AEW TV 1/4 and 1/6 - The One Where Danielson Wrestles Nese

[KinchStalker]

On transit to BOTB now. It's my first wrestling show since a 2006 Smackdown taping, so as far as I'm concerned, I have the right to cut a little loose.

[C.S.]

10 hours ago, KawadaSmile said:

Dynamite is not doing great ratings. At this point I wonder what the fuck does the fanbase even want.

Was JAS/BCC the key to it all?

CM Punk - unquestionably their biggest star and draw, and by far their most interesting character by miles - is no longer there.

MJF was gone for months, and when he finally did return, everyone had moved on and something was missing.

Bryan Danielson has been used like "just another guy" for so long that beating MJF would be considered a major shocker and upset.

JAS vs. BCC never ended.

Elite vs. Death Triangle is "too much of a good thing," so to speak, and not really what anyone wants to see.

Eddie Kingdom has been forgotten and discarded. Repeat this sentence 20-30 more times with your favorite wrestler(s).

I could go on and on, but you get the point.

[Jmare007]

Yeah, where the hell is Eddie?

[Embrodak]

2 hours ago, C.S. said:

CM Punk - unquestionably their biggest star and draw, and by far their most interesting character by miles - is no longer there.

MJF was gone for months, and when he finally did return, everyone had moved on and something was missing.

Bryan Danielson has been used like "just another guy" for so long that beating MJF would be considered a major shocker and upset.

JAS vs. BCC never ended.

Elite vs. Death Triangle is "too much of a good thing," so to speak, and not really what anyone wants to see.

Eddie Kingdom has been forgotten and discarded. Repeat this sentence 20-30 more times with your favorite wrestler(s).

I could go on and on, but you get the point.

What’s weird is Punk wasn’t *that* big of a ratings draw, but he seems to have taken a chunk of the audience with him, anyway.

[The Man in Blak]

Kingston has had twelve AEW matches since he lost to Sammy Guevara in September and, other than the match with Akiyama at the Full Gear pre-show and losing to Ethan Page during the last World Title eliminator tournament, they've all been tag matches with Ortiz, including one from this week's Dark. Probably a situation that's more about Ortiz (and Santana) than Eddie, though who knows with all of the backstage nonsense over the last few months.

[Blehschmidt]

Last night's Rampage and the Battle of the Belts show were both actually really good.

Top Flight vs Mox/Danielson, Mike Bennett vs Darby, Jade vs Skye Blue, and Orange vs Sabian were all fun and worth watching.

Kingston also showed back up and will be teaming with Ortiz against Black and King next Friday night.

[C.S.]

Eddie Kingston deleted his Twitter account. Hope he's okay and there's nothing more to it than him wanting to get rid of a toxic and counterproductive app.

[Coffey]

18 hours ago, The Man in Blak said:

Kingston has had twelve AEW matches since he lost to Sammy Guevara in September and, other than the match with Akiyama at the Full Gear pre-show and losing to Ethan Page during the last World Title eliminator tournament, they've all been tag matches with Ortiz, including one from this week's Dark. Probably a situation that's more about Ortiz (and Santana) than Eddie, though who knows with all of the backstage nonsense over the last few months.

They need to put the stars on the main show. No one gives a shit about Dark, no one is watching the YouTube shows. Hell, no one watches Rampage. It's like when WCW was hot during the Monday Night Wars era & someone was wrestling on WCW Saturday Night. Or WWF Sunday Night Heat.

[Perfectly Straightedge]

12 hours ago, Coffey said:

They need to put the stars on the main show. No one gives a shit about Dark, no one is watching the YouTube shows. Hell, no one watches Rampage. It's like when WCW was hot during the Monday Night Wars era & someone was wrestling on WCW Saturday Night. Or WWF Sunday Night Heat.

Then what would be the point of fans going to those tapings? Also every wrestler needs reps. If they can get them by wrestling on Dark or Rampage. I don’t see the problem here at all. 

It’s not like they are doing Mox against Hangman on Dark or Darby Vs Wardlow. These are just matches to get guys reps and also to test stuff out in front of a live crowd. I mean would rather them test all that out on a live dynamite where it can die a live death like the whole Swerve thing. Had they just debuted those guys on Dark and then had the attack it could have went somewhere cause then we would have had a clue who they were. 

Like the old saying goes “Agree to disagree” 

[Embrodak]

2 hours ago, Perfectly Straightedge said:

Then what would be the point of fans going to those tapings? Also every wrestler needs reps. If they can get them by wrestling on Dark or Rampage. I don’t see the problem here at all. 

It’s not like they are doing Mox against Hangman on Dark or Darby Vs Wardlow. These are just matches to get guys reps and also to test stuff out in front of a live crowd. I mean would rather them test all that out on a live dynamite where it can die a live death like the whole Swerve thing. Had they just debuted those guys on Dark and then had the attack it could have went somewhere cause then we would have had a clue who they were. 

Like the old saying goes “Agree to disagree” 

Is there any point to having a YouTube show? Has there been a single star that “got their reps in” on Dark that was then ready for national television?

[Perfectly Straightedge]

Just now, Embrodak said:

Is there any point to having a YouTube show? Has there been a single star that “got their reps in” on Dark that was then ready for national television?

I don’t think you are making the point you think you are. Lol

The point is AEW Dark is there for a reason. AEW runs no live events and most of the time it’s all squash matches and just to get a look guys. It gives reps to people to try out new things when you don’t run live events you can still get a look and see what could pop a crowd or not. Plus it’s no different than just televising dark matches. 

Plus it’s a testing place for commentary teams as well. 

I mean it’s not like AEW is running extra shows considering most of the times it’s taped before shows or after shows. So I mean what’s the exact issue here. Who cares about the views cause people still watch it. 

[C.S.]

49 minutes ago, Embrodak said:

Is there any point to having a YouTube show? Has there been a single star that “got their reps in” on Dark that was then ready for national television?

The point has always been for Tony to get as much footage as possible for a future streaming service of his own or (more likely) a deal with an existing streaming service.

[Coffey]

3 hours ago, Perfectly Straightedge said:

These are just matches to get guys reps and also to test stuff out in front of a live crowd. I mean would rather them test all that out on a live dynamite..

No, I would rather they not hire people that need to "get their reps in" at all. Same with WWE. Bring in the people that you want to use. That's what the Indies are for. AEW Dark shouldn't exist.

[MoS]

Ratings will get back up when the build for Revolution gets in its proper full swing. AEW's TV audience have been shown to stop watching for a bit when there are other big things happening in the world - like Christmas and New Year. I would think it's because watching AEW has not become a part of life after several decades of TV shows, unlike with many WWE shows. AEW also gets more affected than WWE during times like Thanksgiving and elections, I suspect for the same reasons as noted. 

[Perfectly Straightedge]

3 hours ago, Coffey said:

No, I would rather they not hire people that need to "get their reps in" at all. Same with WWE. Bring in the people that you want to use. That's what the Indies are for. AEW Dark shouldn't exist.

Wow, That’s the most ridiculous statement that l I have read on this site, and boy I have read some stuff. This conversation is officially over cause anything you would or could reply back is just completely fabricated and just quite frankly idiotic. Forget the agree to disagree part. You are just flat out wrong and I have ZERO intent of discussing this matter further. 

Good day Sir!

[Embrodak]

20 minutes ago, Perfectly Straightedge said:

Wow, That’s the most ridiculous statement that l I have read on this site, and boy I have read some stuff. This conversation is officially over cause anything you would or could reply back is just completely fabricated and just quite frankly idiotic. Forget the agree to disagree part. You are just flat out wrong and I have ZERO intent of discussing this matter further. 

Good day Sir!

You okay bud

[strobogo]

Being mad about the dark shows existing is weird as hell. Like being mad that Jakked and Metal that aired at 2 am on Sunday morning existed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Matt D]

Dark and Elevation are the most enjoyable parts of AEW anyway. 

[SirEdger]

I used to watch Dark in the early days of AEW. About 3 or 4 matches only, about an hour long, that was perfect. Now, it's ridiculous, there's like 15 matches crammed in one show.

[DMJ]

I really enjoyed a whole bunch of what I saw this week. Us fans are going to nitpick stuff, for sure, but its impossible to put on a perfect show for a wrestling audience now, then, forever.

- For example, as much as I loved the Darby/Joe match and Darby's victory, I'll never get behind someone like Joe "taking" a Code Red. The physics don't make sense...but, hey, the live crowd popped for it, Darby still finished him with two Coffin Drops, and we got a genuinely shocking win as I don't recall seeing anyone anywhere posting that Darby was leaving with the TNT Championship. I'll gladly admit that there are just certain moves that I have to "play along with" in 2023 as much as I did in 1998 when The Rock could debilitate an opponent for upwards of 40 seconds in order to hit the most basic of elbow drops. Same bullshit, different era. Joe had to "cooperate" to take that move just like dozens of guys had to cooperate every single time The Rock took inordinate amounts of time to cock his eyebrow, remove an elbow paid, wait for the crowd response, run the ropes, and then deliver an elbow. 

- I really enjoyed the Danielson/MJF segment, starting with the Tony Nese squash. Many of us complained about how much a Danielson/Nese match was going to just be them showing off their cardio, but it wasn't that at all. Instead, Danielson dominated and we then got an exchange that felt, to me, like what I've wanted Danielson to be for better or worse (and, to be honest, based on everything I've heard/read about the guy, Danielson is known for making stupid dick jokes backstage so you can't blame "the writers" for the 90s-era "yo mama" jokes if that is legitimately what Bryan finds funny and wants to do which, by the way, again, did pop the live crowd). A guaranteed 60-minute Daniel Bryan match is still a draw to me too even if I get that others are less excited. People are calling this whole angle repetitive - and it is - but what we also know now is that Bryan is going to be wrestling a whole bunch of singles matches this month and that, at Revolution, he's going to put MJF to the test (much like CM Punk put him to the test). I kinda dig the subversive way that MJF's gimmick is that he "can't work" but then has to go out and try to eke out a victory in matches that ostensibly favor the other guy and, more often than not, even in a loss, proves that he's tough (in kayfabe) and, to us nerds, not at all a bad "big match" worker. 

- That Dusty finish was exactly what a Dusty finish should be. I'm not a huge Acclaimed guy, but damn, they got me with that bullshit finish and I was legitimately about to stop my workout to post on here like some keyboard warrior about how dumb TK is...and then the finish was reversed and Acclaimed won. And, as someone else mentioned, there was some good logic there too as there were a whole slew of referees on the scene at the time. It wasn't like they reviewed the tape, it was literally that other referees were there and caught what the official referee missed. To me, that makes sense the same way that if you go to your job on your day off and you catch a co-worker making an honest mistake, you might chime in. Lame analogy aside, I appreciated the way that was laid out (I appreciated less how the guy in the Acclaimed took Jarrett's finisher, which looked horrible). 

- Not sure what to make of Saraya naming Toni Storm her tag partner. Was obviously lackluster, but maybe the necessary thing to just go ahead and take the L if Mercedes Mone isn't coming in. It would be worse if they kept a mystery until next week and then had Toni Storm come out. No reason to hold in a fart. While I obviously hope this is a swerve, if not, I'm fine with them moving on to the two natural feuds that are coming out of this - Shida vs. Storm and probably re-igniting Hayter/Baker. Let Saraya go after Jade Cargill or something. 

- Speaking of swerves, Swerve Scott is great. I hope they give him the W over Lee and then have him challenge Darby down the line. That match against AR Fox is the kind of match you can show someone and say, "This is what AEW is. Its not for everyone, but if you dig this, you'll like AEW." Was it "too much"? Probably...but that's kinda what AEW is and it isn't for everyone.

- I think its funny how much people see ratings in the 800k-900ks and think this company is doing poorly. If AEW gets pulled off the air, it will be because the people in charge of TBS/TNT just don't want wrestling (a tale as old as time), not because these ratings are objectively "terrible." I feel like when AEW first started, people were throwing around ratings in the 300-500k range as being the goal. I think their ceiling is closer to 1.2-1.3m and it will take time to even get back there a couple times, but its not that out of reach. It'll be interesting to see how next week's show does because it is definitely a stacked card.

I could write a ton more but nobody wants to read it and my wife wants me to put away the laundry and start helping with dinner.

[Phil Schneider]

7 hours ago, Embrodak said:

Is there any point to having a YouTube show? Has there been a single star that “got their reps in” on Dark that was then ready for national television?

The Acclaimed are maybe the hottest act in AEW

[Big Pete]

I didn't have an issue when it was just Dynamite and Dark. With Dynamite it was so refreshing to have a two hour block of television and that's all you had to sit through. It was easy to make it appointment television and follow along with everything that was happening in the promotion. If it was a particularly good week of AEW, Dark was a solid show to have in the background to hype up the upcoming Dynamite and flesh out the roster.

It only became an issue for me when they introduced Rampage. Not only was it a second hour of TV to keep up with, but it also watered down Dynamite because you'd have to save at least one marquee match for the show. Suddenly they were dedicating parts of Dynamite to rapid-fire angles for Rampage and the overall quality of the product diminished.

On top of that, you now had two Dark shows to follow and over-time they had become really complacent with those shows. Every now and then you'd get a fun try-out or angle worth following, but it became a show where careers go to die and that's not something you want to put out there. Dark could be a great show to build some buzz and re-tool acts that are struggling to get TV time but usually it's just mindless squash matches.

[NintendoLogic]

If we're being honest, the main purpose of the YouTube shows is to pad the W-L records of wrestlers who aren't involved in any major programs at the moment. And every now and then you get happy accidents like Athena getting herself over by killing jobbers. What I don't understand is getting worked up over Dark and Elevation existing. Even if you think they're pointless, it's not as if they're actively detrimental to the product.

[Coffey]

1 hour ago, NintendoLogic said:

What I don't understand is getting worked up over Dark and Elevation existing. Even if you think they're pointless, it's not as if they're actively detrimental to the product.

I think shows like Dark, Dark: Elevation & now NXT Level-Up for WWE, are actively detrimental to the pro wrestling industry as a whole. Yes, kayfabe is dead & everyone on the internet thinks they're a know-it-all nowadays, but it's a bad look, to me, when you're just beating your viewers over the head with "this shit is fake, watch these nobodies learn to work" all the fucking time. That's my problem with these shows. It's the same way I felt about Tough Enough.

I'm sorry if that ruffles the feathers of some Straight Edge dude that I've never heard of, but so be it. Even if you can get a star from it, like a Sol Ruca, I think the negatives far outweigh the positives. I think it does long term damage when you disenfranchise the viewing audience to the work of wrestling to the point where it just becomes an athletic display & no one is able to suspend disbelief anymore. We're so far beyond the Wizard being revealed behind the curtain that we now wrestle with the curtain open & are arguing about what The Wizard is wearing. 

[Matt D]

All I'll say is that it's really obvious that you don't actually watch the shows.