joeg Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 How much footage does WWE have in their climate controlled vault that has yet to be released? I've heard one estimate at over 100,000 hours worth of TV dating back to the 30s... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky Jackson Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I think I'm really going to like the list that has Gorgeous George at number 5 You are clearly a person of surpassing taste and quality. I will wear my new avatar with pride. George gets big points from me for basically inventing the act that gave us Flair, and to a lesser extent Bockwinkel, and hence all of their imitators. Every time I see a George match I see a spot I wish someone would steal today. Plus I once saw him hit the mother of all piledrivers on some match on ESPN Classic back in the 90s I haven't been able to find since. Amazing worker who would have gotten over any place, any time. That's a pretty compelling argument in a tiny paragraph, actually. Not the sort of direction I'd go, but you pass the gauntlet. I had George at 94 I think. I'm not going to claim that he has a ton of great matches on tape or whatever, but his peak as a draw and household name was HUGE, basically the biggest wrestling star between Londos in the 30s and Hogan in the 80s and surely one of the top 10 stars ever. Also hugely influential as Lee pointed out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Jerry Lynn is my #92, and with all the TNA stuff that adds up, he would have been higher. He had his flaws, but who doesn't. Had so many good to excellent matches with so many people and was smarter than it seems when you just don't pay attention. Terrific worker. I know Gino Hernandez has been helped a lot by NWAClassics it seems, which I don't watch, but man his work in WCCW was the shit. I guess he was already too cocked up by then.Dick Slater, I dunno. My favourite feud part of his career his Mid-South with Dark Journey. Never struck me as better than solid at best, and the Terry Funk obsession was actively distracting at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 The irony in Solar dropping so far from 2006 is that the amount of Solar footage that's surfaced in the last ten years dwarfs what little we had of him in '06. So much for the credo that footage changes everything. Yeah, that is interesting. Footage showing up is nice. But if no ones watching it, well... Exactly the same reason why joshi does badly now. The footage is over there, but no one's watching anymore. I'm guilty of it as much as anyone both for lucha and joshi BTW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rah Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 How much is also down to people becoming more apathetic to Solar as more matches of his made tape? I'm not making that argument for my own tastes, but it's a lot easier to infer a wrestler as world class when one or two elite matches (or performances) drop. Lest we also forget 2005/2006 Solar is not close to Solar of 2016. He's definitely slowed down quite a bit in the last couple years. Bias be what it be, and all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conker8 Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Solar I think I knew I was overrating in some respect, although I think I went in to the project with the idea that I would weigh peak and exceptional performance over longevity (except in rare circumstance). I think Solar had one of the best matches of the 90s, so he ends up higher than others. He also has one of the best trios match of the 80's against Los Exoticos. With Lizmark, Solar and Jon Cortez are the three wrestlers to pop up so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotJayTabb Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 My guys seems to be dropping like flies (18), and I'm the highest vote on 7 of them, which is a bit of a surprise. 24 - Kevin Von Erich (HV) - 258 39 - Fritz von Erich (HV) - 373 44 - Ernie Ladd (HV) - 251 46 - Jeff Jarrett (HV) - 243 67 - Super Delfin - 354 70 - Steve Veidor (HV) - 429 72 - Super Dragon - 228 73 - Tom Zenk (HV) - 472 76 - Doug Williams - 363 82 - Zack Sabre Jr (327) 86 - Pat Roach - 431 89 - The Barbarian - 393 90 - Batista - 241 91 - James Mason (HV) - 517 94 - Terry Taylor - 268 96 - Ikuto Hidaka - 446 97 - Adrian Street - 291 98 - Alex Shelley - 344 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Russian Daydream Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I think it's weird to rank people on your own list when you don't actually like their work, but because you want to acknowledge that they did well for other people. The concept of approaching objectivity when ranking wrestlers turns me off like discussion about who was a draw in regards to a WON Hall of Fame ballot. Brian Kendrick getting a #9 vote because someone loves the fuck out of some Kendrick is way more exciting and joyful to me, than someone ranking Triple H because he did well in da biz despite not really floating their boat. That being said, my line of thought leads to weird shit like this: I fucking hated Jerry Lynn because I thought it was lame everyone was calling him the New F'n Show when The Whole F'n Show was more than enough F'n Show, and of course I thought Rob Van Dam was like the best dude in the world at the time. I won't even go back and watch his shit because I'm like "Not as good as Van Dam." and I'm not even a big Van Dam mark any more. This is somewhat similar to why I didn't vote for Super Crazy because of Tajiri allegiances in a fake wrestling feud. I picked a side, man. I can't go back. I felt there was a distinction to be made between greatest wrestler and favourite wrestler. If we were doing a poll of 'Greatest Painter Ever', I would have to rank Turner on my list, even though I would never hang one of his pictures in my house - they seem so dreary to me. He was obviously a skilful and very influential artist though. To me, feeling that HHH should rank on our list is a bit like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Waco Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 My counter to that is that I don't think HHH is particularly skillful, and I don't think he's an influential worker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 The sledgehammer is one for the ages. Stupidest foreign object ever, and they still haven't figure it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Russian Daydream Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Abdullah my number 100 gone now. I quite wanted him to rank higher, but just couldn't do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Russian Daydream Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 My counter to that is that I don't think HHH is particularly skillful, and I don't think he's an influential worker. I think he is, within the confines of the type of wrestling that he represents. For me, enough to earn him a spot in the top 100. I'm not trying to argue he should be anywhere near number 1 by the way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSR Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I don't know. Feels like the elites looking down on the commoners to me to separate it. But if people want to do it ... And this was my primary reason for dropping out of the project, that some of us 'weren't deemed worth enough' to contribute in this process. Nice to see Cortez do well(ish); he would've been third on my WOS guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El McKell Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I don't know. Feels like the elites looking down on the commoners to me to separate it. But if people want to do it ... And this was my primary reason for dropping out of the project, that some of us 'weren't deemed worth enough' to contribute in this process. Who deemed some of us not worth enough? Certainly not Stephen who was organizing it and encouraging as many people as possible to vote, going as far to start the thread: 'Everyone should submit a ballot'. If there were one or two people who thought that some people hadn't seen enough to contribute I don't see why a couple of naysayers should stop you from contributing a ballot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I don't think anyone has had that position in quite some time, there was a real drive to encourage voting across all the shows -- we pushed it reasonably hard on the first one, WTBBP, which was about a month before deadline -- and on here, and on Twitter, and the pay off was 152 voters. I think I recall saying specifically something along the lines of: "it doesn't matter what you've seen or haven't seen, everyone has blind spots, if you care about wrestling just get a ballot in" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoS Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I guess I shouldn't be too angry at people who don't like Hunter but voted for him in the top 100 bevause they thought he deserved it objectively. I fucking hate Shawn Michaels and his stupid face, and I still put him on my ballot for the exact same reason. That said, fuck Triple H. I can't think of a single wrestler who has disappointed as many times as he has in important main egents and on big shows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Russian Daydream Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I don't know. Feels like the elites looking down on the commoners to me to separate it. But if people want to do it ... And this was my primary reason for dropping out of the project, that some of us 'weren't deemed worth enough' to contribute in this process. Nice to see Cortez do well(ish); he would've been third on my WOS guys. That was a concern of mine too. I only joined here last September and did worry that I hadn't 'proven' myself worthy of submitting a ballot which was taken seriously. In the end, after reading Stephen's thread and Parv's BIGLAV system provided me with a basis to form my rankings, I did submit a list. Now that the results are coming out, I'm really glad I did. I've really enjoyed seeing the list unfold and reading people's justifications of their picks. Largely, the diversity of people's opinions have been celebrated too. We can see also, that one or two eccentric high rankings do not affect the big picture unduely. By having so many ballots returned, I think, will make the top 100 a really robust list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotJayTabb Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Yeah, I felt unsure when I first registered last July, but the "Everybody Should Submit A Ballot" thread reassured me. I worked on the principle that anyone able to discuss wrestling on here would know/care enough about wrestling to submit a ballot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Man - if I am not even the high vote on Porky, I severely doubt I'm the high vote on anyone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackwebb Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Hard to decide who looks more like unfrozen caveman lawyer in their picture. Buzz Sawyer or Raven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoS Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I am curious about how Bruno ranks. I didn't vote for him in the end, but I strongly considered it, and while I did not take drawing ability into context, as far as drawing a huge number at the same arena week after week for decades go, he has to be amongst the top, if not at the very top. Lawler and The Sheik are the only other ones I can think of with the same consistency and longevity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 RVD : "Hey, sorry I got so high." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Cooke Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I actually thought Gotch was one of the better picks in that glut of votes. You'd think the workers would be getting better as we approach the top 200 but that was some rut. The irony in Solar dropping so far from 2006 is that the amount of Solar footage that's surfaced in the last ten years dwarfs what little we had of him in '06. So much for the credo that footage changes everything. Also an unwillingness from people to pay for footage. BT Jr. tapes at least 1 Solar match a month (usually more), so they are all out there and he isn't charging Jeff Lynch prices (nothing against Lynch but he can be expensive). Back in mid 2000's, if Fredo got one lucha TV (usually IWRG) a year with a Solar match on it, it was considered a big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingedEagle Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Can we get a text list of the rankings in one post? Would be great to have as an easy reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I hate the idea of RVD so high. I love the idea of the pictures: Super Porky squishing RVD and then Buddy celebrating about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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