Comments that don't warrant a thread - Part 3

[S.L.L.]

So, as I sit here after two days of suffering with norovirus, I'm watching RAW on dvr. They're going on about how AJ was poor growing up, so far as to where she once worked as a janitor to get by.

 

Since when is being a janitor some terrible thing? Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure janitors make a decent living. It's like how I'd always laugh when Dusty would go on about being the son of a plumber. My buddy Brian is a plumber and he's a wealthy dude.

I once saw John Ratzenberger give a great interview where he lamented the decline of "tinkerers" (as he so eloquently put it), and attributed it in large part to how "people in my profession have done a great job of making them look like jokes". The perception amongst the people who write RAW is that, say, a plumber, is clearly and undeniably lower on the totem pole than, say, a doctor. This is in spite of the fact that many plumbers make the kind of money that my doctor father could only dream of.

 

But the perception does exist at large that any job based around manual labor is inherently a demeaning, low-paying affair for people who don't have "real" skills, and while that is obviously bullshit, wrestling is more about "realism" than reality, and the perception of the way things are is really more important than the way things actually are.

 

On the other hand, wrestling is working class entertainment, and seems like a bad idea to try and bullshit the working class about what it's like to be a part of the working class (insert joke about the Republican party here). On the other other hand, WWE doesn't want to be working class entertainment, and often tries to pretend it isn't, so I understand why this was written for an audience of failed sitcom writers instead of the audience that actually exists. On the OTHER other other hand...that's fucking stupid.

[Childs]

This NOAH story strikes me as a sad one. Kobashi became a great performer in a still-thriving industry, no doubt assuming that if he traded his health for glory, the company would always take care of him. And now the world that he knew 20 years ago is just gone. I know it's an economic story that gets repeated over and over throughout history. You could probably write the same thing about an auto worker who started a job in Michigan in 1985. And I'm sure Kobashi has done better financially than most, so I don't weep for him. But there's something poignant about a guy who threw so much of himself into his craft watching his entire context slip away.

[NintendoLogic]

Where the hell do you guys live where being a janitor provides tons of money and prestige? It's pretty much the definitive low-skill low-wage job, the kind of thing you warn your kids they're going to end up becoming if they don't take school seriously.

[Boondocks Kernoodle]

I worked at a janitor for two summers in a restaurant (well, the title of the job was "dishwasher" but we performed all janitorial duties as well) and it was demeaning and paid like shit. If you're the head janitor at a public school then you can probably make a pretty good living but your average floor-mopper is making minimum wage. But the reason why this is so exceptional for A.J. is because she's a cute girl and janitor isn't a job for a cute girl. You think Kelly Kelly was ever a janitor?

[khawk20]

Where the hell do you guys live where being a janitor provides tons of money and prestige? It's pretty much the definitive low-skill low-wage job, the kind of thing you warn your kids they're going to end up becoming if they don't take school seriously.

In Canada, it's an excellent-paying job with top-notch benefits and good hours in certain environments, such as in a public school system, a provincially-run Casino, a University or College, or a government building.

 

In other environments, like a contract-outfit that bids on jobs for a finite term, it stinks. Minimum wage, no benefits, shitty hours.

 

Most jobs are like this to a certain degree, I think, in the sense that the circumstances that you perform the job in are somewhat important in how the job is perceived by those not doing it.

 

The difference with janitorial work is it still carries a stigma even if you're at the top-end of the food chain in terms of wage, benefits, etc.

 

"What do you do for a living?"

 

"I'm a janitor for the Public School Board."

 

"oh...." (conversation dies, despite the fact that the janitor makes great money and has excellent benefits)

 

***

 

"What do you do for a living?"

 

"I'm a janitor for a lowball, fly-by-night operation."

"oh...." (conversation dies, and the janitor is glad since his job sucks for pay and hours and general working conditions)

 

Same reaction, different circumstances. Only one is really correct.

[Johnny Sorrow]

Point being, someone in WWE creative associates being a janitor with being homeless, and that's wacky and out of touch. It's not like they're saying, "She was homeless, lived in a car, but got a job as a janitor and worked hard to get to where she is". It's "She had it so hard being homeless and being a janitor!" Maybe it's cause I associate the job with, as mentioned above, the school janitors who always seemed to have a job for life and made a decent living, my pal growing up who's Dad was a janitor at Lipton Tea and they were in no way poor.

 

this was written for an audience of failed sitcom writers instead of the audience that actually exists.

There ya go.

[Loss]

Maybe she lived in the mall, like that father and daughter I was very jealous of on the Christmas episode of Saved By The Bell.

 

(I'm not trivializing homelessness. I am trivializing the Saved By The Bell portrayal of homelessness.)

[Eduardo]

Santiago Jimenez Sr., one of the most influential and beloved composers of conjunto piezas, worked for decades as a janitor. At schools, clinics, centers, etc. Being one of the most important figures in the history of the genre and one of the most imitated (I see kids today playing pieces Jimenez Sr. composed 70 years ago) wasn't enough money wise, so he supported his family by being a janitor. Great man, great musician.

 

 

Maybe she lived in the mall, like that father and daughter I was very jealous of on the Christmas episode of Saved By The Bell.

I still remember how nice Zack Morris was by putting some money in the payphone for the homeless father to get.

[Johnny Sorrow]

So it hit me last night that Dean Ambrose really looks like Ted DiBiase pre beard and feathered hair.

[El-P]

Maybe she lived in the mall, like that father and daughter I was very jealous of on the Christmas episode of Saved By The Bell.

I still remember how nice Zack Morris was by putting some money in the payphone for the homeless father to get.

 

You are so dating youselves.

 

(and yes, I watched Saved by the Bell too, and I got a kick out of having the two hot girls showing up in minor roles in two Woody Allen movies years later)

[Victator]

I remember this Flintstones episode where a doctor had to call a plumber and the plumber showed up driving a nicer car and better clothes than the doctor.

[jdw]

This NOAH story strikes me as a sad one. Kobashi became a great performer in a still-thriving industry, no doubt assuming that if he traded his health for glory, the company would always take care of him. And now the world that he knew 20 years ago is just gone. I know it's an economic story that gets repeated over and over throughout history. You could probably write the same thing about an auto worker who started a job in Michigan in 1985. And I'm sure Kobashi has done better financially than most, so I don't weep for him. But there's something poignant about a guy who threw so much of himself into his craft watching his entire context slip away.

This will sound a bit rough, but I think Kobashi too stupid to think about whether a company would always take care of him or not. I don't think he made a mental calculation about it: there's a 99.9% likelihood that he was like 99.9% of the rest of the people in the business who don't think beyond current "success", however they personally measure it.

 

I know that folks will point at Baba's use of the Comedy Match as a way to keep shipping some money to some folks, and that Kobashi thought that's where he would end up eventually and continue to make money until he was 60. I'd offer up:

 

* we don't know what type of living those guys made under Baba

 

* there are a finite number of gigs in that spot in the major companies

 

* Kobash debuted in 1988 and had already seen plenty of examples of former "stars" being out of the business or on the fringe

 

* we don't even know if he thought in those terms

 

* it's highly unlikely since hardly anyone in sports or entertainment or specifically pro wrestling does

 

* is there any indication that Kobashi think long term in anything he's done in his career

 

I suspect it's more likely that Kobashi would have been closer to Flair: he can only be KENTA KOBASHI~!, can only work one way, even if Misawa tried to get him into the comedy match he'd still tell people to drop him on his head or dust off the moonsault or something else stupid.

 

Yeah... I'm jaded. :/ But I don't think there's anything more sad about Kenta than say Ricky Morton still working as much as he can to try to make some cash since he didn't save any he made and pretty much has little else he can do in his life. And I'm far from the Morton Mark that most folks are: he's just the first name I could think of.

[Johnny Sorrow]

I'm watching Will's Dusty comp and I'm at the WWF stage. Holy fuck, Brother Love was just the worst thing ever. Around this time I was at a point where I only watched wrestling every now and then and it was usually WCW because I hated the Ultimate Warrior and anytime I saw Brother Love I'd have to turn it off. WCW also had Clash shows and Saturday Nights.

 

Brother Love didn't make any sense on top of being fucking annoying. Why would the WWF have a fake evangelist do an interview show? Why does he paint his face red? What's the fucking point with this character? God, I almost fast forwarded the fucking dvd.

[Slasher]

In theory and if done right, a televangelist gimmick is just about one of the most logical choices to host an interview segment. Prichard just sucked and the character sorta fails.

[Strummer]

It was a take on the crooked evangelist scandals from the 80s (Swaggart, Bakker). They tended to sweat and get red faced while preaching/crying which was why Prichard wore the embellished red makeup. Plus the color fit in with the love/heart theme. Even if you hated it you have to admit Prichard really commited to the gimmick. Folllowing the 90 year book it's pretty remarkable how much air time he had at that time. He was probably featured too much. Obviously Vince fell in love with the gimmick

[Loss]

I think Brother Love was awesome, except for the time he was the announcer for an MSG show and called THE ENTIRE SHOW in his Brother Love voice.

[Cross Face Chicken Wing]

I'm finishing Will's Buddy Rose comp and Don Owen absolutely cracks me up. Every month he gets mad at two wrestlers for having too good of a feud! He comes in the ring or to the interview stand and basically hollers (with plenty of stuttering and stammering) that he's sick of Wrestler A and Wrestler B (usually Buddy Rose) fighting all the time and that this next match will be the last match between these two so he can get back to regular business.

 

I know Owen was just trying to hype things as a legit sport, but I wonder if anyone in the audience ever wondered why Owen got so mad that Wrestler A and Wrestler B (usually Buddy Rose) were having such a great feud and generating interest in his product.

[Dylan Waco]

My favorite Don Owen thing was when he would complain about loser leaves town matches, because he couldn't afford to keep flying in new talent all the time.

[El-P]

I think Brother Love was awesome, except for the time he was the announcer for an MSG show and called THE ENTIRE SHOW in his Brother Love voice.

Yep, I loved Brother Love too. So slimmy.

[Marty]

I think Brother Love was awesome, except for the time he was the announcer for an MSG show and called THE ENTIRE SHOW in his Brother Love voice.

First time I saw Brother Love, I got completely worked. I was 10 and had turned on a WWF show (I think it was the one shown Saturday afternoons on the Kingston, Ontario station), was a little late and missed the opening montage. Anyways, first thing I see is this overweight, annoying preacher yelling about love and such and I'm thinking that the station dropped the WWF from its programming for some religious show. I channel flip, then flip back and see Ted DiBiase by his side and think, "Damn..."

 

He was annoying, but it made the times he got his comeuppance so satisfying. I still remember him being beat down on separate occasions by the Warrior and the Boss Man fondly. I also liked his heel ref work in matches such as the Harts-Rougeaus ones. And Undertaker early on came across as a scary mofo with Brother Love by his side.

[Cross Face Chicken Wing]

I've got a $25 Barnes and Noble gift card burning a hole in my pocket. It's been a while since I've read a wrestling book. I've already got the book on Montreal wrestling pre-ordered. Any other recommendations for wrestling books that have come out in the last couple of years?

 

Edit:

 

I'll be more specific. Are these any good?

 

The Pro Wrestling Hall of Fame: The Heels by Greg Oliver

Andre the Giant bio by Michael Krugman

Larry Zbyszko's autobiography

Shooters: The Toughest Men in Professional Wrestling by Jonathan Snowden

Legends of Pro Wrestling by Tim Hornbaker

[PeteF3]

Also, as for why Brother Love was given the time of day by the WWF (kayfabe-wise), it was revealed in an early segment that Ted DiBiase was paying for his air time.

 

Chalk me up as another one who found Love to be "beat him up" annoying rather than channel-changing annoying. He got me to pay attention each week hoping a babyface would kick his ass (or, at the least, something exciting would happen even if it was someone kicking the babyface's ass).

[Blehschmidt]

Watching Terry and Dory vs Steamboat and Youngblood from All Japan '82, and I have a question.

 

Why is Lou Thesz referee'ing and what the fuck is up with that horrible shirt!

[JerryvonKramer]

So was Ted religious even back in 1989?

[Loss]

A super greedy crony capitalist financing a corrupt televangelist is pretty timely for the 80s.