Wrestler of the Year 2017

[joeg]

I need to go back and rewatch Taker vs Reigns.... by the time Taker vs Reigns happened I had watched 6 1/2 hours of wrestling (6 of which was bad wrestling) its hard to enjoy any match under those circumstances.

[Zoo Enthusiast]

I need to go back and rewatch Taker vs Reigns.... by the time Taker vs Reigns happened I had watched 6 1/2 hours of wrestling (6 of which was bad wrestling) its hard to enjoy any match under those circumstances.

Yeah, these posts have me feeling the same way.

[Zoo Enthusiast]

 

How has Trevor Lee's non CWF stuff been, I liked him in the 3-way with Low-Ki, although Ki was the standout. I wasn't in love with some of his early workratey CWF defenses (Daniels, Day, Elgin), but he has been on a huge roll during the second half of the year, working very different title matches against a cool variety of wrestlers, loved the ECW brawl with Nick Richards, his little guy v. big guy match against Mecha Mercenary, the Aric Andrews match built around body part selling, his almost Tenryuish performances against Sharpe and in the Battle Royal. Seems like a guy who is doing a wide variety of things very waiell.

 

He's had PWG matches against Keith Lee and Janela that I liked. But his case relies heavily on CWF, where, as you say, he's tremendous.

I’m a big fan of the non-CWF stuff because I love the “Impact wrestling superstar” gimmick. It’s especially good in PWG. I did see him have a pretty mediocre match in person in AAW against Fenix during the Jim Lynam tourney, though.

[Quentin Skinner]

Trevor this year doesn't have anything non-CWF that I loved as much as the Hero match from 2016. Closest is the Janela match from ASW 13 but the Hero match is a different level. It's a lot of good stuff but the main appeal is the character work that he keeps getting better at.

[Laz]

Same here. I never get the ZSJ love. I get he tries to be this grappling wizard, but it comes off really bad. He really doesn't know the basics of grappling and it's glaring obvious when you watch his work. I mean, if that's what your character is based off, then you have to at least show a sign that you know what you're doing.

I don't think its so much that he doesn't know what he's doing as much he's stuck in exhibition mode most of the time. He treats chain wrestling like spotmonkeys treat flips, and that kind of "look what I can do" attitude is rampant in this generation of "big" Indy guys. He's the guitarist doing a dozen sweep arpeggios when a hammer-on would've been perfect.

 

Not that it isn't impressive and a nice change from a card likely filled with moonsaults and weak suplexes.

[soup23]

I feel like I am being co-opted by Quentin but we have the same top 2 right now in that order.

 

After that things get really hazy for me. I perhaps would give a shout to someone like Takeshita or maybe AJ but am uncertain. I kept hearing the narrative that Trevor Lee's 2017 wasn't up to snuff as his 2016 and while I agree that the Hero match from EPIC is the best match in the past two years outside of CWF, his CWF stuff from 2017 holds up nicely against the 2016 output IMO. I am still a big fan of the Day match even if it cooled slightly on my MOTY year end watch. The second half of the year he has really shined. Between the Aric Andrews, Richards, Otto Scwanz and Mecha defenses and then the masterful performance in the Rumble, he may have enough to snag my #3 spot currently.

[Childs]

 

Same here. I never get the ZSJ love. I get he tries to be this grappling wizard, but it comes off really bad. He really doesn't know the basics of grappling and it's glaring obvious when you watch his work. I mean, if that's what your character is based off, then you have to at least show a sign that you know what you're doing.

I don't think its so much that he doesn't know what he's doing as much he's stuck in exhibition mode most of the time. He treats chain wrestling like spotmonkeys treat flips, and that kind of "look what I can do" attitude is rampant in this generation of "big" Indy guys. He's the guitarist doing a dozen sweep arpeggios when a hammer-on would've been perfect.

 

Not that it isn't impressive and a nice change from a card likely filled with moonsaults and weak suplexes.

Part of what I liked about him this year was that with him working heel more, his grappling got less exhibitiony. That used to bug me as well. The fact that it might not look authentic to an MMA or BJJ fan is irrelevant to me.

[Edwin]

 

Same here. I never get the ZSJ love. I get he tries to be this grappling wizard, but it comes off really bad. He really doesn't know the basics of grappling and it's glaring obvious when you watch his work. I mean, if that's what your character is based off, then you have to at least show a sign that you know what you're doing.

I don't think its so much that he doesn't know what he's doing as much he's stuck in exhibition mode most of the time. He treats chain wrestling like spotmonkeys treat flips, and that kind of "look what I can do" attitude is rampant in this generation of "big" Indy guys. He's the guitarist doing a dozen sweep arpeggios when a hammer-on would've been perfect.

 

Not that it isn't impressive and a nice change from a card likely filled with moonsaults and weak suplexes.

I wrote a bit on him after having watched his match against Mark Haskins from the WWN Supershow over at DVDVR:

Watching ZSJ vs. Mark Haskins from the WWN Supershow. Man ZSJ's matches are tough to sit through. He seems to pride himself as this complex grappler, but I just don't see it. As I said the last time around, if he's going to pride himself as a grappler, he really should get some tips from Riddle or take a BJJ class at least.

 

I don't mind guys with horrendous business exposing grappling as much as I do in this case as they usually don't build themselves around that, but ZSJ to me seems like he does and it's horrible.

 

I know it sounds like I'm picking on ZSJ and I know someone will bring it up, but I'm really not. If you build yourself on something, try and come off as a genuine and good as possible.

 

He seems to be more focused on cute submission attempts than on effective subs.

 

His strikes are particularly weak looking too. Haskins leg kicks seemed far more effective than his. I also caught that clip of him "killing" Chris Hero from PWG and those "stomps" looked more like he was just caressing Hero's head with his foot than anything else. He still doesn't posses the weakest/fakest striking in wrestling though, that's Michael Elgin's claim by a long shot with his blatant thigh slapping.

 

Another thing that irks me about ZSJ is how many times I've heard people compare his matches to that of MMA fights. That's just wrong on so many levels. If anything, ZSJ reflects the entire opposite.

 

I personally don't find him appealing at all, but I can't say I blame him as he's built a solid fanbase so more power to him.

Edit: Re-reading that post I posted some time ago and your reply, yeah, I guess what I meant to say is his grappling exchanges look more like exhibitions than anything else. He's more focused on being cute than effective and it makes him look really weak and like he has no idea what he's doing realistically.

 

2 years ago the majority of the people who replied to his GWE nomination on here didn't like him either: http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?/topic/31550-zack-sabre-jr

 

I'm curious what the sentiment would be from those same people now that its been 2 years and theres a lot more footage of him available now...

[concrete1992]

What's the consensus on top 10 contender Nick Gage?

[soup23]

Tremont matches rule. Want to see more of him outside of the scope of death match stuff in GCW ala vs Gresham and vs. Donst in AIW.

[Boss Rock]

Controversial pick, but Kenny Omega. Thought the Okada trilogy was the best in-ring feud this year. The first two were indeed padded but featured some of the most amazing stretches of action I've ever seen in a wrestling match. The G-1 match took the best parts of the first two matches while condensing it to 25 minutes and telling a great story of Okada being unable to overcome the injury to his neck suffered earlier in the tournament. I also loved the trilogy with Ishii which hasn't gotten as much love as the Okada matches but were really spectacular in their own right (the Long Beach match in particular). The same criticisms thrown at the Okada matches can be thrown at these ones as well, but there were some truly incredible offensive sequences. He had a great run in the U.S. Heavyweight Championship Tournament, a very good run in the G-1, and a MOTYC with Naito.

 

I get that he's not the most fundamentally-sound guy and often relies on big flashy stuff to get a match over, but I can't think of a better big match wrestler in the world today. Not to mention he managed to elevate much less-good talent like Jay Lethal and Trent Barreta. A friend of mine once described him as a spiritual successor to Kenta Kobashi and I sort of agree. Sounds crazy I know, but hear me out. Offensive dynamo and great seller at times, but prone to excess and a flair for the over-dramatic.

 

My number 2 would be Kazuchika Okada.

[EricR]

I mostly dislike modern NJPW but ZSJ's two matches against Tanahashi and his Ishii match were excellent.

[cheapshot]

1. Tetsuya Naito

2. WALTER

3. Zack Sabre Jr.

4. Roman Reigns

5. Kazuchika Okada

5. Kenny Omega

6. David Starr

8. Timothy Thatcher

9. Johnny Gargano

10. Braun Strowman

[El-P]

I haven't watch stuff regularly enough (except for taped-in-2016 LU and WWE PPVs), so I'll throw Braun Strowman in there. The big fucking monster killing people and looking like a freak, so cool that the audience would cheer him despite the booking, was the most compelling and fresh thing in WWE this year.

[superkix]

Probably Hideki Suzuki

[Rah]

What's the consensus on top 10 contender Nick Gage?

 

Is he better than he was? Because the last I saw him after his prison stint he wasn't much of anything.

[Zoo Enthusiast]

 

I haven't watched much indy wrestling this year, but how does everyone feel about possibly bringing Keith Lee as a top 5 in discussion? I've seen some of his PWG and EVOLVE work and he's been fantastic. That match with Dijak from WM weekend at EVOLVE was pretty great iirc. His match with Ricochet from the same weekend was pretty fantastic too. Possibly the best match I've seen Ricochet in ever. The Leo Rush match from that weekend was fantastic too. He may have been the best worker from that entire WM weekend with back-to-back fantastic performances with a variety of opponents.

 

I'm not sure he's quite in top five discussion but I love Keith Lee almost always. He also had a terrific match with Ishii a month or so ago on one of the Rev Pro/NJPW shows in the UK (available on NJPW World) and last weekend had what I thought was a fantastic match with WALTER in EVOLVE.

I have been thinking about this more and catching up on more shows since this post. And damn, I fucking love Keith Lee. Bask in his glory. He is smackdab in the discussion for me.

[Jmare007]

Kento Miyahara for me, bunch of great performances both in singles and tags this year.

[Phil Schneider]

Low-KI is a under the radar candidate, he had the great Sami Callihan match in AAW and a series of absolute bangers in Impact wrestling. Not a ton of volume, but his per match average is super high

[Cap]

For me it has to be Walter.

 

This was a great year for people having LOTS of great performances, and my watching was certainly far from exhaustive. I think a lot of overall resumes were built in 2017. For me, Walter had the best combination of high ceiling, high floor, and incredible consistency. He has at least 3 matches in my top 10 right now, was part of my second favorite live match of the year, and didn't have a bad match I saw. He had my favorite rivalry of the year with Starr and another top contender in that category with Riddle. While Dragunov was the star of 16 carat I think Walter was the backbone that made Dragunov such a standout (and for some people - myself included - a breakout) star. His tag work was excellent in both Progress and wXw. He stood out where continuity was important and he stood out in super matches.

 

i am putting my top 10 together soon and am considering a lot of people, but Trevor Lee is probably the only person I would consider to challenge Walter. His main event work in CWF mixed with his varied work in different promotions across the country make him another candidate with a lot great matches, a high ceiling, and a high floor. He might even have a little more diversity than Walter. I don't see much drop off from last year. I think the match with Day is a top 3 match of the year (maybe my favorite). He also had such a plethora of challenges in the second half of the year and I think made ever segment and everyone he worked with shine in CWF.

 

Wrestling was so good in 2017, so much fun.

 

Other people in the running for me (in no particular order): ZSJ, Okada, Styles, Omega, Reigns, Miyahara, Naito, Thatcher, Dunne, Janela, Starr, K. Lee, Rush.

 

I am sure I am forgetting some people.... there was a ton of good wrestling.

[Maciej]

I'm curious with the "ZSJ's grappling sucks" crowd, do y'all not think that kind of British-style submission work has any place in the matches ZSJ finds himself in, or do you just think he's not good at it? The latter, cool, whatever, but the former (ie "he should take some BJJ") seems oddly limiting; it's not like everyone else is working shoot-style on the mat.

[Childs]

Low-KI is a under the radar candidate, he had the great Sami Callihan match in AAW and a series of absolute bangers in Impact wrestling. Not a ton of volume, but his per match average is super high

Did you watch the Rotweilers vs. WALTER and Thatcher from WXW? Think you would enjoy.

[Cap]

Yeah... that match was a lot of fun.

[Zoo Enthusiast]

For me it has to be Walter.

 

This was a great year for people having LOTS of great performances, and my watching was certainly far from exhaustive. I think a lot of overall resumes were built in 2017. For me, Walter had the best combination of high ceiling, high floor, and incredible consistency. He has at least 3 matches in my top 10 right now, was part of my second favorite live match of the year, and didn't have a bad match I saw. He had my favorite rivalry of the year with Starr and another top contender in that category with Riddle. While Dragunov was the star of 16 carat I think Walter was the backbone that made Dragunov such a standout (and for some people - myself included - a breakout) star. His tag work was excellent in both Progress and wXw. He stood out where continuity was important and he stood out in super matches.

 

i am putting my top 10 together soon and am considering a lot of people, but Trevor Lee is probably the only person I would consider to challenge Walter. His main event work in CWF mixed with his varied work in different promotions across the country make him another candidate with a lot great matches, a high ceiling, and a high floor. He might even have a little more diversity than Walter. I don't see much drop off from last year. I think the match with Day is a top 3 match of the year (maybe my favorite). He also had such a plethora of challenges in the second half of the year and I think made ever segment and everyone he worked with shine in CWF.

 

Wrestling was so good in 2017, so much fun.

 

Other people in the running for me (in no particular order): ZSJ, Okada, Styles, Omega, Reigns, Miyahara, Naito, Thatcher, Dunne, Janela, Starr, K. Lee, Rush.

 

I am sure I am forgetting some people.... there was a ton of good wrestling.

Have been working through your list of WALTER matches you posted a while ago, so thanks for that. I have watched enough of him now from this year to say he is definitely in the top few wrestlers of the year. He’s just been spectacular.

 

I totally agree re: the general quality of 2017. I have loved so much stuff this year from so many different promotions and different styles.

[Cap]

 

For me it has to be Walter.

 

This was a great year for people having LOTS of great performances, and my watching was certainly far from exhaustive. I think a lot of overall resumes were built in 2017. For me, Walter had the best combination of high ceiling, high floor, and incredible consistency. He has at least 3 matches in my top 10 right now, was part of my second favorite live match of the year, and didn't have a bad match I saw. He had my favorite rivalry of the year with Starr and another top contender in that category with Riddle. While Dragunov was the star of 16 carat I think Walter was the backbone that made Dragunov such a standout (and for some people - myself included - a breakout) star. His tag work was excellent in both Progress and wXw. He stood out where continuity was important and he stood out in super matches.

 

i am putting my top 10 together soon and am considering a lot of people, but Trevor Lee is probably the only person I would consider to challenge Walter. His main event work in CWF mixed with his varied work in different promotions across the country make him another candidate with a lot great matches, a high ceiling, and a high floor. He might even have a little more diversity than Walter. I don't see much drop off from last year. I think the match with Day is a top 3 match of the year (maybe my favorite). He also had such a plethora of challenges in the second half of the year and I think made ever segment and everyone he worked with shine in CWF.

 

Wrestling was so good in 2017, so much fun.

 

Other people in the running for me (in no particular order): ZSJ, Okada, Styles, Omega, Reigns, Miyahara, Naito, Thatcher, Dunne, Janela, Starr, K. Lee, Rush.

 

I am sure I am forgetting some people.... there was a ton of good wrestling.

Have been working through your list of WALTER matches you posted a while ago, so thanks for that. I have watched enough of him now from this year to say he is definitely in the top few wrestlers of the year. He’s just been spectacular.

 

I totally agree re: the general quality of 2017. I have loved so much stuff this year from so many different promotions and different styles.

 

Awesome, glad to hear you have enjoyed that stuff. He is just so much fun to watch.

 

Yeah, looking back now I wish I had more time to keep up more with Japan and Mexico. I really cherrypicked both. I have some NJPW, AJPW, and Rush on my potentials list, but I just don't have a good enough grasp on their entire body of their work for them to compete - for me - with guys I have seen so much more of.