grimmas]

 

Loved the main event!!! Goldberg!!

Bless your positive outlook. I would have been furious if I'd bought a ticket for that show.

It was a birthday present plus I am a Goldberg mark.

[hammerva]

So does that mean that any chance of putting some active talent over strong by beating Brock is gone now?

 

Brock putting over some active talent. Excuse me

 

Unless by active talent you mean Cena, the Rock, or Triple H

[KawadaSmile]

Brock putting over some active talent. Excuse me

 

Unless by active talent you mean Cena, the Rock, or Triple H

Gotta keep that optimism going strong, brother.

 

I mean, wasn't he originally supposed to lose to Reigns at WM31?

[hammerva]

I guess you can say Reigns was put over by Brock by putting him in a pinning position after getting the crap beat out of him. But that is the only one I can think of

 

The latest theory is that the plan for the finish changed once Shane got injured in the Survivor Series match. While it sounds completely stupid there was talk about Shane vs Brock

[Microstatistics]

It's hilarious they gave the men's Raw vs. Smackdown match 50+ minutes. 80s New Japan Elimination matches didn't go that long.

 

So Lesnar ends the streak, destroys ace Cena and is generally unbeatable but gets squashed by a 50 year old guy who hasn't wrestled in 12 years? Hmmm.

[Grimmas]

People shiting on the crowd, well they were perfect for the main!

[BrianB]

It's hilarious they gave the men's Raw vs. Smackdown match 50+ minutes. 80s New Japan Elimination matches didn't go that long.

 

So Lesnar ends the streak, destroys ace Cena and is generally unbeatable but gets squashed by a 50 year old guy who hasn't wrestled in 12 years? Hmmm.

 

He got beaten by a 50 year old Taker at SummerSlam last year too.

 

I'm not sure what to make of this ppv, but I wouldn't call that finish a disaster or anything.

[Hegs]

I'm in the completely turned off camp. If you're going to put Brock over by ending Undertaker's streak, don't have him squashed by another guy who could care less about wrestling or the fans. He did this solely as a vanity match so his wife and son could see him "beat" an NCAA and UFC champ plus a huge payday. Great way to tell the fans all the guys you see every week suck and a guy with a 2 year career who hasn't stepped foot in a ring in 12 years can beat the part time monster who was beating everyone in the company in 90 seconds. If they're setting up a Wrestlemania rematch, I for one am not interested.

[stro]

Great show. Everything but the cruiser match was a lot of fun. Goldberg returning to squash Brock might be the moment of the year. WCW finally won the Monday Night War.

 

 

[BrianB]

WWE worked me into a Dean Ambrose heel turn. If he gets a program vs. Taker...that might be very interesting.

 

 

I'll put an early call in for this being the worst Survivor Series of all time.

 

For a professor, you've been a hot take machine lately. This show reminded me of wrestlemania this year in terms of moments, omg maggle factor x500 and booking and match layout questionableness...but 1994 survivor series was the shits. 2013 was really bad too...orton vs. big blows. 1997 is a historically important show, but it's a dire abortion. 1998 is okay from a story/big picture pov but it's a really boring show and still has some storyline holes if you've paid attention to the TV (e.g. Shane joining Vince.)

 

Generally, I'd say the match quality was good. I'm not as high on the women's and tag team survivor matches as everyone else, but they weren't terrible and most of the rest was solid, if strange.

[Hawkeye12]

Count me as a fan of Goldberg winning, and if he was going to win anyway booking it like prime 1998 Goldberg with a personal chip on his shoulder over Heyman mocking his family was an awesomely explosive way to do it! And I do think this was Brock's punishment for embarrassing the company by failing the drug test in UFC. But it was fun to mark out again, if even for two minutes. No chance for the crowd to turn on Bill, no chance to blow any real spots, and a satisfying conclusion where the good guy beats the villain.

[stro]

No idea how someone could think this was the worst or even in the bottom 10 SS. This show had more story telling and character moments/development than any WWE show in ages. Felt like more like an 80s SS show than any in at least 10 years.

 

People really getting mad about Brock getting squash because of "the streak". Taker got his win back. Whatever momentum came from the streak was gone the very next month after Summerslam 2014 when Brock went from completely demolishing Cena to having a competitive match where he would have lost had Seth not caused a DQ. And by the time they got to WM with Roman, that was the time to pull the trigger, but they didn't, so the streak hasn't meant dick since then. Goldberg squashing him was perfect.

[KawadaSmile]

This show reminded me of wrestlemania this year in terms of moments, omg maggle factor x500 and booking and match layout questionableness...

I was actually thinking about the same thing. I recall WM32 being called one of the worst of all time by some, when in fact it was much more strange than it was bad. This Survivor Series also falls in the same category. Besides 70% of that main SS match, I can't really say there were BAD matches. Weird, oddly-booked matches, but not bad.

 

I mean, there were good showings for some newcomers like American Alpha, Alexa Bliss and Nia Jax, Strowman also is slowly getting more and more reactions.

 

 

Also, is Kevin Owens one of the worst champions ever?

[hammerva]

Yeah anyone who thinks this is the worst Survivor Series ever didn't have to suffer through 1994 - 1998 although 1996 was really good

 

Please Kevin Owens can lose a hundred times in a row and would still be a better champ than Jack Swagger, Dolph Ziggler, or Rey Mysterio Jr. Hell he is a better champion than the New Day right now

[pol]

I'll definitely never forget that main event. Loved it as a moment. Booking-wise it may have been incredibly stupid, but judging a moment according to meta-concerns seems rather ass-backwards and joyless to me.

[BrianB]

Yeah anyone who thinks this is the worst Survivor Series ever didn't have to suffer through 1994 - 1998 although 1996 was really good

 

1995 was even better.

[Parties]

So does that mean that any chance of putting some active talent over strong by beating Brock is gone now? I mean, his main characteristic, that he was this unbeatable monster is pretty much gone now that he lost to a guy who hasn't wrestled in 12 years, in under two minutes.

 

In terms of other even semi-realistic guys who could have gotten the rub from doing that to Brock:

 

Big Cass - They’re not ready to pull the trigger on him, and he isn’t a good enough worker or over enough act yet from what I’ve seen.

Big E - Wishful thinking on my part: the odds of him ever even getting a strong singles run are less than 50/50 at this point.

Strowman – Probably the most likely candidate of all the current generation guys to get this type of rub from Vince, but he's too lumbering in his style to beat Brock like that.

Cesaro/Rusev/Sheamus – Fantasy booking of damaged midcarders at this point.

Reigns – Most deserving option: ridiculous that they never really rematched Mania 31, but smarks would hate Reigns going over in three moves.

Jason Jordan – Not for another 2 years, if ever, by which point Dominant Brock would be even more tiresome than he is now.

Cena – Probably Brock’s all-time best opponent, but it’d be meaningless now.

Wyatt – I’d like it, but no fans would buy him squashing Lesnar that fast, and I'd rather see them have a real match.

Undertaker – Done to death, awful matches, no one needs the rub less.

 

This is what happens when you push one new guy every 3-5 years.

[AlmostNinjaLike]

The hatred of Roman is somehow reaching even more irrational peaks.