Comments that don't warrant a thread - Part 4

[KawadaSmile]

3 minutes ago, El-P said:

Steve Austin, The Rock and yes, Roman Reigns disagree. 

Odd, that did not strike me at all this time, like for instance how everybody looked dull and the same in the mid 00's, with the short trunks, crew cuts and tribal tatoos. Maybe I just did not pay attention.

Seth Rollins looks like Juice Robinson now (the Flamboyant version, not the lame current Bullet Club one).

The Rock wore Versace shirts all the time, tho. He was far from plain, even when his primary attire colors were black.

And even during the Attitude Era, we still got colorful stuff. DX wore green attires all the time, we had 2 Cool who wore Zubaz-like gear, the Radicalz all had some color in their gear, Kane was the BIG RED MONSTER... I think the lighting also helps - in my mind, things were brighter then than they are right now.

 

 

[NintendoLogic]

Rollins is Exhibit A for how dressing like a clown is probably the simplest shortcut to fool people into thinking you have charisma.

[strobogo]

The lighting is way brighter now. Pretty much everyone was black base with color designs in the Attitude Era as well, because that's the easiest and cleanest look for just about everyone.

[El-P]

8 minutes ago, KawadaSmile said:

The Rock wore Versace shirts all the time, tho. He was far from plain, even when his primary attire colors were black.

In the ring, he was black trunks with a logo, black boots, black kneepads with some logo on it I believe. Actually at this time there was kind of a return to more "traditional" in-ring garments after the excess of the Mid 90's where everybody got more and more dressed up, including in "job" outfits. It was kinda refreshing for a while, then got toward the dullard style of the mid 00's.

The Rumble matches are actually a good way to gauge how the "fashion" has evolved over the years.

[El-P]

Anyone has any idea why Korea never developed a strong pro-wrestling scene ? They have followed suit the J-pop model and actually have won the soft power war on this side of things (incredible how K-pop is popular with zoomers, much bigger than J-pop ever was). Why isn't there some company that would invest into creating some high-rent pro-wrestling product with global reach (thanks to their current science of ridiculous production values) ? I get that the state would probably not support such a project like they do with movies and music, but still. Some of the most important pro-wrestlers in the history of puroresu actually have Korean origins (Rikidozan, Choshu, Maeda), it's interesting that this is not something that grew big as its own culture yet.

[Ma Stump Puller]

40 minutes ago, El-P said:

Anyone has any idea why Korea never developed a strong pro-wrestling scene ? They have followed suit the J-pop model and actually have won the soft power war on this side of things (incredible how K-pop is popular with zoomers, much bigger than J-pop ever was). Why isn't there some company that would invest into creating some high-rent pro-wrestling product with global reach (thanks to their current science of ridiculous production values) ? I get that the state would probably not support such a project like they do with movies and music, but still. Some of the most important pro-wrestlers in the history of puroresu actually have Korean origins (Rikidozan, Choshu, Maeda), it's interesting that this is not something that grew big as its own culture yet.

I think the issue is that unlike Japan, there wasn't ever really a need for a pro-wrestling scene. It's the same thing with China: despite the theoretical very large and profitable success that could go along with wrestling there, there's just.....no interest, really, people just aren't interested in the prospect of native wrestling shows. IGF tried hard with talent exchanges (even the WWE got in on that as you'll notice from around about the mid-2010's) and fairly strong shows but no dice. The closest there's been a Korean scene like what you described was with NKPWA who also put on huge shows with big international stars (Angle, etc) got absolutely nowhere and now do sad events in warehouses in front of maybe 30 people while not even being in Korea. 

 

 

[NintendoLogic]

Pro wrestling was pretty big in Korea in the 1960s and 1970s with Kintaro Oki (whose real name was Kim Il) as the top star. From what I've read, the assassination of President Park Chung-hee in 1979 caused things to fall apart. Park was a wrestling fan, but his successor Chun Doo-hwan was not. The government seized Oki's gym, and the scene died out after Oki retired in the early 1980s. Maybe brother @KinchStalker can shed some more light on the subject.

By the way, I've felt for a while now that pro wrestling was overdue for a kpop gimmick. A Korean pretty boy tag team with a finisher called the Perfect All-Kill would be a license to print money.

[ohtani's jacket]

The reason K-pop is more successful internationally than J-pop is because traditionally K-pop had to struggle to market its product to other countries while J-pop was only concerned with its domestic market. It also took a long time. It's something that's happened over decades not just the past year or two. 

[Dale Wolfe]

There is a cool little indie called PWS that is ticking along over there 

Korean MMA seems a lot bigger to me but its been a couple of years since i was over there. Baseball and football kind of dominate the market tho

[KinchStalker]

On 2/3/2023 at 6:15 AM, NintendoLogic said:

Pro wrestling was pretty big in Korea in the 1960s and 1970s with Kintaro Oki (whose real name was Kim Il) as the top star. From what I've read, the assassination of President Park Chung-hee in 1979 caused things to fall apart. Park was a wrestling fan, but his successor Chun Doo-hwan was not. The government seized Oki's gym, and the scene died out after Oki retired in the early 1980s. Maybe brother @KinchStalker can shed some more light on the subject.

I don't know as much on the subject as I would like; as I have stated elsewhere on the board, my Otsuka/NJPW thread is on hold because I am trying to get a bit more context for South Korean pro wrestling. But the industry was propped up hard by the Park regime. The president of the promotion itself, which was known as the Kim Il Supporter's Association until 1982, was Chung-hee's bodyguard, "Pistol" Park Jong-gyu. Chung-hee apparently paid for the Kim Il (later Cultural) Gymnasium, a commission which Oki hooked his architect buddy Lee Chun-sung up with. I can't verify this, but I remember reading somewhere that the promotion had lost television coverage at some point, but that Chung-hee forced it to go back on TV. In the 2019 Kim Duk interview that gave me a lot of info for the Oki/Korea post, he also notes that Jong-gyu’s wife was a huge fan and basically a patron. Oki always went out with a cadre of KCIA bodyguards. Et cetera.

Everything seems to point to a simple explanation for the decline: the promotion had been coasting on government funding. I raised an eyebrow when reading Showa Puroresu state that tickets for the March 1975 Kim Il/NJPW tour ranged from 4 to 15 won, a tenth of Japanese ticket prices (that top amount equated to about ¥900 at the time). Kim Duk has this to say about his life as a trainee in 1967:

“All the money for food and stuff came from the Korean Wrestling Association. In other words, money from the government. I stayed at Mr. Oki's house for about three months, but the other trainees complained, so I moved into a training camp. We young guys were paid as well. We were paid about ¥3,000 a month. All living expenses were covered by the association, so we could eat out and live on that salary. Prices were cheap.”

I should also note that South Korea clearly didn’t have the infrastructure for the kind of tours that Japanese promotions did. You never read about them working in provincial markets. I only ever read about shows taking place in about half a dozen cities, the smallest of which was Pyeongtaek, which had a population of around 200,000 in 1975.

Oh, and that gym? It was in the Changdeokgung Palace garden.

[Dav'oh]

The Dickhead

I went to the wrestling last night by myself
Because nobody else shares my heart.
I wore the shades of a Savage and the shirt of a Sheik -
My dear Mother said I looked smart.

I boarded a train and surveyed the mob,
No partners stood out for my love.
No Hogan bandanas no Moolah❤️ tattoos,
Not even a coal-miner's glove.

At the arena the ring-ropes are red the apron is blue
The canvas is sepia (once-white).
The MC has a goatee and is shilling the raffle,
I have four beers in my lap, I'm alright.

The first match begins but I've got nothing funny so
I just have to sit there and watch.
I still cheer for the heels and boo-hiss the faces
And silently pray for a botch.

Three matches in and I'm starting to swear
But the people around me are sh!t.
Well get some hair on your chest and don't bring your kids
If you can't f*cking handle my wit.

"You punch like a pu$$y", "You look like a p**f",
"Your mum's c?nt smells like the tide".
I know that it's me that they're coming to see
As security drags me aside.

The fans cheer for the bouncer and they call me a w@nker,
You know it's all music to my ears.
Ejected pre-interval, so Mission:Accomplished
It's the best night that I've had in years!

 

[NintendoLogic]

Censoring "wanker" but not "dickhead" might be the most Australian thing I've ever seen.

[El-P]

He censored "cunt" as well. I thought "cunt" in Australia was basically a punctation mark.

[Dav'oh]

It was in case someone submitted it to a higher, more delicate, institution for their consideration

[Robert S]

I am still puzzled what "p**f" stands for.

[Strummer]

Former WCW wrestler Charlie Norris has passed away at age 57 according to Cauliflower Alley.

Norris got a minor push in 1993 WCW.

[Phil Schneider]

I went on the Masked Man show to do a Wrestling Trade Deadline pod, maybe the most fun I have ever had doing a pod

 

https://t.co/qR6XvG1oRl

[NintendoLogic]

4 hours ago, Robert S said:

I am still puzzled what "p**f" stands for.

It stands for "poof," which is UK/Commonwealth slang for a gay man. I don't quite know how it compares in offensiveness to the f-word in the US, but it's not exactly a term of endearment.

[KawadaSmile]

Late Fairly OddParents seasons just got more awkward!

[KinchStalker]

On 2/4/2023 at 3:26 PM, KinchStalker said:

I don't know as much on the subject as I would like; as I have stated elsewhere on the board, my Otsuka/NJPW thread is on hold because I am trying to get a bit more context for South Korean pro wrestling. But the industry was propped up hard by the Park regime. The president of the promotion itself, which was known as the Kim Il Supporter's Association until 1982, was Chung-hee's bodyguard, "Pistol" Park Jong-gyu. Chung-hee apparently paid for the Kim Il (later Cultural) Gymnasium, a commission which Oki hooked his architect buddy Lee Chun-sung up with. I can't verify this, but I remember reading somewhere that the promotion had lost television coverage at some point, but that Chung-hee forced it to go back on TV. In the 2019 Kim Duk interview that gave me a lot of info for the Oki/Korea post, he also notes that Jong-gyu’s wife was a huge fan and basically a patron. Oki always went out with a cadre of KCIA bodyguards. Et cetera.

Everything seems to point to a simple explanation for the decline: the promotion had been coasting on government funding. I raised an eyebrow when reading Showa Puroresu state that tickets for the March 1975 Kim Il/NJPW tour ranged from 4 to 15 won, a tenth of Japanese ticket prices (that top amount equated to about ¥900 at the time). Kim Duk has this to say about his life as a trainee in 1967:

“All the money for food and stuff came from the Korean Wrestling Association. In other words, money from the government. I stayed at Mr. Oki's house for about three months, but the other trainees complained, so I moved into a training camp. We young guys were paid as well. We were paid about ¥3,000 a month. All living expenses were covered by the association, so we could eat out and live on that salary. Prices were cheap.”

I should also note that South Korea clearly didn’t have the infrastructure for the kind of tours that Japanese promotions did. You never read about them working in provincial markets. I only ever read about shows taking place in about half a dozen cities, the smallest of which was Pyeongtaek, which had a population of around 200,000 in 1975.

Oh, and that gym? It was in the Changdeokgung Palace garden.

Something that I can't believe I forgot to add. The government's pro wrestling budget was slashed in half in the mid-70s, as public opinion shifted to see it as the whim of a weakening administration (see: the 1974 Park assassination attempt, which managed to kill his wife). Oki had started a fishery business to make up for the lost income, but he was spending a lot of time in Japan in the mid-70s to raise money. That's actually what led to him switching to a program with Baba so soon after the NJPW Korea tour, as the Great Kojika sought him out in May 1975 to see if he was still under contract to New Japan.

(Oops, guess I spoiled some future bits in the NJPW/Otsuka thread.)

[Robert S]

I  am sure everybody has already seen it but just in case: those AI generated Gorilla Monsoon podcasts are great.

 

[ohtani's jacket]

That was amazing. 

[Pokitren]

On 1/30/2023 at 11:08 PM, El-P said:

Odd, that did not strike me at all this time, like for instance how everybody looked dull and the same in the mid 00's, with the short trunks, crew cuts and tribal tatoos. Maybe I just did not pay attention.

Seth Rollins looks like Juice Robinson now or online casino here (the Flamboyant version, not the lame current Bullet Club one).

Yes, it was a semblance of a uniform, and was boring Now it's much more diverse and fun. But even this variety can be boring.

Hello all! I registered a long time ago, but then found myself very busy. Today is my first post here!

[strobogo]

Where does Jay White-O end up? TNA seems below him as his homebase, I feel like he gets lost in the shuffle in AEW and also is going to be 2 heel at best for a while for MJF's run. I do feel like he fits in the best in WWE, but also feel like he'd just be alternate brand Seth Rollins at any point in time, which probably isn't the worst thing to be.

Both AEW and WWE have the built in Bullet Club angles with former leaders/members.  It'll be interesting to see where he decides on.

[El-P]

Selfishly I want him in AEW, but I believe he ends up in WWE. The guy is not big, but he's very simply one of the best workers in the world. His in-ring style I believe can mesh up in WWE because it's slower and more deliberate (but at the same time, very much organic crowd interaction based, which is not WWE's style at all), but it needs to be seen how seriously they would take him because of his frame. Basically, if I'm Jay White, I only go to WWE with a FAT-ASS contract and with a guarantee of main-event level spot (likewise Cody). If he ends up debuting in NXT, then it's a complete joke. Also, I only sign a 3 year deal at most.

But of course, I love to watch him so please go to AEW. He's working against Eddie Kingston next week-end at the NJPW show (the one with Mercedes vs Kairi), so at least I'll get this before he probably (sadly) vanishes from my radar.