AEW TV 11/23 - 11/25

[Embrodak]

On 11/24/2022 at 7:09 PM, ragemaster said:

Its Tony company, if they ran it by him and he said it's cool, go for it then it's on him. If they just did it off their own backs, then Tony needs to toughen up and lay down the law.

Personally, I found it funny, and punk did piss on the company and wrestlers in the press conference.  Then he started a backstage fight, so I can see the Bucks and Kenny saying a big fuck you to him.

The best thing would be for this to be a start to an elaborate angle and for punk to come back and join FTR to feud against the Elite for business. 

Tony is a fucking mark, I don’t care if he approved it. At this point, AEW is as much or more an indictment of the people advising him as it is a wrestling promotion.

[Embrodak]

21 hours ago, Johnny Sorrow said:

This idea that Danielson "owes" anybody anything is as fucking stupid as biting an arm to pop Brandon Cutler.

The notion that we owe Danielson anything if he doesn’t actually value or care to protect the elevation he’s experienced on the industry is far more stupid.

[C.S.]

Kenny and Bucks doing their wink-wink-nudge-nudge shooty-shoot bullshit would still irritate people no matter what because The Elite is always going to have Cornette cucks against them sucking on Blue Chew and babbling about outlaw mudshows (just to be clear, I don't mean anyone on PWO), but it would be far less of a distraction and talking point if Kenny didn't hypocritically and disingenuously try to present himself as a peacemaker (not the Cena character) just the day before. 

I'm in the "fuck what Bryan Danielson wants" camp. If I'm Tony, I don't give a shit what he wants. He should care what the fans want, and that's to see Danielson in meaningful main event situations.

[Dav'oh]

2 hours ago, C.S. said:

If I'm Tony, I don't give a shit what (Danielson) wants.

You think Bryan signs with AEW in the first place if Tony has that attitude? Truly?

[Johnny Sorrow]

3 hours ago, Embrodak said:

The notion that we owe Danielson anything if he doesn’t actually value or care to protect the elevation he’s experienced on the industry is far more stupid.

Are you serious? The man has destroyed his body for this stupid business and has already reached the tippy top. Now, he apparently wants to end this career having the matches he wants and making young performers.

Holy shit, really? Like, are people imagining scenarios where Khan is begging Danielson to be the champ and he's saying no, because he's being selfish by not being selfish? 
That's some wild shit. 

[Gramsci]

I think we are arguing two different things, what Bryan Danielson thinks about his booking doesn't matter at all if we are trying to discuss how he's been booked. The interesting thing for me is if Bryan's booking has been good or bad, not if he's happy or not with the way he's been booked. 

I don't care at all if he wants this or that, I pay to watch AEW every week and as a Bryan fan that I've been for more than 15 years I can say that he is in one of the most uninteresting stages of his career, which is frustrating cause he was having one of the best runs ever from September to January (or January’21 to January’22 if we count those months in WWE). He is not as over as he should be with the crowd, and the ratings in his segments hasn’t been as good as they were in 2021, when he was undefeated and one of the main focuses of the product. Those are good metrics to extrapolate that he hasn't been booked like he should be. He also looks like 5 years older; I don’t know what happened to him.

We must also consider that Bryan is a troll. Yeah, in this interview he says that he wants to wrestle with younger wrestlers and all that, but in another interview two months ago he said that what he likes the most is being in World title matches, and when he has been asked about matches and stuff he wants to do, he always names other wrestlers like Okada, Tanahashi, Omega, Shibata, FTR, Bucks, CM Punk + G1 + Apuestas match… So, he is obviously interested in the BIG stuff too.

I don’t think some of us are asking for him to be the world champ (although, TK would be stupid not to attach Bryan’s name to the world title lineage), but to have a similar run like he had at the start of his AEW career, when he was booked as a killer and every match was like a gift, like the Bryan vs. Dax match that we are getting next Wednesday feels like a gift.

All things considered, I don’t think his booking is that bad, he has been booked better than he was in the WWE, and there’s a lot of good things to enjoy in his 2022, and I’m sure that 10 years from now, when we’ll do some of this projects we like to do, there will be a large catalogue of awesome matches for AEW in 2022, with Danielson being part of a lot of them. 

[Embrodak]

4 hours ago, Johnny Sorrow said:

Are you serious? The man has destroyed his body for this stupid business and has already reached the tippy top. Now, he apparently wants to end this career having the matches he wants and making young performers.

Holy shit, really? Like, are people imagining scenarios where Khan is begging Danielson to be the champ and he's saying no, because he's being selfish by not being selfish? 
That's some wild shit. 

He’s not “making” younger performers if the context of the matches he’s having with them is not some compelling angle. He had what was regarded as a pretty good match with Daniel Garcia a few months ago or whenever, yet in the light of subsequent history, it’s basically one component of an asinine angle where Garcia is experiencing internal anguish over whether or not he’s “a wrestler” or “a sports entertainer”. (An angle that didn’t even resolve satisfyingly on its own inane terms, by the way!)

I’m frankly not sure what about this is so outrageous to you. If it was just a case of him falling victim to the time between Tony running out of his Adderall and when he refills the prescription, alright, he wouldn’t be the first person let down by the scattershot booking. If after he felt nothing in the WM main event he went “Hey, I’m not the young, wrestling-obsessed guy I once was” and just retired to a life of occasional appearances at indie shows, I could totally respect that. But if he’s at a place in his life where he doesn’t value the place of prominence he’s obtained in the industry, doesn’t care whether he’s booked in a compelling way or not, and doesn’t fight to contribute as much as his star power and name recognition has to contribute to this still-young, upstart company struggling with the wrestling equivalent of the sophomore slump? To have been in the main event of Wrestlemania and not stand up to Jericho’s self-indulgent bullshit when you’re involved with him on television? Good on him for getting his bag, but I’m not sure what I’m supposed to be respectful or supportive of in that. I’m sure there’s a portion of his fan base totally happy with him fucking around on Dark and having dream matches of 8 years ago with over the hill New Japan guys, but I ain’t in it.

[Dav'oh]

In all sincerity, have any of you ever contacted Messrs Danielson & Khan regarding your concerns?

If "yes", could you share their responses with us?

[El-P]

As Spinoza said (well, KINDA SORTA, you know) : you think you judge something as good and that's why you like it, whereas infact, you first like something therefore you judge it to be good.

[Sean Reedy]

To me the problem is that Bryan isn't actually making anyone. If he was 1994 ECW Terry Funk, not the champ but making pivotal new stars, I think everyone would be fine. But he's more like WCW Bret Hart.

Somehow the narrative has become - Bryan experiences personal happiness and works meaningless matches that don't help the company. Or he's miserably forced to have the company built around him. He needs to be consequential to make new stars, you can't make stars if the fans don't see you as a big star anymore. If 1994 Terry Funk was battling it out and losing to Hack Meyers on TV he wouldn't have elevated anyone.

[Migs]

I think they're trying to use Danielson to make younger guys, but the booking of those young guys has been unfocused. Between the last two PPVs, Dragon's program mainly related to Daniel Garcia who... wasn't on the PPV. Now, that's not a total indictment of the time use - we'll see where Garcia ends up down the road - but it certainly makes it hard to judge whether this use of Danielson is fruitful.

[Embrodak]

I mean if Bryan Danielson was having feuds like Punk’s with Kingston with, say, Powerhouse Hobbs, or Ricky Starks, or Swerve, or Takeshita, or even Garcia (in a world where he wasn’t drowning in Jericho bullshit), I don’t think anybody would have an issue with that. If Danielson doesn’t want or care about the title, that’s fine, but I would 10000x rather he tell Ricky Starks that he’s gonna kick his smartass head in than see him wrestle Shibata on Rampage or YouTube.

[Dale Wolfe]

I think it is a waste of him in the current role personally but if you're going to let him run around as effectively a slumming mid-carder at least stick the TV title on him and treat him like 1993/94 Regal or 1995 Arn. 

It does feel a bit like early 90s WCW at the moment to be fair 

[Dale Wolfe]

That sounds negative but it isn't, i love mid-90s WCW. But it is a bit aimless

[El-P]

I would have said rather late 1998 WCW. Which... is not as positive (despite me loving some of the stuff still, obviously).

The elephant in the room is ROH. Either TK can get the ROH stuff its own show and they can focus on this over there (won't mean I'll watch it though, Rampage is such an afterthought already) either this needs to be downplayed big time anyway on the AEW TV. Of course the injuries and drama have hurt the booking a lot, but if I can pinpoint a moment where things really got unfocused, it's when ROH stuff began taking way too much space in a company that already had trouble making all its titles important (and that was before the All Pacific even existed). There was a FTR vs Top Flight match in Rampage for the ROH titles, and it was just there, not even that good really. Then Athena cut that scathing promo on Mercedes Martinez, the ROH woman champion, like there was some actual issue there, when in fact no one cares about that title and Martinez has never been over the rare time she's been on TV. And don't get me started on the Gates of Agony or something. Buying the ROH library was cool and all. The first ROH PPV was cool. But to me it has really diluted the product and distracted the booking, which was never the most focused to begin with. 

[C.S.]

@Gramsci, @Embrodak, @Sean Reedy, and others summed up my feelings on Bryan perfectly.

12 hours ago, Dav'oh said:

You think Bryan signs with AEW in the first place if Tony has that attitude? Truly?

He did sign, so this is an irrelevant question.

6 hours ago, Dav'oh said:

In all sincerity, have any of you ever contacted Messrs Danielson & Khan regarding your concerns?

If "yes", could you share their responses with us?

Congrats for posting one of the most intellectually dishonest and downright pointless comments I've ever seen on PWO. 

[Timbo Slice]

The amount of concern trolling here on all sides about Danielson is insane. 

[Childs]

25 minutes ago, Timbo Slice said:

The amount of concern trolling here on all sides about Danielson is insane. 

My thought exactly. Danielson is the No. 1 reason I watch AEW. Have I been frustrated at times with the lack of follow through on his feuds or the losses he's eaten to the likes of Jericho? Sure. But he has still given us a lot of excellent work this year despite losing two months to the concussion. He's almost 25 years into his career and still performing at a level matched by few wrestlers in the world. I just can't muster any outrage over that.

[Matt D]

But let's have him face Rush in the next month or two. Just saying.

[KawadaSmile]

I think "Bryan Danielson should have some freedom to work the programs he wants, but TK should start having some common sense and begin putting him in programs which are actually engaging and interesting" is a healthy camp to be in, bubbas.

 

With that said gimme Bryan vs Preston Vance.

[Dav'oh]

6 hours ago, C.S. said:

19 hours ago, Dav'oh said:

You think Bryan signs with AEW in the first place if Tony has that attitude? Truly?

He did sign, so this is an irrelevant question.

I was responding to your massively relevant "If I'm Tony K" comment. Clearly, I should've said, "Well, you're not so fuck off". I will do better in the future.

 

6 hours ago, C.S. said:

Congrats for posting one of the most intellectually dishonest and downright pointless comments I've ever seen on PWO

As pointless as the rest of this discussion? Or as pointless as your 7,900+ posts ("If I'm Tony K" lol. Real fucking pointy). As dishonest as you using "if", then shutting down a continuation of your "if"?

I'm naive, yes. I'm romantic, yes. It's still real to me, yes. I'm never "intellectually dishonest".

DB's on Twitter. People are talking, here, about Bryan breaking some unspoken contract. Betrayal. Violation of some sacred bond between performer and audience or something.

This thread is full of jilted lovers. I assume some of the aggrieved parties partake of social media. One poor guy was nearly having a meltdown, others are angry and feel they are owed something - you've read them. Why the fuck wouldn't people this passionate air their grievances with this bounder who's gallivanting around Dark and breaking their hearts, when he's right fucking there, on the social medias.

No dishonesty. Just wondering if even one person has let Daniel know how they feel instead of flogging a dead horse for pages and pages here. Pointlessly.

[C.S.]

6 minutes ago, Dav'oh said:

I was responding to your massively relevant "If I'm Tony K" comment. Clearly, I should've said, "Well, you're not so fuck off". I will do better in the future

Aren't you an classy person. 

6 minutes ago, Dav'oh said:

As pointless as the rest of this discussion? Or as pointless as your 7,900+ posts ("If I'm Tony K" lol. Real fucking pointy). As dishonest as you using "if", then shutting down a continuation of your "if"?

I'm naive, yes. I'm romantic, yes. It's still real to me, yes. I'm never "intellectually dishonest".

DB's on Twitter. People are talking, here, about Bryan breaking some unspoken contract. Betrayal. Violation of some sacred bond between performer and audience or something.

This thread is full of jilted lovers. I assume some of the aggrieved parties partake of social media. One poor guy was nearly having a meltdown, others are angry and feel they are owed something - you've read them. Why the fuck wouldn't people this passionate air their grievances with this bounder who's gallivanting around Dark and breaking their hearts, when he's right fucking there, on the social medias.

No dishonesty. Just wondering if even one person has let Daniel know how they feel instead of flogging a dead horse for pages and pages here. Pointlessly.

No idea how many posts I have here, nor do I care, but you sound like a fucking goober using that as a talking point against me. In your immortal words, fuck off!

The rest of your post - I have no idea what's going on or how many blunts you smoked before posting it. Jilted lovers?! WTF are you babbling about??? 

 As for "flogging a dead horse here," in case no one clued you in, this is a fucking wrestling discussion board. That means we discuss wrestling here, at length. Maybe you need 7900+ posts (like I supposedly have) to figure that one out.

[Dav'oh]

Well, that was a whole lot of nothing which side-stepped all my questions in  favour of "how high are you bro? You goober".

"A talking point against me"? A bit overly defensive, there, C.S. It was a comparative question, responding to your superlative. As in, you said my post was the most pointless (like most unique, hey?). I asked if it was as pointless as any of yours (and gave an example). Your evasiveness makes me think the answer is "yes".

I'd never use 7.9k posts against someone. I think it's great and I look forward to more.

Now, if someone could explain why it's ridiculous to ask why no-one's actually addressing the source of their grief, when they're easily accessible on the social medias, that'd be swell...

[Dav'oh]

31 minutes ago, C.S. said:

how many blunts you smoked before posting it

*for the record, about 30 bowls 

[C.S.]

5 minutes ago, Dav'oh said:

Well, that was a whole lot of nothing which side-stepped all my questions in  favour of "how high are you bro? You goober".

Because, quite simply, you mentioned a ton of other posts and posters. I have no desire to speak for anyone else. 

5 minutes ago, Dav'oh said:

"A talking point against me"? A bit overly defensive, there, C.S. It was a comparative question, responding to your superlative. As in, you said my post was the most pointless (like most unique, hey?). I asked if it was as pointless as any of yours (and gave an example). Your evasiveness makes me think the answer is "yes".

I'd never use 7.9k posts against someone. I think it's great and I look forward to more.

Not defensive at all. I just don't understand the point of you comparing our respective posting histories. If I said "I have 79k posts (or whatever the number is) and that makes me better/smarter/more knowledgeable/more well-endowed/etc. than you," then you'd have a point. As it stands, only you know or care how many times I've posted here. Maybe I'm missing your point? Obviously I am.

8 minutes ago, Dav'oh said:

Now, if someone could explain why it's ridiculous to ask why no-one's actually addressing the source of their grief, when they're easily accessible on the social medias, that'd be swell...

Because we both know Bryan and/or TK aren't going to see any of those posts, but a bunch of neckbeard fans on Twitter might. I'd rather take my chances with you.

4 minutes ago, Dav'oh said:

*for the record, about 30 bowls 

Haha!

Look, I'm sorry if we got off on the wrong foot. No hard feelings, I hope.

Sami and Roman are on another level. (Wrong thread, I know, but I'm watching Survivor Series right now.)