WWE TV 04/22 - 04/26: Institutionalized Insanity

[sek69]

29 minutes ago, C.S. said:

They're idiots, but at the same time, I don't understand the strategy of posting about a release before it's signed, sealed, and delivered. That obviously doesn't work. 

It did for Ty DIllinger. Dustin Rhodes didn't get his deal frozen despite being out when he got his knee surgeries. I can see why Luke thought if he asked professionally they would let him go since they were doing nothing with him. The irony is they see enough value in him to realize he has the potential to be a star elsewhere, but apparently not enough value to actually do something.

[Mad Dog]

3 minutes ago, sek69 said:

It did for Ty DIllinger. Dustin Rhodes didn't get his deal frozen despite being out when he got his knee surgeries. I can see why Luke thought if he asked professionally they would let him go since they were doing nothing with him. The irony is they see enough value in him to realize he has the potential to be a star elsewhere, but apparently not enough value to actually do something.

It's what I hate about current WWE. They just sign guys so no one else can have them, not because they have any desire to use them.

[SirEdger]

8 hours ago, El-P said:

Just watch iMPACT, people. It's fun.

Their booking is actually the opposite of WWE right now. Everything happens for a reason, good or bad. The Rich Swann/Sami Callihan stuff is pretty fun, even moreso since they added Madman Fulton to oVe.

[Loss]

10 minutes ago, Mad Dog said:

It's what I hate about current WWE. They just sign guys so no one else can have them, not because they have any desire to use them.

Trustbusting would be great for pro wrestling. A shame it will never happen.

[fakeplastictrees]

That's interesting. I wonder how trustbusting would work in pro wrestling (in this case more specifically with WWE). The recent NXT signings and the entire existence of NXT UK, outside of the presence of a few people, is proof of WWE hoarding talent.

[sek69]

It's the perfect scheme. Something like trustbusting would require someone in government to give a shit, and even if there were such a person it would be a non starter when the owner of the company is BFFs with the President. 

I would think something like the Luke Harper situation would be ripe for legal action since it seems pretty easy to show how he's being handled differently (not to mention how the whole freezing an injured persons contract bullshit), but that would mean he would have to risk burning bridges he may not want to. 

[NintendoLogic]

The main sticking point for a lawsuit would be in proving actual harm. I don't know how many courts would buy that Harper was being harmed by being paid to sit at home and do nothing.

[sek69]

If he could prove he could make more money working elsewhere, but is being held hostage by bullshit contract language that would probably do it. 

[Herodes]

WWE Superstars should be crazy larger than life coked up sociopaths who you can’t imagine living in normal society. There’s too much content of these geeks crying, talking about how much this moment means to them, tweeting....even in the context of their tv show they have supposed heels shown in charity propaganda spots or reality show previews out of character. Kofi, Kevin Owens, Seth, AJ Styles, Becky, Johnny Gargano...how can any kid look at these geeks with a sense of wonder compared to Hogan, Savage, Warrior, Piper, Andre etc

[WingedEagle]

6 hours ago, Mad Dog said:

It's what I hate about current WWE. They just sign guys so no one else can have them, not because they have any desire to use them.

Its a definite buzzkill for fans, but no one's holding a gun to wrestlers' heads.  Every contract has two signatures on it.  

[sek69]

But the company can release them at any time they want. The wrestlers don't have that option, so let's not pretend it's a balanced situation.  Plus there has to be some good faith on both sides. I don't expect many folks are signing their contracts thinking "man, I hope they pay me my downside while I sit in catering doing jack shit". 

When you have a de facto monopoly in an industry putting guys on ice just to keep them away from a potential competitor that hasn't even run a second show yet....that's some shit that wouldn't fly even in our current landscape if it was any other profession other than that dumb rasslin' stuff.

[Johnny Sorrow]

As far as the stocks thing goes, once the FOX money comes in, the stocks will leap up. And so will viewership, which will lead to more interest in WWE. Vince getting a show on one of the big four networks is the long con. I know we're in the age of streaming, but don't ever think that there's not a ton of folks who still watch TV the old fashioned way. And being on FOX also means that people who can't afford anything but the modern version of "rabbit ears" to watch TV for free are gonna get Smackdown as one of a limited amount of choices to watch on the night it airs. And people will watch. 

[El-P]

You just don't create fans out of thin air with a shitty product because you're on a big TV station. The actual WWE fans have been slowly but surely leaving in droves. Sure, the FOX deal will get a bump at first, but the same cold product won't get magically hot and keep new people around when it can't even maintain its attractiveness toward its core audience. 

6 hours ago, sek69 said:

But the company can release them at any time they want. The wrestlers don't have that option, so let's not pretend it's a balanced situation.

Come on, they are independant contractors.

[Robert S]

Looking at the stock progression in the last 1.5 years, I doubt that the stock will jump back up. I am not a stock guy at all, but if a stock that fluctuated between 10 $ and 20 $ for almost two decades suddenly jumps up to 100 $, that cries out "overrated". I would not be surprised if a lot of people realize that the peak has been reached and that now it is time to cash-in.

[SomethingSavage]

10 hours ago, Herodes said:

WWE Superstars should be crazy larger than life coked up sociopaths who you can’t imagine living in normal society. There’s too much content of these geeks crying, talking about how much this moment means to them, tweeting....even in the context of their tv show they have supposed heels shown in charity propaganda spots or reality show previews out of character. Kofi, Kevin Owens, Seth, AJ Styles, Becky, Johnny Gargano...how can any kid look at these geeks with a sense of wonder compared to Hogan, Savage, Warrior, Piper, Andre etc

THIS.

It's a huge character flaw that seems to come built-in to everybody they present & promote now.

The curtain call shit after every big match is the epitome of melodramatic horseshit. It's something they've attempted to use too often - to the point where it rings hollow & never really triggers the sort of emotion they're aiming for.

I liked it much better when the patting on the back, the congratulating, and the thanking each other all happened behind the scenes - NOT upfront and out on television. NOT as part of the actual onscreen presentation. NOT immediately after a blood feud or grudge match. NOT on social media.

This phony, obnoxious, self-appreciative way of doing pro wrestling is so groan-inducing and downright cringe-worthy at times. I can't speak for anyone else, and I'm perfectly okay with being an outlier on a lot of these things. But I personally cannot wait for the Gratitude Era to end and become one of those relics they jokingly refer to & act embarrassed about ever presenting.

[Mad Dog]

19 minutes ago, SomethingSavage said:

THIS.

It's a huge character flaw that seems to come built-in to everybody they present & promote now.

The curtain call shit after every big match is the epitome of melodramatic horseshit. It's something they've attempted to use too often - to the point where it rings hollow & never really triggers the sort of emotion they're aiming for.

I liked it much better when the patting on the back, the congratulating, and the thanking each other all happened behind the scenes - NOT upfront and out on television. NOT as part of the actual onscreen presentation. NOT immediately after a blood feud or grudge match. NOT on social media.

This phony, obnoxious, self-appreciative way of doing pro wrestling is so groan-inducing and downright cringe-worthy at times. I can't speak for anyone else, and I'm perfectly okay with being an outlier on a lot of these things. But I personally cannot wait for the Gratitude Era to end and become one of those relics they jokingly refer to & act embarrassed about ever presenting.

This bugs me too. I was talking about this with someone after a match recently. I said "if that was Randy Savage, he would have done that and then sucker punched them".

[SteveJRogers]

On 4/25/2019 at 7:44 PM, Mad Dog said:

That's also a huge problem with WWE TV that doesn't get talked about enough. No one talks like a fucking human being anymore and I think it turns a lot of people off.

The one thing though is, even with the all-time great promo guys, did anyone really talk like actual people, not on some influence or trying to redirect the listener (see Casey Stengel for a non-wrestler example), would?

A podcast covering a Raw episode after SummerSlam 1997 was discussing a segment where Austin was doing a very proto version of his WHAT!? style of comedic promo during a Jim Ross sit-down. One of the hosts said he hated it because no one would act the way Austin was IRL.  And this was STONE COLD STEVE AUSTIN he was talking about, doing one of the things that made the character so iconic.  Especially considering he was trying to be entertaining while having to be on the injury shelf for a while.

[KB8]

I'd say the difference there is that, even if Austin and the rest of those wrestlers in 1997, or Hogan and the rest in 1984, never talked like actual people (and they didn't, because they were larger than life superstars and whatnot), they all felt like individuals. No sane person on the street would act like Steve Austin or walk into a Starbucks and order a caramel latte in the third person like the Rock. Those guys were far from "regular" people, but I'd say the bigger problem today is that, even if a wrestler doesn't talk like a normal human being, they all talk like the SAME not-a-normal-human-being.

It's not just that one of them talks about the "WWE Universe" rather than "fans." It's that they all fucking say it. You can't help but remember you're watching something that's micromanaged to ridiculous degrees. And everything being so clearly scripted doesn't help either, because nothing feels organic and most of those folks aren't very good at making that script-writing come across as something they'd actually say. 

[Mad Dog]

I think the sameness is a big part of it. I also think the announcers partaking and pushing the lingo so much hurts as well. 

[Coffey]

16 hours ago, Herodes said:

WWE Superstars should be crazy larger than life coked up sociopaths who you can’t imagine living in normal society. There’s too much content of these geeks crying, talking about how much this moment means to them, tweeting....even in the context of their tv show they have supposed heels shown in charity propaganda spots or reality show previews out of character. 

I have thoughts like this all the time. Not just due to the constant breaking of kayfabe but as much as a lot of various internet corners want to pretend that size doesn't matter, it absolutely does. Look matters in pro-wrestling. It always has, it always will. Going from Hogan Vs. Andre when I was kid to Kofi Vs. Owens when I'm an adult is... man. 

No one seems to have a gimmick anymore either. It's a bunch of First Name / Last Name individuals, sorry, SUPERSTARS, that just "want to have fun" (as Michael Cole would say) or some bullshit "chasing their childhood dream!" angle. 

Superstar Billy Graham said shit about Kofi recently, which Booker T. stuck up for Kofi. Now, I don't think we should be in the era of steroids & everyone looking like the Warlord still, but I get Graham's point. It's hard to get behind a guy that's 5'8" & 200 lbs, especially when they're supposed to be the top guy. 

The size doesn't matter, let's focus on workrate & giving star ratings to matches shit is exactly why wrestling is in the situation it's in right now. Wrestlers should not look like everyday people you could run into during your daily life.

[Herodes]

Here’s supposedly nasty heel Nia Jax...and now here in the same show here she is tearing up at a visit to an MLk museum...and now let’s cut to a scene in Game of Thrones where the Ice King pals around with Jon Snow at a fucking puppy rescue center. I never gave a fuck about Macho Kings childhood dream or Earthquake palling around with anyone backstage or who Rick Rudes inspiration was when growing up as a young boy because it didn’t matter and they were other worldly lunatics existing in their own insane universe as it should be

[C.S.]

The "childhood dream" approach works in small doses when presented with the right character - Shawn Michaels, Mick Foley, etc.

It does not work for everyone, should not be used for everyone, and ceases being special when that becomes everyone's storyline. 

 

[C.S.]

Not sure if this means anything at this point...

It's from a local TV ad, and aren't those usually produced way ahead of time?

 

[sek69]

Those are usually sent in advance, so most likely that was a planned match. 

[chapstarfall]

On 4/26/2019 at 5:39 AM, El-P said:

It's unbearable. "He throws Roman into the WWE Universe !". What the fuck. They all talk like corporate drones. The storyline is about corporate drones either "fighting" the bosses or getting their due of being in the WWE Universe for ever. They are no pro-wrestling superstars. They are no super-heroes. They are drones. Who the fuck wants to see a bunch of drones fight to get recognize as the best drone ?

But again, we're into the Brand Era, and that's not just a pro-wrestling thing. It's an übercapitalism thing. They want people to be their own "brand" and be brainless drones, while the insane amount of money the big companies make have no relation whatsoever with what they are *actually* producing (if they produce anything, that is). The WWE is a reflection of that.

For Wrestlemania, I decided to get the wwe network subscription. I had not been watching new wrestling (just reading on here and other sites) and started watching NXT, NXT UK, etc. What really stands out is how bad the terms are. "WWE Universe" sounds bad no matter what type of sentence uttered. 

On 205, one of the announcers (I couldn't tell which one) said "Drew Gulak is a thinking man's entertainer." When you hear sentences like that it really takes you out of the program. 

I don't know if any announcer that I heard is good because they all sound alike.