Dave Meltzer stuff

[El-P]

Did that story even come out BEFORE Steph became a TV character?

Thats' a good point. I don't think so. All of a sudden, Steph is sluting it up a notch on TV, Savage seems to be backballed and the rumours that he fucked her just appear from nowhere. Fantaisies.

[Jesse Ewiak]

Did that story even come out BEFORE Steph became a TV character? I seem to remember it popping up around the time that there were rumors of Savage going to WWF and then that rumor coming out that he and HHH had heat because maybe Savage had Stephanie first.

To be fair, why would it come up before Steph was a character? Meltzer in '93 wasn't the type to print completely unfounded rumors, especially about the underage daughter of Vince, and it was the days before enough people with knowledge could spread rumors around on the Internet. So, assuming it did happen, it slowly percolates through the wrestling rumor chain and eventually enough people hear it 14th hand that somebody posts it in the sleaze thread. Assuming of course, there's any truth to it at all.

[cm funk]

Not to turn this into the sleaze thread...

 

I never get where the "Randy was a predator who took advantage of an underage girl" angle people put on the rumor came from. Firstly, 16 is the age of consent in Connecticut. But she turned 18 in September 1994. His last appearance for the WWF was in October 94. So even if you go by the general all-purpose "18 is legal" definition, there was a window there where it could have happened. Plus, if it did happen, who's to say she didn't pursue Randy and not the other way around. Maybe she'd had a crush on him since she was a little girl and finally did something about it? And if you believe some of the stories about her, she wasn't exactly innocent in high school.

 

I don't remember when I first read the rumor but it was definitely after Steph and HHH were an item. The timeline of it being rumored before Steph was a character and HHH being jealous/mad towards Savage doesn't make any sense because she was a character on tv for a while (early 99 she debuted) before even being put with Hunter....while Hunter was still an item with Chyna, and it wasn't for months after they'd been an on-screen couple that the rumors about them started.

 

Anyway, none of this matters because unless Stephanie publicly admits it happened we're never going to know the truth

[Jimmy Redman]

Not to turn this into the sleaze thread...

 

I never get where the "Randy was a predator who took advantage of an underage girl" angle people put on the rumor came from. Firstly, 16 is the age of consent in Connecticut. But she turned 18 in September 1994. His last appearance for the WWF was in October 94. So even if you go by the general all-purpose "18 is legal" definition, there was a window there where it could have happened. Plus, if it did happen, who's to say she didn't pursue Randy and not the other way around. Maybe she'd had a crush on him since she was a little girl and finally did something about it? And if you believe some of the stories about her, she wasn't exactly innocent in high school.

Unless she hatched some plot to restrain him and force herself upon him, I'm pretty sure that he still would have had some agency in the matter even if she was the one pursuing him.

[Steven]

Why was Dave bitching about how Cena runs? Seems like an odd thing to pick at. Especially when you have Kofi out there loosely holding on to Orton to "restrain" him and giving him a light shove to prevent him from getting away. Orton looked like he accidently bumped into an old lady outside of the ring.

[Loss]

Dave has been talking about how wrestlers run since the 80s.

[Sean Liska]

He used to calculate the amount of time it took for people to run to the ring at the Rumble and then list them in order in the Observer.

[Log]

That's hilarious! ^

 

Cena does run funny. Also, he wears his kneepads eeeeeverywhere.

[sek69]

Dave has been talking about how wrestlers run since the 80s.

 

I always thought it was his passive-aggressive way of pointing out big jacked up and/or roid guys tend to look silly when they run.

[cheapshot]

Dave has been talking about how wrestlers run since the 80s.

 

I always thought it was his passive-aggressive way of pointing out big jacked up and/or roid guys tend to look silly when they run.

 

 

That was my take on it as well. They do look silly though don't they!

[KrisZ]

--While a contract itself may not have been signed, and it is something that has been talked about for months, Sting in WWE is stronger than ever to the point concepts using the term "A Man Called Sting" are in discussion.

I've been saying for months he should be a surprise in the Rumble and I hope it comes to pass

[Dylan Waco]

Only if he can come out to the babyface Sting in WCW theme music.

[shoe]

It's pretty awesome when Dave and Austin are just marking out about Mid-South, while Alvarez just there quietly.

[goodhelmet]

I actually kind of admire that. Don't shoot your mouth off on something you are completely ignorant on. When we did the WWE Network show with mookieghana, I had no idea what Bix and mookie and Keith were going on about. Best just to keep your mouth shut.

[cheapshot]

Is it me, or does Alvarez not do research before doing a show? I like the guy as a person, but he seems to be getting worse and worse recently on his radio shows.

[goodhelmet]

I was listening to the Lance Storm show and I agree with Lance on one thing for sure... WWE has lost any attempts at subtlety and it hurts their product.

[Dylan Waco]

You were listening to the lance storm show?

[goodhelmet]

Heh... the show Alvarez does with Lance Storm.

[shoe]

I actually kind of admire that. Don't shoot your mouth off on something you are completely ignorant on. When we did the WWE Network show with mookieghana, I had no idea what Bix and mookie and Keith were going on about. Best just to keep your mouth shut.

 

You also don't make a living being a wrestling writer. I don't expect him to be an expert.I expect him to be able to discuss it though.

[WrestlingPower]

I hate to say it but I have to side with Bryan in this 30 minute debate on Danielson's push. For "not defending the company's position", Meltzer sure is passionate in his arguments behind why Bryan isn't enough of a draw to be pushed harder and until he moves #s they have no reason to treat him differently. This debate is quite the piece of audio though.

[evilclown]

I hate to say it but I have to side with Bryan in this 30 minute debate on Danielson's push. For "not defending the company's position", Meltzer sure is passionate in his arguments behind why Bryan isn't enough of a draw to be pushed harder and until he moves #s they have no reason to treat him differently. This debate is quite the piece of audio though.

Dave discussing the numbers like they exist in a vacuum is kind of amazing. The numbers are the last chapter in a long book. The real story is found in everything that came first. Is Danielson not moving merchandise and ratings, despite being the crowd favorite? It might be worth exploring WHY that's the case. That it is the case is really just skimming the surface on the issue.

[kjh]

I can understand WWE's position (they've invested seven figures into Batista's return and on the first night he drew a big rating, so under normal circumstances you don't change course, especially when it would mess up your WrestleMania plans), but clearly they scored a major own goal last night.

[Dylan Waco]

One thing that is key, is that the surprise of Batista returning being blown, compounded the problem dramatically

[Cox]

I can understand WWE's position (they've invested seven figures into Batista's return and on the first night he drew a big rating, so under normal circumstances you don't change course, especially when it would mess up your WrestleMania plans), but clearly they scored a major own goal last night.

It's easy for Batista to move numbers when he hasn't been around week to week (or at all, really) in many years. What will the numbers with Batista look like after he's been around 4-5 weeks? I understand that once Batista's return drew a huge number that it meant that WWE was going to lock into their Wrestlemania plans, Daniel Bryan be damned, but using that as their primary reason to continue Batista's push without a larger sample size just shows confirmation bias on their end.

[shawmic]

Last nights Dave & Bryan show was fascinating...

 

How can you say people don't pay money to see Bryan when an entire sold out crowd at their number 2 PPV of the year PAID to see him win and wouldn't accept anything else?

 

Last month at MSG the advertising for the next house show had Bryan on it. Tickets went on sale during intermission. Last week they took him off MSG and put him on the Salt Lake City show with Orton. So if MSG does a big house, who gets the credit? This stuff happens all the time. People rarely even know who they are going to see at house shows because the talent scheduled changes every week.

 

The Jeff Hardy thing is a good argument but it's 6 years later. Money in the Bank with Punk, Rock's return at Survivor Series both bombed. The shows are going to do the same number give or take a small bump no matter what because the price is outrageous and the shows aren't good enough to justify it. Also, Hardy wasn't put down as a loser anywhere close to Bryan has been. The one thing they did to Hardy was when he beat HHH in the #1 contender's match it was a fluke and HHH got up and laughed at him. But it ended there. The music video they did for Hardy the Monday before the Rumble was one of the best they've ever done.

 

Bryan bringing up Orton was the perfect answer to every point Dave made. Orton isn't responsible for moving anything in terms of ratings, buys or merchandise that anyone can ever recall. But he is a chosen one, like the last 3 in the Rumble last night (Batista, Sheamus, Reigns) and the crowd threw up on them.

 

I've said this a hundred times this entire thing would have been avoided if they gave Bryan the belt for 2 months after SummerSlam. Orton could have won in October and it wouldn't mess up their plans. But they were set on trolling the internet for heel heat. Stephanie who is a HEEL doing the stupid chant for Batista on Monday with the big grin on her face just to troll people and then they are going to act like they didn't expect Batista to be booed out of the building last night.

 

And what difference does it make if Batista is in the title match at Mania or a big attraction match? He'd do the same ratings either way. Sell the same merchandise. The problem is he's a mark for himself and they had to promise him another title run to come back.