AEW Dynamite Week 6 - 11/06/19

[Alucard]

Fantastic job selling the PPV on this episode. Cody promo was the best, really looking forward to him and Jericho.

[SirEdger]

Realistically, do you guys feel like whatever way they go in the main event between Cody and Chris Jericho, that it will be a generally accepted decision? That's the way I personally see it because 1) Chris Jericho is technically their biggest name and draw on the roster and he's doing great as champ so far and 2) Cody is so over right now at the moment - perhaps the most over babyface in pro wrestling? - and it would feel logical to put the title on him right now while building the man who'll take the title from him.

With that said, what I'm really looking forward to is to know the identity of the 3 judges at ringside for the match. I'm hoping for a bit of a throwback to Wrestlewar 89 that lead us to Flair vs Funk.

[Slasher]

Maybe the tiebreaking judge would be MJF who gives it to Jericho, acting like he's being all fair and impartial, but revealing later on in the build up for the Match Beyond to be in the pocket of Jericho?

[MoS]

Reading the Observer, the Dark Order match lost a lot of viewers. It's a bad gimmick that needs to go away. 

[SirEdger]

12 minutes ago, Slasher said:

Maybe the tiebreaking judge would be MJF who gives it to Jericho, acting like he's being all fair and impartial, but revealing later on in the build up for the Match Beyond to be in the pocket of Jericho?

That'd be interesting if Jericho played the card of protesting MJF's nomination, considering he's close friends with Cody. Would make the turn even more shocking in kayfabe.

[Slasher]

That's the thing, I don't feel like MJF ever turned babyface or is really a babyface. His interactions with the crowd is as a heel. So if anything, he is only re-affirming his position as a heel. He could be like "What? You thought I'd turn down the money? I'm not a loser like y'all!"

[El-P]

Well, actual, legit Money Promo don't happen often. This was one of them.

And that Jericho video, my god. VIRGIL ! The random old lady from church swearing. Hager saying zilch. 

Also, that Brandi/Kong vignette. I'm gonna love that. I love it already, as it seems it's gonna emphasize each of their strenghts (Brandi : promo / Kong : murder).

Speaking of the women's division : Riho is OVER. Emi Sakura as a short, fatty 40 years old japanese woman thinking she's Freddy Mercury is awesome. Also : my girl Shanna killed it again, she's a worker, she shows tons of explosiveness and has actual charisma (she got a "this is awesome" chant, well deserved too). Add to that Hayter who's also adds some wild brawling quality to the whole thing, this women's division look much better all of a sudden.

Cool to see they are listening : Dark Order is not over, let's have them have good matches (because they are very good workers) to put other people over. Britt Baker isn't quite ready yet and not getting over much, let's push her match back on the pre-show and feature other women that have got over in the last two weeks on Dynamite (Shanna) and Dark (Hayter). 

Pac is OVER. And he's a terrific worker. Can't get enough of the Bastard.

Hangman is getting over. "Cowboy shit" is my new favourite chant. People just lack patience, and it's a product of 18 years of WWE monopoly to me. It has fucked people's mind. 

Guevarra vloging on his way to the ring was brillant, as nothing screams more "millenial dickhead" than a wrestler watching at his fucking smartphone on his way to the ring. Now he needs to refer as every older guy as "boomers".

On the "not working" side, Shawn Spears is a solid worker, but he's not getting over and his character seems to attached to an angle and a feud that he quickly lost. Much like Tully was a great idea for that feud, but it doesn't really make sense now and seems like kind of a waste. Also, they have done a great job not referencing WWE in any positive way, so Spears needs to stop doing that 10 sign. I would hope Janela wins that one, although he's a guy who really doesn't need to win matches to get over.

The ending brawl was so WCW Nitro at its most insane.

Yeah, Dynamite is the best weekly TV show in 22 years. There, I've said it.

[El-P]

On 11/7/2019 at 10:42 AM, MoS said:

It's nice and fun to fanboy all over wrestling again.

This. I have loved the first 3 seasons of Lucha Underground and IMPACT has been my little secret love this last year and a half, but with AEW I feel I'm going back to the RAW/Nitro era of 96/97 as far as just being a fan, with the advantage of 22 years of watching and learning and evolving, so it feels like the most fun I've ever had watching weekly pro-wrestling, honestly.

[War is Raw]

13 hours ago, MoS said:

Reading the Observer, the Dark Order match lost a lot of viewers. It's a bad gimmick that needs to go away. 

I read it too. Said Dark Order vs Private Party lost viewers at first but then gained on the same segment as Jericho's video. Brandi's vid + Brandon Cutler vs. Shawn Spears killed the viewers.

[War is Raw]

1 hour ago, El-P said:

Yeah, Dynamite is the best weekly TV show in 22 years. There, I've said it.

I stand with you and your episode thoughts.

[MoS]

31 minutes ago, War is Raw said:

I read it too. Said Dark Order vs Private Party lost viewers at first but then gained on the same segment as Jericho's video. Brandi's vid + Brandon Cutler vs. Shawn Spears killed the viewers.

Maybe I misread it, but the next quarter featuring the end of that match and Jericho's video gained the viewers? I do not know how ratings are exactly calculated per quarter, but I assumed Jericho's vid brought some viewers back, although not close to as much as the previous segment lost. 

[War is Raw]

1 hour ago, MoS said:

Maybe I misread it, but the next quarter featuring the end of that match and Jericho's video gained the viewers? I do not know how ratings are exactly calculated per quarter, but I assumed Jericho's vid brought some viewers back, although not close to as much as the previous segment lost. 

Correct:

Pac vs. Trent 976,000

Beginning of Private Party vs. Dark Order 809,000 

Ending of the Private Party vs. Dark Order match/Chris Jericho video 827,000

It's just that Dave values bringing viewers back. So I considered their end segment a "gain", even if it was a total loss from the opener. This because Dave gives mad props for gains even if total number never matches the opening or previous segment. In this case, he ignored them for any gains because of Jericho's vid and they got tagged with the total loss

Ultimately, the show lost viewers all night, but some segments got people back, like Moxley/Omega video, the main event, and brawl. None of them got the show back to the opening. So Dave gives "credit" to any growth as a "draw". So that is why I put over the end of Dark Order vs PP, but I see how that can be off base and apologize if I am. After all, even if you give them end credit, the match lost 132,000 viewers. Brandi/Cutler/Shawn lost 99,000.

But there is this tibit too:

"In Men 35-49, the Cody segment was the strongest, but also showing growth were Private Party vs. Dark Order and the main event."

[goodhelmet]

On 11/7/2019 at 7:37 PM, SirEdger said:

Realistically, do you guys feel like whatever way they go in the main event between Cody and Chris Jericho, that it will be a generally accepted decision? That's the way I personally see it because 1) Chris Jericho is technically their biggest name and draw on the roster and he's doing great as champ so far and 2) Cody is so over right now at the moment - perhaps the most over babyface in pro wrestling? - and it would feel logical to put the title on him right now while building the man who'll take the title from him.

With that said, what I'm really looking forward to is to know the identity of the 3 judges at ringside for the match. I'm hoping for a bit of a throwback to Wrestlewar 89 that lead us to Flair vs Funk.

 Loss and I have been having this debate on messenger. He thinks Jericho should retain. I am all for Cody taking the belt and running with it. 

[C.S.]

AEW rankings

AEW Women's Division Top 5 for the Week of November 8, 2019
1. Emi Sakura (Singles: 1-0, Overall: 2-2)
2. Britt Baker (Singles: 2-1, Overall: 4-2)
3. Hikaru Shida (Singles 2-1, Overall: 3-1)
4. Allie (Singles: 1-2, Overall: 3-2)
5. Nyla Rose (Singles: 1-3, Overall: 2-3)

AEW Men's Division Top 5 for the Week of November 8, 2019
1. Cody Rhodes (Singles: 3-0-1, Trios: 0-0, Overall: 4-1-1)
2. PAC (Singles: 3-0-1, Trios: 0-0, Overall: 3-1-1)
3. "Hangman" Adam Page (Singles: 3-2, Trios: 0-0, Overall: 4-4)
4. Kenny Omega (Singles 2-2, Trios: 2-1, Overall: 5-4)
5. Jon Moxley (Singes: 1-0-1, Trios: 0-0, Overall: 1-1-1)

AEW Tag Team Division Top 5 for the Week of November 8, 2019
1. The Lucha Bros
Pentagon Jr. (Tag Team: 4-2, Overall: 5-3)
Fenix (Tag Team: 4-2, Overall: 5-3)

2. Private Party
Isiah Kassidy (Tag Team: 3-2, Overall: 3-4)
Marq Quen (Tag Team: 3-2, Overall: 3-4)

3. The Young Bucks
Matt Jackson (Tag Team: 3-2, Overall: 6-3)
Nick Jackson (Tag Team: 3-2, Overall: 6-3)

4. The Dark Order
Stu Grayson (Tag Team: 2-2, Overall: 3-2)
Evil Uno (Tag Team: 2-2, Overall: 3-2)

5. The Best Friends
Trent (Tag Team: 2-3, Overall: 3-5)
Chuck Taylor (Tag Team: 2-3, Overall: 3-4)

https://www.wrestlinginc.com/news/2019/11/aew-releases-first-sets-of-weekly-rankings-for-men-661939/

[MoS]

8 hours ago, War is Raw said:

Correct:

Pac vs. Trent 976,000

Beginning of Private Party vs. Dark Order 809,000 

Ending of the Private Party vs. Dark Order match/Chris Jericho video 827,000

It's just that Dave values bringing viewers back. So I considered their end segment a "gain", even if it was a total loss from the opener. This because Dave gives mad props for gains even if total number never matches the opening or previous segment. In this case, he ignored them for any gains because of Jericho's vid and they got tagged with the total loss

Ultimately, the show lost viewers all night, but some segments got people back, like Moxley/Omega video, the main event, and brawl. None of them got the show back to the opening. So Dave gives "credit" to any growth as a "draw". So that is why I put over the end of Dark Order vs PP, but I see how that can be off base and apologize if I am. After all, even if you give them end credit, the match lost 132,000 viewers. Brandi/Cutler/Shawn lost 99,000.

But there is this tibit too:

"In Men 35-49, the Cody segment was the strongest, but also showing growth were Private Party vs. Dark Order and the main event."

Got it. Brandi's promo losing viewers is fine according to me because promos and segments are essential for long-term development of characters, even if in the short term it leads to ratings losses. However, Shawn Spears is not working. I agree with El-P's point about how his feud with Cody and Tully getting involved made sense in that particular context, but in general that gimmick and pairing is perhaps not working. Not sure how interesting the Janela feud will be but trying to take out his tongue on AEW Dark was a bit too much for me. Perhaps a feud with Darby Allin where he is used to put over someone with potential is the best use of him. 

[Slasher]

43 minutes ago, goodhelmet said:

 Loss and I have been having this debate on messenger. He thinks Jericho should retain. I am all for Cody taking the belt and running with it. 

I realize I'm not part of that conversation but I agree Jericho should retain. As mismatched as the members in the group seems, they need to keep Inner Circle somewhat strong for a while longer. Only way that works is if the leader is the champion or is in the lead position in the company. Cody is hot right now for sure, and normally I'd capitalize on that, but the timing is all wrong IMO. I also cannot imagine them introducing the concept of judges just so the babyface could win here. I see the judges as either a catalyst for something major to happen to cost Cody (like MJF "turning" or some other shenanigans) or to lead to a disputed result, which doesn't favor a babyface. Either way, they would do it in a way that nobody would hold it against Cody to challenge again down the road when things have run the course with Jericho on top.

[Ricky Jackson]

Cody's hot and cut a killer promo like his daddy. Also like his daddy, I think most of the time he should chase the title and work blood feuds. I suppose the WK match Jericho has coming up may precipitate a title switch soonish, but they can likely milk it for a bit longer. 

[WingedEagle]

10 hours ago, goodhelmet said:

 Loss and I have been having this debate on messenger. He thinks Jericho should retain. I am all for Cody taking the belt and running with it. 

Why do you want it moved to Cody at this point?

[gordi]

I can't speak for goodhelmet, but I can easily see why it might be a good idea to have the hottest, most over babyface in the company win the championship at the PPV. Have we been so bamboozled by years and years of WWE not doing that, that 'striking while the iron is hot' now seems odd to us? 

 

Edit: That being said, I can also understand the arguments for keeping it on Jericho. It could legitimately go either way. That's a good thing. 

[NintendoLogic]

I dislike long heel title reigns as a general rule, but there seems to be a dearth of strong heel challengers if Cody wins the belt. I think the solution might be to make Tully Blanchard Cody's primary antagonist and have him manage a revolving door of challengers. A Horseman trying to take out a Rhodes? The storyline practically writes itself.

[WingedEagle]

5 hours ago, gordi said:

I can't speak for goodhelmet, but I can easily see why it might be a good idea to have the hottest, most over babyface in the company win the championship at the PPV. Have we been so bamboozled by years and years of WWE not doing that, that 'striking while the iron is hot' now seems odd to us? 

 

Edit: That being said, I can also understand the arguments for keeping it on Jericho. It could legitimately go either way. That's a good thing. 

This has nothing to do with WWE and everything to do with said iron currently heating up rather than being hot.  I think they can deliver a much better build to Cody winning the title that hopefully builds TV and PPVs along the way.  Promising to never challenge for the title again after the match was essentially announced cold following the last PPV?  That strikes me as skipping a few steps along the way.  If Cody wins the title tonight it should still be a great moment and might very well set up an awesome title reign.  He's far and away the biggest star in the promotion so having the title on him is certainly not a bad thing.  It just feels a bit rushed given the setup an options on the table for both (a) a longer Jericho run to establish the title and (b) Cody's path to winning it.  

[TheDuke]

Didn't Hogan originally win the title after like only a month of build up? I dont think not having a lot of build up necessarily corresponds with not having a successful  title  reign.

[sek69]

1 minute ago, TheDuke said:

Didn't Hogan originally win the title after like only a month of build up? I dont think not having a lot of build up necessarily corresponds with not having a successful  title  reign.

Yeah, but Hulk was already a big name thanks to being in Rocky III (WWE revisionist history makes people forget that happened before he came back to the WWF). 

[FMKK]

2 hours ago, NintendoLogic said:

I dislike long heel title reigns as a general rule, but there seems to be a dearth of strong heel challengers if Cody wins the belt. I think the solution might be to make Tully Blanchard Cody's primary antagonist and have him manage a revolving door of challengers. A Horseman trying to take out a Rhodes? The storyline practically writes itself.

You can run a Jericho rematch, you can do PAC, I think Hangman is going to turn soon (maybe he can go with Tully) and MJF is obviously going to turn down the line as well. Babyface vs babyface with Omega or Moxley can work as well. There are definitely feuds to be had. But ultimately, I think if Cody wins the belt now, it'll go back to Jericho in like January.

[FMKK]

 

What an idiot